Subject:

This is a fascinating story of a Mormon family recently accepting the fact the church is not what it claims and rescuing their son from a Mormon mission. Story told as it developed on the Recovery from Mormonism bulletin board. Updated June 2007
Part 1	My son is on a mission, I’ve just left the church…today
Part 2	The parents are flying out this evening to get their missionary son
Part 3 A	“Bright Eyes” the daughter at home writes while her parents are getting their son (her brother)
Part 3 B	The brother is coming home
Part 4	The Family Returns
Part 5	Stake Presidents Meeting
Part 6	The family - after a 1 week vacation

Subject:	My son is on a mission, I've just left the church...today...
Date:	May 24, 2007
Author:	A Musing Grace [her words are shaded in yellow]

He's been out for 7 months in a south eastern state. I have been going through a process of spiritual exploration the last couple of years and tried to make my new ideas fit with the church. I did a search a couple weeks ago for "metaphysical mormons." I discovered I'm not alone in my feelings and beliefs. I've also discovered that my conversion 27 years ago came without all the facts. I have since learned things about church history and doctrine I can't abide.

My husband isn't sure what to think, but supports my decision. He is going to take time to explore and rediscover what he believes and go through his own process. I feel really fortunate to have his acceptance and support when this can really tear a couple and family apart.

My younger children are reeling at being deceived and really finding out what is what in the history of the church. We have always been open in our ideas here and very frank with discussion. I'd never leave the church and not tell my kids why.

This has all happened in the last 24 hours. I'm on my way to buy gentile underwear. :-)

Soooo, I have a kid on a mission whose letters are becoming more "Zombie for the Lord" with each passing week. How being obedient is the only way to be blessed. How it's so hard, and his brain is in overload but he knows God will help him. Etc. Etc. He even hurt himself on his mission and told his grandma that God knew more about his knee than a doctor did and the priesthood blessing was the ultimate power. (I had to personally call the mission president to insist he be able to see a doctor after three weeks of emails of being in pain and having limited motion. He put up a fuss and pulled the church authority thing and even mentioned having him sent home - as a threat to put me in my place. I was like FINE, SEND MY BOY HOME.

Well, the knee isn't bad enough to come home.

All you RM's out there, all you parents with any thoughts about how we should approach my son.

I'd just love to have some feedback. Do I just sit tight and not rock his world and let him know what I've decided when he gets home? (That just doesn't seem right to me...) Do I tell him and share and totally destroy his mission experience? Do I view his mission as a cult activity and go and bring him home? Do I wait for him to come home and then deprogram him?

I have come to think of the missionary experience as a MLM thing. It's been around a long time. Who is joining Amway nowadays? Most people know what that is about. I feel the same about the church. People aren't falling for it like they used to. He's wasting his time. Do we just let him. He's there because of the things we erroneously taught him. Do we try to correct it now, when he is alone without support from balanced people?

Thank you friends.

A Musing Grace

Subject:	Welcome! So glad you found your way here.
Date:	May 24 21:33
Author:	Cheryl

New underwear? Already? Wow! I'm impressed.

Sit tight and think for a while about what to do about your son. For now, take care of your own needs and those of your husband and younger children.

You'll be able to know about your other question when the time is right.

I'm so proud of you for standing up for your son and seeing to his medical needs. That's your most important job on his behalf for now. Be sure he has the food, housing, medical care, and other physical necessities to be safe and healthy.

Worry about the brainwashing and other problems when you and he are more ready to face such a challenge.

Keep posting and know we care and we understand your struggles.

Subject:	I join Cheryl in welcoming you.....
Date:	May 24 21:41
Author:	wings

Glad to hear you found this place. It must be difficult to have your Son on a mission during this awakening.

Looking forward to hearing about your journey!

wings

Subject:	Re: I join Cheryl in welcoming you.....
Date:	May 25 03:41
Author:	A Musing Grace

I'm glad I found you too. It's such a weird and wonderful time right now. I've tied up 30 years in the church and am sort of just taking it a minute at a time.

I'm happy but I know there are some tough times ahead...like when my leaders find out what's going on here.

And then dealing with the mission issue and how to be honest and find the right timing.

Thanks for the welcome.

Subject:	You are in a difficult position.
Date:	May 24 21:52
Author:	racer

Welcome out of the Morg. I am glad your family is beginning to see the church for what it is.

The tricky part is your son. As an RM I know how hardcore and brainwashed missionaries can be. You have to realize that these guys are so indoctrinated if someone very close to them died (mother, father, siblings) they choose to stay out on the mission. The Mission Pres. encourages him to stay in the field and forget about the family and the funeral for now.

I had a comp whose Mom was not a member. In fact, she thought the church was a lying, manipulative, cult. Looking back on the situation I agree with her. She would plead for him to come home, or at least read the research about the church she would send him. He would always throw away the research and call it "anti-Mormon lies" without even examining it. He thought that Satan was using his Mom as a tool to thwart him on his mission.

You have to handle things with your mish very carefully. You don't want him to think you are all mislead by the devil and you are just a pawn in his plot to stop your son from "serving" the Lord.

I wish I had some advice, but handle this VERY carefully and patiently. Blood still shoots out of my eyes when I look back on my mission days and realize how manipulated and puppet like I was.

Subject:	Re: Welcome! So glad you found your way here.
Date:	May 25 03:09
Author:	A Musing Grace

Thank you Cheryl. It's been a wild couple of days.

I actually wanted to mention in my post that his last email stated that the "church" (Who in the heck is that anyway?!) is cutting his personal budget from $145 to $130 a month. I was livid. It's not like groceries are getting cheaper. In his first area he had to live on $130 and said, "You can't eat very nice on that." So we're sending extra money.

We send $400 a month for his mission. Not to mention thousands and thousands in tithes each year. And they want to skink him out of another $15.

And then I read about the billion plus dollar mall.

It's so crazy! How could I ever not see how insane this whole system is.

By the way, I have some really cute new undies. Not one white pair either. :-)

Subject:	Re: My son is on a mission, I've just left the church...today...
Date:	May 24 21:53
Author:	msnobody

Chances are that your son will be exposed to the problems with the church while on mission here in the southeast. He isn't by any chance in Alabama is he?

Subject:	Re: My son is on a mission, I've just left the church...today...
Date:	May 25 03:15
Author:	A Musing Grace

He's in North Carolina.

In his first area no members would feed them. That was when they cut his money to $130 a month and he only got three meals in the quarter.

Subject:	Re: My son is on a mission, I've just left the church...today...
Date:	May 24 21:56
Author:	StillPissed

I think it best that you put your concerns about your son on hold for a bit. Just make sure that he's ok physically, but don't worry too much about how to deal with his missionary scenario, deprogramming, etc right now.

You are oh so very fortunate that your DH is open to finding truth. It might be well to focus on your communication with him and keep things very tight and good between you.

At the right time, hopefully the two of you can work out a plan of action to help with your missionary son...and your other kids as well.

Of course, who am I to be giving advice. Just take it for what it's worth from someone who is currently divorced from his TBM ex.

Subject:	Re: My son is on a mission, I've just left the church...today...
Date:	May 25 03:33
Author:	A Musing Grace

Thank you.

I feel very fortunate to have a supportive DH. (What does that mean anyway - dear husband? :-) Sorry, I'm not up on all the ex-mo code quite yet.

But I do have new underwear. :-) Gee I'm really happy about that.

My husband came home from work and we had a family meeting this evening. We talked to each child about how they feel. It's interesting that the children who are most upset are the youngest. They are devastated. My older kids are like, "Well, bummer. But hey does this mean I can wear a tankini swimsuit and get my ears double pierced now? If we ask for nose rings is that pushing things?" (I mean, they have their priorities.:-) I think a lot of teens have a hard time accepting the church anyway, they are more cynical because of the world we live in. My 15 year old has confessed she doesn't believe a word of it, but believes they may be a higher power.

My youngest sobbed and cried all night. "Why would the prophet not be honest about the church history. Why would they not tell us the whole truth? Is prayer real? I don't know what to believe?"

It's heartbreaking but I'm glad they are going through the process of learning to think for themselves now and not find out they were duped 30 years later like I was. We say, hey, we aren't victims here. Let's just buck up and be on the path of our choosing now. But it's hard. I can see why you are still pissed. It's a big pisser!

We are heading to the Unity Church on Sunday. The kids are happy about that.

My husband isn't ready to leave quite yet. But I think it will happen pretty quickly. He is actually very balanced and has been through our whole church experience. I mean I'd hear a talk on the sabbath day and wonder if making chocolate chip cookies on Sunday was okay. I'd ask my husband and he'd say, "Is it lawful to do good on the sabbath?" So I made the damn cookies. That is probably what led us to this very place. Sabbath breaking cookie baking is one way to head down the slippery slope.(Can you believe how brainwashed a person would have to be to question making cookies on Sunday. Boy do I feel dumb!)

What is most important is that he trusts me and allows me to think for myself. That is why I am...

A Musing Grace :-) I'm always thinking and exploring.

I appreciate your advice. It's good. Sorry about your divorce.

Upwards and onwards. We're taking it slow.

Subject:	Yikes, that is a toughie...
Date:	May 24 21:58
Author:	LadyDay

But first, congrats on your new-found freedom. It's a beautiful thing, isn't it?

Now, what to do about your son. hmmm... I'm trying to think if that was me what would I do... On the one hand, you don't want to "ruin" his mission experience, and on the other hand, you don't want to enlighten him after his mission AFTER he's baptized people. Then he would feel bad about baptizing them. Hmmm... if I were you I would either go visit him and talk to him face to face, or just wait until he got home. I am sure you will make the right decision.

all the best to you and yours

Subject:	Re: Yikes, that is a toughie...
Date:	May 25 03:38
Author:	A Musing Grace

Thanks for writing.

I am tempted to go visit him face to face. But he'd probably run away because it's breaking mission rules. Got this letter on the importance of obedience from him. He said it's the only thing we can give Heavenly Father. I think he wrote the word obedience like eight times in four sentences. "Zombie for the Lord."

Didn't a RM (was it Tal?) say if the church told him to strap on a bomb on his mission he would have, on the Frontline show? I missed it but my non-member mom called me in a tizzy. I assured her there would probably be no bomb strapping in his mission.

Subject:	Re: My son is on a mission, I've just left the church...today...
Date:	May 24 22:25
Author:	Maturin

Wow, you are in a challenging spot. I can only offer the following to consider, but it's only one way of many to look at it, I'm sure.

It seems to me that the priority here is your son's emotional stability. The distance between you is just too great to safely manage his "awakening" by sharing now your feelings and new found understanding. It may sound cowardly or illogical, but I fear for what may happen to both of you if you just go ahead and "expose" him to the truths you've discovered. He only has his companion and mission leaders to turn to for comfort and support and with any questions. As an RM myself and as the father of an RM, trust me...mission leaders will win. The craziest things seem true and obvious in the bubble of missionary life.

Consider your son's awakening as a process rather than an event. Allow that due to current circumstances you will have to wait to bring him around and it may take longer than you would like because of the delay. Eventually (I believe), just as I taught on my mission, and your son is teaching now; the truth will eventually win out.

In the meantime, help him focus on the non-gospel benefits of missionary service. Unlike some others, I don't consider my 2 years on a mission a waste of time. I admit that I may have been able to use them to more benefit, but I still gained significantly in experience and skill that led me to a very successful and fulfilling career. By discussing these things with him, you'll help him realize more growth and personal development than if you simply wait while he wastes away his 2 years.

Find out what he's learning about dealing with people...about communication...about serving others. Help him see the life-lessons possible to learn just by being paired up with another human being. Encourage him to spend his community service hours (I think all missionaries do this now) in genuine activities that make a real impact on the community and others. Also, encourage him to learn about the local culture and history. Talk about what experiences he is having that will help him be successful in his future career.

It doesn't have to be a total waste of time, but I fear if you don't exert your loving influence along these lines and wait until you are together again to share deeper feelings about the church, damage could be done to both of you.

There is probably no exactly correct way to deal with this. It's a challenge no matter what. I've just come to learn in my 50+ years to be more patient and see change as a process over time rather than an event at a moment in time. I hope this is some help at least.

Good luck on your own journey, too.

Subject:	Re: My son is on a mission, I've just left the church...today...
Date:	May 25 03:55
Author:	A Musing Grace

I also agree it isn't a total waste of time. He is learning some good skills there that he can take into his future. And also, his exposure to the church in this area could also be a very important part of his process down the road.

Thanks again.

Subject:	Re: My son is on a mission, I've just left the church...today...
Date:	May 25 04:18
Author:	A Musing Grace

Your words of wisdom... Oops, sorry, lets not go that direction. :-)

You really displayed a lot of wisdom in your post. I printed it and shared it with my husband. My son is all alone and won't have anyone to process his feelings with. So it does seem we will need to be very gentle and just support him for the good things he is doing there and work with things when he is home and we can heal together.

Your suggestions really resonated.

Thank you, friend.

Subject:	If you need support
Date:	May 24 22:33
Author:	Nebularry

you can find it here. Someone will have answers to your questions or, at least, a comforting word or two. Stay with us, the best is yet to come.

Best wishes,

Nebularry :-D LIFE IS GOOD!

Subject:	Re: If you need support
Date:	May 25 03:57
Author:	A Musing Grace
Mail Address:

Thank's Nebularry. I LOVE your name. And yes, It's all good.

Right on!

Subject:	Re: My son is on a mission, I've just left the church...today...
Date:	May 24 23:06
Author:	No Moniker

Just a few suggestions, but you know you son best.

Do not respond to the churchy parts of his letters. Write about everyday things, about the family and people he knows, current events he might find interesting, etc. Write about books you are reading, movies you're going to, etc.

Encourage him to learn about the local history and culture and to tell you about it. (Do your own research and ask questions: Gee I heard/read that......) Tell him you're proud of him for becoming a person who is respectful of the opinions of others, who looks at all points of view, etc. If he gets preachy and arrogant about the locals rejecting the mormon message, gently chastise him. Point out what he might already be realizing - that people of all faiths and non-faith are worthwhile and have valuable things to teach him.

Write about how proud you are of your other children for their grades, sports, etc - anything non-church related.

Emphasize your unconditional love - again and again and again. Emphasise how fortunate you feel for your family and how much love them all. In the end, love is your greatest tool.

Good luck and welcome.

Subject:	Re: My son is on a mission, I've just left the church...today...
Date:	May 25 04:13
Author:	A Musing Grace
Mail Address:

Thanks for the welcome and advice. I have been writing letters like you suggest because I've mentally been exiting the last few months.

He's been telling us about the local culture including a couple hillbilly's fighting over a girl with cattle prods. :-) I'm not kidding. The culture is interesting.

I have had to chastise him gently when he came down hard on some alternative type of folks.

I reminded him that all of God's children need love, even red necks with dreadlocks to their knees. :-)

Yes, love is our greatest tool. Thanks for your comments and the warm welcome.

Subject:	Tell him.....
Date:	May 24 23:24
Author:	another mom
Mail Address:

it's OK to masturbate. I'm not being rude or insensitive here. I'm female and didn't go on a mission, but I have read enough here to know what the guys go through and the guilt they feel if they don't follow every single rule.

I also suggest that you go to the main page of this site and do a search on missionaries. There are some Short Topics as well as other info. This way you'll have more of an idea of what he's going through.

My best to you.

Subject:	You're in quite a pickle, so to speak...
Date:	May 24 23:35
Author:	BrerRabbit

But it's a good pickle to be in, wouldn't you say? You've learned the truth and you have a whole new future in front of you; one which you control instead of the Church.

I'm not going to give you advice because I'm just not. But I'm going to share a couple of thoughts about my own experience.

When I first learned of the fraud of Mormonism, I went through the whole gamut of emotions before I came to a peaceful calm. I suspect you might find that as well. I think that's inevitable for those of us who have been entrenched in the fraud for a long time. And perhaps your best course for now would be to just take the time to get to know your new self before you approach your son in a dramatic way. You certainly could pose to him some questions regarding things like DNA, archeology, Moon Quakers, magic rocks in magic hats... The list is endless. (When I think of the hat trick I am often reminded of Bullwinkle: "Watch me pull a rabbit out of my hat. Nothin up my sleeve!").

Also, as a missionary, I felt I had a very strong testimony (don't we say 'beyond a shadow of a doubt'?). Yet I think I speak for many of us RM's who have doubts during the mission experience. Often we stick it out to the bitter end because there is so much disgrace in returning home early. And usually we suffer our doubts and unhappiness in silence. His letters may not be a complete reflection of how he is feeling. He may be writing things to you which he thinks may make you proud of him. And he may be more indoctrinated than usual. That attitude normally dissipates after the mission is over. It sounds like you have a great relationship with your kids. And I think if he knows that his life and choices are his own, and that there will be no disgrace for him in returning home early, it might get him to thinking of alternatives. There is no shame in revisiting a decision you thought was the best choice at an earlier time. I doubt I would have chosen to have come home early given the chance. But it would have been nice to have known that I had that option.

Anyway, welcome to the board. Best of luck to you and your family for a speedy recovery.

Regards,
BR

Subject:	Re: You're in quite a pickle, so to speak...
Date:	May 25 04:08
Author:	A Musing Grace

Oh no! Not the pickle! :-)

(I still can't get over the pickle parable. I think actually that was the final straw. How could I stay after that? :-)

I really appreciate your comments and wisdom as a former missionary. We are going to go very slow and carefully as to not tramatize him.

I'm going to have to actually write up how his mission call came in another thread. It was an incredibly abusive thing that happened to our family. It was the beginning of the end for me - dang, I first thought it was the pickle.

Oh, yes, It's a good place to be right now. There is a huge gamut of emotions certainly. But I've already decided I'm not going to be a victim. The church teaches co-dependency. When we don't think for ourselves and have control over our own lives we try to do it by proxy to others...the perfect mormon thing to do. Being a victim is part of that. Sure I'm angry at times, my kids are devastated. But I know everything is unfolding in absolute perfection. I have a strong spiritual base that has nothing to do with the church and have had more spiritual confirmations since leaving "mentally" in the last several months than I'd ever had in the church.

The church taught me many things that I couldn't have learned any other way... But I never heard about Moon Quakers - oh my! How did I miss that? Do tell.

Thanks again, BR.

Subject:	Re: My son is on a mission, I've just left the church...today...
Date:	May 25 00:09
Author:	LOL

Hehehe.

Who says God doesn't bless the family of a missionary. Y'all just got freed from the Cult!

Now stop paying for your son's mission and let the MP worry about keeping him there. You might see him home sooner than you think.

Moreover, if the kid has problems with his kneecap it's probably from overuse due to too much walking or biking.
He needs to rest the knee and take anti-inflammatories.

Hope it's nothing worse.

Sometimes a bad knee requires surgery. Insist that your son gets good medical care. Pain in the knee is not somthing you can walk off.

Subject:	I Like this idea, stop paying for the mission, the church
Date:	May 25 00:56
Author:	Gonzo

has become sooooo money focused, it would be interesting to see how they resolve this one. Of course you would have to tell your son why as part of the process. Gonzo

Subject:	Continue Paying for Mission
Date:	May 25 01:39
Author:	Recovering Mormon

I'd continue to make the payments that you agreed as a family to make.

If you cut him off now, it will make it harder to wean him. Better to appear to support his decision and explain why his world has turned inside out when you have him home.

If you and/or your family members resign, the MP will probably tell him, so be careful. It's something that he should hear from the mouths of your family, not some self-aggrandizing, priesthood climbing old fart.

Chances are one of his siblings will say something, but still, it's YOUR story to tell, it's none of the MP's business -- if you cut off funds because of your leaving, the MP will present it to your son in the worst possible light. Remember, they're good at artificial lighting and special effects.

Subject:	But the boy has a knee problem
Date:	May 25 07:17
Author:	Hmmm

which the church evidently is not taking seriously enough.

Who in their right mind would keep paying for a mission when the church refuses to stop abusing their son ?

The Mormon church is not keeping up its part and why should the parents continue to support a Fraud.

Promises obtained under fraudulent circumstances are not binding. Stop paying!

Subject:	Re: My son is on a mission, I've just left the church...today...
Date:	May 25 03:16
Author:	Nelly Normon

Welcome! My son was also on a mission overseas when I discovered the truth about the church. I can understand the emotions you are going through. There is no right answer for what to do. Give it some time to think about it.

I decided that I would not tell him what I had discovered while he was on his mission. Looking back, this was the right decision for me and my son but it may be the wrong decision for you and your son. I just kept my emails about anything but the church. I stressed to him to enjoy learning about a new culture and language and told him what a great experience this was for him to get to live in a foreign country. I know your son is in the states so it is a different experience. My son was active for only 1 month after he got back and is now out. He does have no regrets of serving the mission and he did do a lot of growing up while he was over there.

Good luck in your journey. You will get a lot of help and support here. You are not alone

Subject:	My brother still hasn't forgiven me (2 years later) . . .
Date:	May 25 03:49
Author:	Lunt

. . . for trying to discuss other options with him while he was on his mission. I didn't even know he was mad until he got home and started telling everyone else in the family how they should avoid me because of my evil influence (he didn't say evil though, as far as I know). Of course, I'm just one of two exMos in a huge and hugely TBM family, so I don't have the influence my mother would have (if only!)

Also, I've always been a nonbeliever (at least since he was old enough to remember), so it didn't make as much an impact. Just be careful! Best of luck!

Subject:	Congratulations, you've won a one way ticket out of the CHURCH!
Date:	May 25 03:49
Author:	junkpurger

You've received great responses already... isn't this forum wonderful. Now that you're out, you will go through a series of emotional roller coaster rides and this board will help you get through that. People here made me laugh, cry, look into my own soul deeper, and gave me hope of having a better life.

I agree with some of the posts to just focus on yourself, your husband, and your other kids for now. Maybe if you wait for your DH to resolve his issues and get out soon, both of you can work together on your son when he gets home. For now, gentle coaxing to be open minded to people outside his faith and soaking in the sceneries and culture of his surroundings will help him enjoy his mission a little bit more.

We're all rooting for you.

Subject:	Re: My son is on a mission, I've just left the church...today...
Date:	May 25 05:46
Author:	CTRNoMo

I would recommend letting your son know you are supportive of him. Not just him as a missionary. Let him know that he will have what he needs. You can let him know you don't think it is right for the church to be cutting back on money for food. Inform him of your concern for his health. The overuse injury now may have long term effects. And the rest of his life is as important than this two years.
Tell of your relief for him to be seen by a doctor because of the kids that have long term illness from mission related lack of health care.
Pass on to him that your love and concern transcends the mission. Infer that it is OK to come home any time.
If he is looking to come home he could understand, otherwise you are just a supportive mom.
Just some random thoughts, my $.02. My thoughts are with you and your journey.

Subject:	Re: My son is on a mission, I've just left the church...today...
Date:	May 25 08:35
Author:	just a mom

Grace...I too, discovered the full truth about the church while my son was on a mission and I was living overseas. He strictly abided all the rules, even though the one I had the hardest time with was the no phone calling. After his first mothers day, he gave us his number, Christmas came up and he started calling almost every month (we would call him, actually, and he planned and welcomed it.) He knew shortly after his return that we just didn't believe it all any more.

Long story short, four years later, he is out, all my other kids are out, and so far lightening hasn't struck us at all.

For our family, communication has always been key. Easing a missionary child into your non-belief is hard, but can be done. Good luck to you.

Subject:	Missionary son ...
Date:	May 25 09:27
Author:	Mason

I am basically in your situation, having one child that remains committed to his mission. Sometimes, I feel like a character in a disaster movie going away from the disaster while other family and friends stay put or go toward the disaster. This often creates a dilemma: It can be difficult to decide how to get the people we love going in the opposite direction. Should we encourage? Convince? Merely advise of other options and share perspectives? Remain silent? Be blunt and risk turmoil or worse? Require or coerce? For me, all of those approaches have proven useful.

The disadvantage of immediately losing all your beliefs is the seeming abyss that is created. By analogy, the Soviet Union and Iraq may have been horrible places to live with brutal governments, but the sudden loss of societal and political structure had terrible consequences for those countries. On the other hand, who wants to evolve toward freedom at the speed and with the uncertainty of a country like China?

Our children need to understand the truth for themselves and begin to directly feel the incongruities that come with life’s decisions, but stability is a huge factor in that decision. Keep that in mind for your son. I know my son will get out in time, but if he finishes a mission in the process, that will not be the worst thing in the world.

Back to the sinking ship disaster movies where everyone seems to be going the wrong way: I'm more likely to go with the person that is logical and convincing than the person yelling "fraud". In the case of most members, the latter will send them into (1) Shutdown Mode: they ignore it with the justification that it is apostate thinking; (2) Bash Mode: we'll get out our scriptures and spar with you; or (3) Testimony Mode: I bear witness to you of the truth of my current path. The truth is, most members are just not interested in changing their beliefs. As for my son and yours, we may have to accept the Buddhist idea of “When the student is ready, the teacher appears.” I still hope to be that teacher for my son, but in the end, it won’t matter what makes it click. All the best!

Subject:	My $0.02 about your son based on MY mission experience.
Date:	May 25 09:43
Author:	NoToJoe

First I'm very happy to hear you have the support of your spouse and it sounds like your other children will successfully adjust.

About your son, many missionaries (like myself) really did not want to be on the mission. 19 year old boys feel a huge obligation to go so that they don't disappoint their family. If your son knew that your stance on the TSCC has changed he will have to reevaluate why he is there and if he should stay.

I don't know your son. He may want to be on a mission.....but most don't. Most would rather be home doing normal 19 yr old things. The mission is a BIG sacrifice and I think I would be really angry if I spent two years trying to do what I though my family expected of me but then later learned that my family didn’t believe in what I was doing.

You need to tell your son what you have learned and how it has affected your thinking. You also need to tell him how your change in thinking has changed the way you view the meaning of his mission and how it has changed your expectations of him. Lay it all out.

This will no doubt be very difficult for your son but life can be a bitch sometimes. You have to play the hand you have been dealt. Once he knows where you stand he will have to think it through (or pray) and decide how he wants to react. You should support him in whatever decision he makes.

Your son will have a very hard decision to make. BUT IT IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO MAKE SURE IT IS AN INFORMED DECISION.

Subject:	I agree with NoToJoe
Date:	May 25 10:01
Author:	Mason

In hindsight, I probably waited too long and was too patient to share my perspectives openly with my children. As I mentioned, our children need to "begin to directly feel the incongruities that come with life’s decisions". Stability is a key factor, but so are family support; his personality, including the personal significance to him; your geographic location (Such as what peer, social, and career pressure does he face on his return?), timing, etc. However, since telling my son about my beliefs many times (and giving him Grant Palmer's book to read), I feel much better about things. And yes, always make sure that he knows your love and support are there without conditions.

Subject:	Since he is stateside
Date:	May 25 10:13
Author:	Yse

tell him to get himself to the nearest airport and you will buy him a ticket home.

Dragging himself around on a bum knee while trying to peddle a cult is insane.

Just tell him the knee is a sign, the Lord wants him home.

Subject:	I have a son on a mission too..
Date:	May 25 10:35
Author:	MadeGuy

I found out about REAL church history just after he left. He doesn't know I no longer believe, but my wife does. It took several months to break the news. I started with the Book of Abraham. We discussed it. I found out she knew about church 'problems' for a long time. She converted as a teenager and has been TBM a long time, so it's hard for her to give it up, but it's coming. I have since aired out all the history lies I know of; I even wrote a 17 page outline containing all the facts about genuine church history. This outline is like a security blanket. If anyone asks why I no longer go to church, I can show them the outline. It is thoroughly documented. My wife was the first to read it. She was dumbfounded and made a comment like "wow, you really researched this." I'm not going to reveal the new TRUTH to our missionary while he's on his mission. But I have decided to live my life MY WAY. Knowing the truth is sooooo liberating.... The truth does set you free. I'm investigating all my beliefs now.

Subject:	Go see him.
Date:	May 25 10:43
Author:	geneticerror

If possible, go to your son and tell him in person. This will be big news to him. I know it is not permitted to visit a missionary but since you no longer allow the cult to have authority over you and since he is your son, you make the rules. Good luck.

Subject:

Go GET him! n/t

Subject:	Do it in person
Date:	May 25 11:11
Author:	FT

No letter will suffice.

You must be there in person, and I would take your husband along with you.

Subject:	If I can help
Date:	May 25 11:30
Author:	k

Everyone is different and has different circumstances so it is difficult to give advice. Obviously, as most of us here are out of the church, we would prefer that it had happened sooner rather than later to us. I was overseas on my mission and the progeny of uber BIC TBM's so it is difficult to imagine this happening to me and what my reaction would have been. It would have been nice to understand the lies and facade and thereby not continue under the extreme duress missions place on young men and women. On the other hand it would have definitely created, temporarily, a rather large hole in my life's fabric. The one thing I am fairly certain about, however, is that I would have preferred them to deliver the message in person, as it is a huge issue - considering both the fact that the COJCOLDS is such a significant part of an individual church members life (defining his social, physical, intellectual and spiritual existence), and given that he is where this is the most concentrated, the missionfield. If I had received this information from my family in a letter, or e-mail, (we were not allowed to telephone home - ever) it would have left me stunned with no support and none of the resources that would have been necessary to understand this decision.

Anyway, the help is that I live in North Carolina. I'm not sure where your son is (I am in the eastern part) but if you need a place to stay mid June to early July to visit and talk to him I can offer you a place to stay. Or if he is close and needs someone to talk to or visit, our home is open to him.

Subject:	Another Perspective
Date:	May 25 12:03
Author:	Cr@ig P@xton

As a Mega, Uber, Nazi, Thoroughly Brainwashed, TBM Missionary...I can't think of any worse news to receive from home than the news you are keeping from your son. I would have rather received news that my entire family had been raped, tortured, dismembered and eaten by a crazed mass murderer than to learn that they had left the church (Yeah I was THAT fucked up).

But here in lays your problem. Who have you shared your information with… that might write your missionary son and tell them that his mother has left the only true and living church on the face of the earth? I think its better to be proactive than reactive…If I was your son I would rather hear this news from you than from someone else.

Take your time...but I would think it would be better to break the news to him in a manner that he isn't totally blindsided by some third party

Subject:	Welcome to the board! This is what my parents did...
Date:	May 25 13:00
Author:	toto

...I was a convert and went on a mission to France/Switzerland. My parents being nevermos (Lutheran and Catholic) did not believe in my decision but received my cliche-filled letters each week. I still have them and I don't know how they were able to stomach those letters.

They still talked with me, supported me, asking what I'd seen, rather than who I baptized (well, the elders physically baptized - I'm female). They wanted to know about my companions and how I was doing with the language.

I did love being on my mission and thought I knew more than my parents because I had the spirit. I too, was injured on my mission; I was hit by a van while riding my bike. Although it required a visit to the doctor, a week's rest was all I really needed for my badly bruised body.

Having said all that... I had a realistic mission president who definitely put kids in the hospital or asked them to see a doctor if thing were physically wrong. AND, he's not legally their parent - you are - so if he pulls a strong one, tell him you'll come to the mission to take your son personally to the doctor if he won't. He's being negligent in his "calling" by refusing medical attention for your son.

If that doesn't work, call the bishop, stake president, whomever to get your son medical care. This is ridiculous that they won't do that for him! Call the regional rep, an apostle, anyone higher than the president.

That's my two-cents. I'm sorry you're going through this with your son. I'm grateful my parents never said anything or tried to sway me in any way. It made leaving the church easier when it was time to do so. And when I did leave, they never said, "I told you so!" or "Why did you ever do that?" They were pretty amazing because it took twelve years as a member before I left - including a temple marriage without my parents there which was horrible on all sides. Mostly, my family was grateful I came back to my senses and we celebrated with a bottle of wine.

Good luck with everything. Keep us informed.

Subject:	Attn: MadeGuy. A Musing Grace thanks you all for making my day brighter.
Date:	May 25 17:38
Author:	A Musing Grace

My son is in the Charlotte area. Thank you for your generous offer k. That is so kind.

Also, MadeGuy, please oh please send me the outline of church history to the above email address. My husband would really like to read it. I think it will really help him. He just needs to see it layed out as you have done. And it will help us with questions from well meaning friends and family.

And just to let you know... My wonderful husband came home from work with a letter to our son gently suggesting that we had taught him some things we thought were true etc.and that he needs to remember to separate the gospel of Christ from LDS culture and some advice on "blind" obedience not being God's way. We are overnighting the letter. Then we are going to call him and make arrangements to go to North Carolina and meet with him in person. Share where we are at with the church and then let him know he has our support no matter what he decides to do.

We have a good relationship with our boy and he knows us to be honest. I think it would really wound him to come home and find out we left and left him in the dark. If he had a few months left it would be different - but he has 17 months to go. (Today he's been out exactly seven months...lucky seven. :-) We need to be honest and just let him know what we think in a gentle, kind manner and let him decide for himself. It's the only way to really honor him and his real agency and show that we trust him to follow his own heart.

So this is pretty much the plan. We won't be able to go for a few weeks, but it's in the works and will give us time to settle into things at home first before we meet with him.

Gotta run get that letter to the post office.

Thanks again everyone. You have eased our journey.

Subject:	Hi, A Musing Grace. Closed threads.
Date:	May 25 17:44
Author:	Jenny

Don't worry about your thread closing. Admin automatically closes threads when they get to about 30-35 posts. This helps keeps things more manageable and is never a reflection on the thread itself. If posts are particularly offensive, they will delete individual posts and it that posts happens to be an original post to a thread, the other posts might be "orphaned," which is sucha sad thing.

What you can do when a thread closes is start another one with the same name and say "Continued" or something like that.

All that said, I've been reading your story this morning and am touched by what is happening with your family. Your concern for your son is very respectful, caring and sensitive. It sounds like things will eventually work out well for your family because there seems to be a large amount of love and maturity floating around. Congrats to you and your husband (and maybe even your parents, too?) for building such strong bonds.

Best to you in making your plans and moving forward from here. Might be a roller coaster sometimes, but it won't last forever. Been there, done that.

Jenny S.

Subject:	Are you paying for his mission? If so, this presents a big dilemma. Do you continue to pay for it
Date:	May 25 19:41
Author:	SusieQ#1

or do you turn it over to the Ward to pay for it? Does he come home because you won't pay for the mission?
Hmmm, just things to think about.

Of course, if you itemize, the money you give to the LDS Church for his mission is tax deductible and makes nice Tithing Refunds! ;-)

Subject:

De-converting a missionary is tough... n/t

Subject:	Re: Are you paying for his mission? If so, this presents a big dilemma. Do you continue to pay for it
Date:	May 26 00:57
Author:	A Musing Grace

He's been out seven months today. So almost a 1/3 of the way through. He saved every dime from work for over a year and had enough to pay for 1/3. So now it's mom and dad cough up the dough time.

We are planning to go talk to him in NC in June face to face.

At that point we will tell him where we are at and tell him that we support him in whatever path he decides. We are happy to support him in his mission if that is truly what he desires.

However, I personally think that when we present the information we've been chewing on he will want to come home. He trusts us, he knows us and if his dad especially shows up and says "Hey, son. This is what I've learned about REAL church history..." I think it's a done deal...if they haven't brainwashed him too much.

We love him. We want him to be happy. If finishing the mission is what will do it, so be it. We support him.

It's just that we do have to tell him where we stand with things.

The bottom line is his well being.

Subject:	Re: Are you paying for his mission? If so, this presents a big dilemma. Do you continue to pay for it
Date:	May 26 01:02
Author:	SusieQ#1

That's an excellent way to deal with all of the ramifications of these kinds of choices and decisions.
I think you have the bases covered!
Your kids are lucky to have you as parents! I commend you!

Subject:	Re: Hi, A Musing Grace. Closed threads.
Date:	May 26 01:06
Author:	A Musing Grace

Thanks for the explanation on the threads. I'm new to this.

Yes, I feel things are going to work out. My husband has been processing a lot of things and it's hard but he's coming along. He's starting to speak and think freely and it's amazing how he really feels about the church when he isn't afraid. Getting rid of fear was the beginning of the end of my church membership.

It's been a shocker to us to say the least but I've never felt better in my life...until I went to a non-temple LDS chapel wedding this evening.

It's so sad. They begin the control right at the moment of marriage. The ceremony is so short and meaningless and having it hammered in the bride and groom's face that "this is for mortality only" is such a cheap shot. No words said when rings are exchanged. I wanted to cry.

I'm so glad I'm out. I'm so glad my children will have real weddings that are expressions of who they are and what is important to them.

A wedding with no real music. No flowers. No pictures...

It's just so depressing. This was a beautiful couple getting married. Not second class citizens because they didn't go to the temple.

I had a temple wedding and our family wasn't even there. I talked to my husband about writing our own vows and exchanging them on our 22nd anniversary. I think that would be cool.

Thanks for your support and encouragement, Jenny. It's nice to know people get through it.

Part 2 The parents are flying out this evening to get their missionary son

Subject:	A Musing Grace and her A Mazing Man are flying out this evening to go talk to their missionary son...
Date:	May 26 20:02
Author:	A Musing Grace

Thank you everyone for your caring comments and concern for our family.

Thank you to those who sent information - MadeMan and Diane in particular. I shared this with my husband and he has made his decision to leave the church.

Not only that, he told our family through his tears that he can't stand to have our boy in the mission field without all the information. We'd planned to go the third week of June but it's a long weekend and we decided to go now - like in a few hours. It's costing us close to $2000 to bring him home and it's worth every single penny.

We are going to call him to say we are coming to talk to him but not go into details, so it won't shock him.

There really is no other option for us as the people we are. We have always been open and honest with our kids about everything and have never kept anything from them.

We have to share what we know and let him make his own choice. We have bought him a ticket home with us and hope he will use it.

We think he will. He's a great young man and when he finds out about the REAL history, versus what they have him teaching I know he won't stay there.

His birthday is on the 31st. We think the truth is the best gift we can give him.

I'm leaving now and will try to check in with you and let you know how it goes.

THIS RECOVERY BOARD IS LIFE CHANGING. Thank you for your time,

Updated June 2007

Part 1

My son is on a mission, I’ve just left the church…today

The family - after a 1 week vacation