We recently moved to a city that has a very high population of Seventh-Day Adventists. In fact, we live about 3 miles from one one thier largest colleges. Walla Walla University.

I knew from previous studies that Joesph Smith & Helen White both came from New York state in the early 1820's where there was a well documented religious awakening for lack of a better term. Some of the beliefs of the two religions are quite paralell.

I was wondering if this topic has been discussed & if person's on this board have any further personal insight.

Some days it feels like we're living in Utah except we're surrounded by Seven-Day'ers.

Thanks in advance.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/03/2013 12:56AM by travis.

About 6 years two young adults knocked on my door and asked me to fill out a 5 question survey. I obliged and based on my answers they asked if I was Mormon. I answered yes. They said, "What if we were to tell you that the Sabbath is actually on Saturday not Sunday?

At which point I knew they were SDAs and they admitted to that fact.

Instantly I had an idea and proposed a hypothetical scenario.

Suppose you were on a boat and rough seas ensued. The boat capsized and all died except for you. You were washed to shore on a deserted island and woke up days later. Of course you really aren't sure exactly how long you had been unconscious.

Well, suppose you started counting to determine which day was your Sabbath (Saturday) and you began keeping that day holy for many years living alone. But in reality the day was actually Tuesday not Saturday. Do you think God would care which day of the week you were worshiping him and keeping holy?

They were confounded, understood my point, and then left. I've never seen them since.

Love it when the nonsensical gets highlighted. Nice job.

I use that question almost everytime when someone wants to get into a religious discussion now: "Do you think God cares about that? Why?"

The personal God concept is relatively new, but most Christians think it's always been so. Read a book already.

i converted my wife from adventism. Her family lived in collegedale, TN, their other big school. Her father is a 7th day preacher.

I have lots of experiences with them, probably similar to yours. They would judge my wife for wearing make up and we judged them for the girls wearing no sleeves and short shorts.

Both religions have massive amounts of nebulous semi doctrine that they judge each other on. They both have a law of health. they both had prophesies. They do missionary work, their is actually to help he needy more than the LDS, which is to help themselves. I have read most of theirs (white's) and now looking back they are par with JS's bs. They also have the people who say that what their prophet said is optional if its bad, but its the word of god if its true. They have colleges, do missionary work and a paid clergy. You cant be a preacher unless you are married. I have debated doctrines with my FIL to no end.

> I knew from previous studies that Joesph Smith &
> Helen White both came from New York state in the
> early 1820's where there was a well documented
> religious awakening for lack of a better term.
> Some of the beliefs of the two religions are quite
> paralell.
>

Actually Travis, "the Second Great Awakening" is the term. So, if there's a better term than "awakening," no one else uses it either. Her name was Ellen G. White, and Adventism comes out of the same religious milieu as Mormonism, though I wouldn't say the two are, otherwise, more closely related. If I remember correctly, however, the Jehovah's Witnesses did come out of the Seventh Day Adventists sometime later in the 1800s.

You are correct on the JW-point.

stillburned Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> > I knew from previous studies that Joesph Smith
> &
> > Helen White both came from New York state in
> the
> > early 1820's where there was a well documented
> > religious awakening for lack of a better term.
> > Some of the beliefs of the two religions are
> quite
> > paralell.
> >
>
> Actually Travis, "the Second Great Awakening" is
> the term. So, if there's a better term than
> "awakening," no one else uses it either. Her name
> was Ellen G. White, and Adventism comes out of the
> same religious milieu as Mormonism, though I
> wouldn't say the two are, otherwise, more closely
> related. If I remember correctly, however, the
> Jehovah's Witnesses did come out of the Seventh
> Day Adventists sometime later in the 1800's

I remember as a young missionary learning the mandatory discussions about a "religious excitement" that occured in New York state in the 1800's but didn't really know if there really was such an event. At times, when you've been so indoctrinated to seperate "truth from fiction".

I appreciate the clarification.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/03/2013 01:45AM by travis.

travis Wrote:

> I remember as a young missionary learning the
> mandatory discussions about a "religious
> excitement" that occured in New York state in the
> 1800's but didn't really know if there really was
> such an event. At times, when you've been so
> indoctrinated to seperate "truth from fiction".
>
Actually, the Second Great Awakening was not limited to New York State, it covered most of the United States. It led to great growth in membership in all the main churches and spawned several smaller religious organization. Seventh-Day Adventists are one, the Restoration Movement (Disciples of Christ/Churches of Christ) is another, the Mormons is a third. This was an important period in American history, check http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Great_Awakening .

Yes, you are absolutely right. And Palmyra, New York was HEAVILY trafficked by revivals and itinerant preachers.

The Seventh Day Adventist 's claim to fame is the Saturday Sabbath. Their teachings are pretty main stream compared to the LDS church. They have similar health laws-no- coffee / tea /alcohol and Ellen White taught "no meat". Most go the Adventists I know re vegetarians. The more liberal Adventists are kind of sweeping Ellen White under the carpet in recent years following accusations of plagiarism. Oh yeah, the CatholicChurch is the great abominable church.

I once asked my parents what religion they would be if they weren't mormon. They told me they would be 7day advents. I wasn't old enough to ask them why and reason with them.

IMO both religions are nuts. My step grandmother was a devout 7day. I think that's where my parents got their idea from.

When I was older I had a roommate that was 7day. She seemed crazier to me than the mormons. She one acted like she was doomed for hell because she unknowingly ate refried beans that had lard in them. I couldn't help but think of mormons that would freak out because they unknowingly ate something with coffee or alcohol in it.

DoesGod really care? Somehow I don't think so.

My tbm friend told me the founder of adventists used to be Mormon and that's why there's a lot in common between both. But i'm not sure how to feel about that.

I also have a seventh day friend who told me she believes sabbath is on Saturday. I wanted to LOL as I told her my religion professor says there's nothing in the bible that says any day of the week!!

wohoo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> My tbm friend told me the founder of adventists
> used to be Mormon and that's why there's a lot in
> common between both. But i'm not sure how to feel
> about that.
>
>
Your TBM friend is wrong. The founders of the adventists were not Mormon. But both Mormons and adventists (and others) have their roots in the American Second Great Awakening in the first half of the nineteenth century - and that is the true reason why they have things in common.

I grew up sda. Now i am a heathen. It is scary growing up hearing about the end of the world all the time.

Some similarities, e.g. lots of pressure on members to do recruiting, with not a lot of results.

But more differences, e.g. trajectory as a movement, number and significance of unique beliefs and texts, isolationism, then mainstreaming, and of course money and power. Way different.

Lived in Loma Linda, CA (SDA community) for 3 years:

No Saturday mail delivery; only Sunday-Friday.

SDAs mowed their lawns and partied on Sunday.

No hard liquor sold in entire town.

No taverns in entire town.

SDA hospital serves fake meat only.

SDAs believe that when you die, you are stuck in the grave until Resurrection; this according to my ex-mo brother's SDA secretary.

SDAs are very anti-Catholic. LOL

There is a channel on my cable which has SDA teachings but they don't call it SDA. They have different names for their shows. Very much sabbath keepers and really go after other groups which don't keep Saturday as the Sabbath.

There is also a little exercise program at 4 am on that channel and sorry guys, no one looks that great. It is a great argument against vegetarianism.

Not necessarily a good argument against vegetarianism. There are many people who don't maintain their vegetarian or vegan diets properly and end up malnourished.

These people have no tone or muscle to speak of. Really not healthy looking.

Again, you can't make a "case" against vegetarianism by a few people you saw on tv who looked malnourished. They probably weren't maintaining their diet properly. You can do veg and vegan wrong, but that doesn't mean every veg or vegan is unhealthy. Jeeze.

I'm not saying that all vegetarians eat the wrong food and are unhealthy.

I am talking about this particular group on this particular exercise program.

I am assuming that they are following the SDA recommended vegetarian diet.

There are also cooking shows on that channel and they are all vegetarian.

You said, "It is a great argument against vegetarianism." That's a broad statement.

If you didn't meant to make it so broad, then fine.

But the statement was against vegetarianism, which is s lot more people than those on the exercise show or SDA's.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/04/2013 09:40AM by fidget.

You're right, that was a broad statement. Sorry about that.

I have friends who have become vegetarian. I'm not sure if they are vegan.

She looks pretty good and has lost some excess poundage (though she always looked good to me). He on the other hand looks like a survivor of a concentration camp. Extremely skinny, no muscle tone at all.

Another vegetarian friend of mine was overweight.

Vegetarian can work for some but certainly not for all.

The fact that God did not make the speed of the earth's rotation time divisible by seven evenly shows that he doesn't care.

Also, leap year keeps moving the seventh day to a different day as time progresses, thus we really don't know what year we are on originally.

Also, by whose calendar? Does God not love the Chinese and care bout them worshipping on the correct day.

Clearly, some enterprising young religious entrepreneur had to find some way to differentiate his sect from others. That's all it is. Like the Word of Wisdom for Mormons.

Like painting your face at a sporting event.

Gotta make sure everybody can tell who's on your team.


Anagrammy

Anagrammy,

Maybe it's time to start a Sixth Day Adventist Cult?

Prolly be closer to the speed of the Earth's rotation...

I don't know.

I would start a cult of pi if only it were a round number...

Because it is not, I am an atheist. No intelligent being would design a circle that used pi.

Oh, wait! The god of the old testament is quite a mess...I wouldn't put it past him...


Anagrammy

I also live close to Walla Walla, WA, and have had years of dialogue and experience with SDA's.

What has NOT been mentioned in this thread, is that at least the Adventists have the right GOD! And the correct Jesus Christ. Their God is NOT the Mormon God, who (Mormon God) has a physical body, is an exalted man, has parents and grandparents, and who was born at some location and was a sinner and then advanced to BECOME a God.

The SDA's are basically commandment keepers, legalists, and have lots of emphasis on false issues. They are wrong on lots of things, but at least are considered Christians in a theological sense. In contrasts, LDS doctrine places the TSCC in the category of a theological cult. Christian in a moral sense only...

That is like say UFO believers who believe in Reptilians got it all wrong.

It is the GREYS that are the correct aliens and it is silly to believe in reptilians.

Believe in whatever God you choose but please understand no one has a clue if their God is real or not much less the one true god.

Walla Walla is a school for religious nutjobs? Put that on the list of schools my children will not be attending when they go off to college.

I live and work near Loma Linda. Their University and hospital are HUGE. McDonalds wanted to put a restaurant in LL and was denied (because of unhealthy food?!).

I knew several SDAs that wouldn't eat meat at all, but would drink coffee; and some who would eat meat, so go figure. They have an awesome store called "Loma Linda Market." - It carries all kinds of neat stuff (besides the veg hot dogs, etc.).

I volunteered at the Children's Hospital when I was in college. Veg dishes in the cafeteria. My orthodontist is SDA and his office is closed on Friday so he can start observing "the Sabbath" on Friday.

Both Ellen White and JS were nut jobs, but I can say the SDAs out run the LDS in healthcare and education anyday!

There is also a great market here in College Place (next to Walla Walla) that has a great selection of healthy foods. It's quite obvious what demographic they cater to sonce they are closed on Saturdays.

I told my wife last weekend "at least I can get my haircut on Sunday". It's been interesting being new to the area to figure out which business is closed on which "Sabbath".

Thanks for all the insight.

My hygienist is SDA. She's a very nice lady with wonderful SDA friends and family. Yes she doesn't eat meat and is very adamant about the Sabbath (seventh) day. The argument is that keeping the Sabbath day holy was part of the 10 commandments and not a part of the "Law", and was therefore not done away with in the new testament. She went to Walla Walla and then to another school in Alabama, after that she received her hygiene degree from Loma Linda. I'll have to say that her kids are very well behaved, friendly and educated, so whatever she's doing, she's done it well.