I have five brothers and sisters, but only one brother who stayed in the Church and checked all the boxes. He and his wife have half a dozen children, including one who is disabled. They have really struggled to make it to where they are, and I admire them a lot.

My brother called me the other night about ready to explode. Apparently, mom had called and said she was going to be in town. My brother asked when, and she said it would be sometime between Tuesday and Thursday. He said, "Okay, let me know when you're going to be here so I can make plans." She waffled and never got back with him on that. He blew it and didn't nail her down on a time, but I know my mother and I think she avoided it deliberately so that she could set up this situation.

Wednesday night, my brother was an hour and a half away with his family, and mom called him on his phone and said she was sitting in his driveway waiting for him. That's when he called me to vent. It's hard to describe her self-righteous attitude, but all of my brothers and sisters know it well. My sister does a great impersonation.

I said that you know mom is going to play the martyr when you get there, so you need to get ready for that. We prepared what he was going to say, and he calmed down and I didn't hear from him again until today. Sure enough, mom was up on the cross when he arrived back at his house.

So, he let her have it. He said that if she wants to avoid a lot of waiting around in the future that she needs to pay attention when he asks when she's going to arrive and to make a firm commitment, because he and his family have lives of their own and can't wait around for three days for her to show up. She acted like a ten year old in response, but I was proud of him. My brother has been walking on eggshells around mom since we were kids.

He told me some awful stories about mom making unreasonable demands and him feeling duty-bound to rearrange his life for her. I told him that that has just got to stop. I asked him if he knew what I mean by "personal boundaries," and I tried to explain that this is important for his family's well-being. His personal boundaries need to be enforced by him and respected by mom and everyone else, or else he needs to have a serious talk with her about it. It needs to be him too, because his wife was making teapot sounds, and he needs to step up and take charge before he loses control over the situation.

I told him some of the things I've said to mom, and he didn't think he could never say anything like that. It was basic, assertive stuff - stuff that everyone needs to learn to say. I didn't tell him about the time my ex-wife filled our refrigerator from top to bottom with about 60 bottles of beer shortly before mom arrived for a visit. Or the time I told mom to "Come down off the cross. You're not going to bleed from every pore." I don't have a lot of problems with her, because I won't put up with her crap. I sleep well at night after telling her off, but that has only been since I left the Church and began to take charge of my life and enforce my personal boundaries. I had no idea how awful she had become with my siblings.

I think she is playing off a fear of people in authority that the Church instills in believers who are deeply in it like my brother. They can't say no and let people walk all over them. It's a terrible mind job.

While she was there, she criticized his lawn, his wife's flowers, their children, their food, their home, their neighborhood - all in a very mealy-mouthed way that made them wonder if she was actually saying what they thought she was saying. She was very negative, and the glass was always half-empty. I was surprised at the things she said during her visit with them. It was really uncalled for, and they were relieved when she was finally gone.

Anyway, my TBM brother has a long way to go, but it's a start.

You know, I read the stories people tell here on RfM, and I look back at the things I did out of a sense of duty and for approval - seminary, the mission, BYU, garments, callings - and I think we've all really come a long way. This issue of not being so "nice" to abusive Mormons and enforcing personal boundaries is a big part of the recovery process. It's hard to learn boundaries when you've been pressured to pay, pray and obey all your life.

Or at least the ones I know do. My mom is the same way when she comes to visit, although she skips the martyr act. She won't make plans, calls on a minutes notice to see if she can drop by, ditches us if she gets a better offer and always, always stays with my sister, who lives about 10 miles away. If she'd give us an idea of when she wants to get together, we could rearrange our schedules to spend time with her. She only comes around about twice a year because she lives 8 hours away. But if we complain about her haphazard visiting she treats us as though we were possessed by dark spirits and blames OUR attitude on our inactivity. It's not HER rudeness - not ever.

Gads, I'm SO glad I got out before I aged into an older Mormon woman, with all the accompanying character traits. Three cheers to your brother for standing up to your mom.

My mother has become more severe as she has gotten older. Your mom's act sounds very familiar. My parents do the same thing. They behave poorly, and then there's some failing on your part if you object to how they act.

Here's one. My parents visited my Mormon brother a few years ago in their RV. They sat inside their RV on his driveway for almost a week and hardly went in to see them. My brother and his wife were confused, but relieved - and THEY felt guilty about feeling that way. How messed up is that?

for example, she only criticizes thoughts and feelings, and it's easy to avoid the criticism by not sharing thoughts and feelings. But by golly, you had better not object to anything she says, because she's the master of the thing where it's a failing on your part.

My mother is an innocent perfect angel. She is simply not like that. You always assign intentions and motivations she doesn't have, you don't get her, blah blah blah. Did I mention you shouldn't feel that way?

It's not that she's incapable of introspection; it's that she doesn't need to think about changing, because you're being silly. Again.

In my family, the old person gets to say whatever they want and you just have to take it. It doesn't matter how old you are. The old person will always be older, and that means he or she gets a free pass.

Both sides of my family are like this. I think it's a Utah Mormon pioneer thing.

After all, they've been trying so long to become like gods and goddesses, princes and princesses, it's high time someone started treating them like one. My brother says that he has seen dad turn his hearing aids off when mom gets on her high horse.

It is easier for your children to learn boundaries when they're young. I too have struggled with enforcing boundaries, but am getting better. My teenage and early 20s children are much better at this--a huge benefit that accrues with getting out of the Morg.

My mother and I used to have a rather strained relationship. I always felt that she loved me, because she was my mother, but she didn't particularly like me, or was interested in me.

I'm glad I don't remember her mother, because she sounds much worse, but my Mom definitely got her habit of criticizing from her own mother. Nothing I did was good enough for her, so I'd figure, "Why bother trying?" and then she'd be mad that I never did anything for her.

At some point in my adulthood, I just decided that enough was enough. When she criticized me, I simply walked away. It really took the wind out of her sail and I think it quite startled her that I was no longer putting up with her insults.

I'd just calmly say, "If you're going to be nasty, I'm leaving," and I would. One time I walked in the door, she made a not-nice comment and I turned around and walked right back out again. She looked so startled. LOL

My Mom was never a Mormon, but she had a strict Catholic upbringing and her mother sounds like she wasn't a nice person at all.

My Mom eventually stopped being so critical, which I'm really glad about, because I was forced to move back home again, due to financial troubles, and I'm still here.

She and I go out walking the dog every evening and have enjoyable conversations. My parents are now elderly, so I help them out however I can.

Sometimes she still criticizes, but it's not very often at all, and I'll stand up for myself. But I don't seem to react as emotionally to it anymore. Maybe I'm finally growing up, now that I'm out of Mormonism.

She has mellowed a lot and she has really tried to be kinder. She's still the sort of person who doesn't always think about other people, and I don't think she'll ever really understand me. I've had the opportunity to let her get to know me better and I think I really puzzle her. LOL

But the nice thing is that when I was younger, I used to fantasize about when I could leave home and never look back. Now when I eventually lose her (she's 82), I'll just cry and miss my Mom.

I'm so grateful that I had the opportunity to get closer to her. If I had walked away and never looked back, I'd still be so angry and bitter towards her, and I never would have healed the way I have. My sister used to say, "You're a very angry woman," when I talked about my Mom. But that's gone now. One day I realized that it had just simply vanished. Healed, I guess.

But you're right in telling your brother to stand up for himself. It begins with refusing to put up with being treated badly. Yelling is not necessary. One can calmly say, "If you don't stop criticizing me, I'm walking away," and actually do it. Once you've done it enough, changes do begin to happen.

You learned these lessons early, now it's his turn.

His experience reminds me of what happened with my parents many years ago.

DH, my young son, and I returned home from a Suday outing to find my parents sitting in their car, fuming, and waiting for us. They said they'd arrived two or three hours earlier, hungry, tired, and in need of a bathroom. My father tried to jimmy the a sliding door to get in. To this day, the frame is dented and the door won't slide as easily as it should. They finally drove downtown to a gas station to use the restroom.

The funny thing is that they hadn't told us they were coming. Yet, they were disgruntled and impatient that we weren't there ready to cater to their needs. Mormon parents sometimes think that "honoring your father and mother" means living as doormats.

...bend over and take it. It's at the core of authoritarian culture.

It takes practice to set some healthy personal boundaries especially when dealing with people who have a long habit of being negative and critical.
Choosing not to engage is very powerful.

So, when we change how we respond, it takes them a little time to recognize that they can't continue with the same old negative behavior and they need to make some changes. It can be a bit difficult at first for people to behave differently.

My Dad has seen it all and taken it all in stride. He's had grandsons show up and ask it they can sleep in the same bed with their girlfriends and he's had grandsons who show up with girlfriends and make a big deal about sleeping in separate rooms only to be caught in the same room in the morning.

I know for a fact that he respects the grandson who flat out says he's gonna be sleeping with his girlfriend over the liar.

And he let's them keep beer in the fridge if they asked. I love the story of the 60 bottles of beer in the fridge. I wish I'd have done that when my Mom was still alive. That would have stopped her endless lectures on the virtues of sobriety in their tracks!

My mother was just the opposite though. She wasn't about to condone sinful behavior under her roof. My Dad always figured they'd already done the deed so why deny them a bed to share.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/18/2010 08:50PM by Charley.