evolution has occurred - new species

Posted by eman on September 17, 1998 at 17:43:27:

In Reply to: How about this experiment... posted by Walker on April 27, 1998 at 13:18:49:

Evolution has been observed and not just the rise of minor changes but of whole new species. The rise of bonafide new species has been documented in such laboratory-reared species as the fruit fly, of which eight new species have been found. Also, six new species of other insects have been seen to form. In such free-living species as mice, a new species has emerged on the Faeroe Islands in the last 250 years. In recent years, scientists also have documented evolution of a new species of marine worm, called a polychate. And among plants, at least a dozen new species have been seen to arise over the last 50 years, including a new species of corn.

In the plant genus Tragopogon, two new species have evolved within the past 50-60 years. They are T. mirus and T. miscellus. The new species were formed when one diploid species fertilized a different diploid species and produced a tetraploid offspring. This tetraploid offspring could not fertilize or be fertilized by either of its two parent species types. It is reproductively isolated, the definition of a species. Digby (1912) crossed the primrose species Primula vertcillata and P. floribunda to produce a sterile hybrid. Polyploidization occurred in a few of these plants to produce fertile offspring. The new species was named P. kewensis.

The simple fact of all this is that the origin of new species by evolution has been observed, both in the laboratory and in the wild. See, for example, (Dobzhansky, T. and O. Pavlovsky. 1971. "Experimentally created incipient species of Drosophila." NATURE. 230:289-292) The "Observed Instances of Speciation" FAQ in the talk.origins archives (www.talkorigins.org/faqs) gives several additional examples.

Now lets examine the "alternate" theory, or Creation. If one were to believe the literal story of Noah's Ark, it seems unfeasible that Noah could have placed a pair of each of the 2,000,000 to 5,000,000 species of animal. He would also have had to include several plants that would have otherwise been destroyed by a flood. He supposedly loaded them all on the Ark in a 24 hour day, he would have to load, classify and store about 50 - 100 animals each second! If we are to believe that he only took certain "kinds" and not each and every species, the only possible way the surviving "kinds" could produce the diversity of species today, would be through evolution. Incidentally, when there are fewer than 20 members to a species, extinction is inevitable, even when massive human intervention occurs. After the flood, there would have been only 2 or 7 members (depending on which section in the Bible you agree with) to each species; they would not have survived. There is no indication of a worldwide flood in ancient Egyptian, Indus or Chinese writings, temples, pyramids, sculptures, etc., which existed at the time of Noah. Yet, if the flood really did occur, then all the world's early civilizations would have been wiped out. The entire population of the world would have consisted of 8 people, in the vicinity of the Ark. It would have taken millenia for humanity to become re-established inChina and elsewhere. The Egyptian "Old Kingdom" covered the era from 2649 BCE to 2134 BCE, the 3rd to the 8th dynasty. In particular, the fifth dynasty covered the interval 2465 to 2323 BCE, straddling the time of the flood. Why was that civilization allowed to somehow survive the Great Flood? Perhaps because it never really happened.

Sometimes I wonder why I spend so much time in these disputes...most "hardcore" Creationists are more than willing to discard any knowledge or evidence that runs against their precious dogma. Fortunately history has shown that the Bible survives because its interpreters have been able to adapt their interpretations of this book to synch with the advance in scientific knowledge. Remember Galileo and Copernicus? There are still passages in the Bible that imply a flat earth and that the sun revolves around the earth, but science has shown these ideas to be in error and today, I know of very few Christians who still believe such nonsense. So in closing all I've got to say is; Creationists...hang on to your mistaken beliefs as long as you please for history will show you are also greatly deceived.