On receiving the summons the church put out this statement to the various media, by different church PR employees. It is actually evidence that they lie to the public.

Malcolm Adcock, the church’s public affairs director for Europe, said: “The Church occasionally receives documents like this that seek to draw attention to an individual’s personal grievance or embarrass church leaders.
“These bizarre allegations fit into that category.”

How does this draw attention to my personal grievance? If the Crown Prosecution Service had initiated this would it be a personal grievance?

How occasionally do they receive such documents? How often do they receive summons alleging FRAUD?

Why are the allegations bizarre? They are statements of fact, made by the church, which are demonstrably untrue. How are they bizarre?

Are they inviting me to sue them for libel?

They lie in public all the time. The online missionary discussions have been "screen-grabbed", recored and shared across the internet. I'm sure in those alone there is ample evidence of fraud.

It boggles the mind doesn't it?

Save a published copy of that statement - it supports your case.

“In the primitive simplicity of their minds, they will more easily fall victim to a large lie than a small lie, since they sometimes tell petty lies themselves, but would be ashamed to tell a lie that was too big. They would never consider telling a lie of such magnitude themselves, or knowing that it would require such impudence, they would not consider it possible for it to be told by others. Even after being enlightened and shown that the lie is a lie, they will continue to doubt and waver for a long time and will still believe there must be some truth behind it somewhere, and there must be some other explanation. For this reason, some part of the most bold and brazen lie is sure to stick. This is a fact that all the great liars and liars’ societies...in this world know only too well and use regularly.”

That's from a famous book, by a famous guy, but almost no one has read that famous book.

just sayin'.....

He might have been insane (I think he was), but he was clued in to what made humans tick.

You are right, their response is ironically a perfect example of their habitual dishonesty.

The PR department knows full well that this is not what this case is about, and very purposely released these statements to try and mislead people.

SG

I'm sure there is and will be more grounds for libel should you choose to prosecute that. For your current prosecution, if I understood the law parts presented here, you have the option of notifying the CPS. Have you done so?

Lol...business as usual for them, in other words, just keep lying.

I thought the same thing when I read the breaking AZ piece. Wow, it was amazing how quickly they had lawyers discounting you and your "personal grievances". I think that they think they are too powerful for the fraud summons to stick and that they can pay off (or whatever else) to get the case dropped. So they'll make you look bad, call the charges "bizarre" and tell whatever story they need tell to control the publicity.

A few years ago that would have worked, but the world has changed. People are tired of protecting religions. They're tired of being scammed by people, especially those they have been told to trust...or manipulated into trusting. The world is hurting economically, and being held hostage to a religion that demands 10% of your income (and then in the temple having you covenant ALL you will be blessed with) to the church...so you can have your family for eternity? Not cool. Especially when you discover that it's all a lie. That you were raised and brainwashed into the lie, or that you joined under the falsity of such lies, that are KNOWN to leadership. Super not cool.

I believe this criminal case will stand. Especially if the REAL story gets to the people of the UK--and they can see how it personally affects even them, and millions that could be going to programs that benefit the people of the UK. If public outrage can be reached, and pressure maintained against this weird religion...well that would be awesome! I believe in you, Tom. I don't know what I can do from here for you there...but if I were in London...I'd so be on this.

When I was talking to the missionaries I asked to see the local bishop about the "weird" stuff -- The "Curse Of Cain," men becoming gods, and so on. The individual I was speaking with was a educated professional, an electrical engineer by training and intelligent man who served his mission in 1978.


I went to his office late on a Sunday evening asked him about the animated segment in the "Godmakers" film, the War in Heaven story and dark skin curse, men becoming gods, etc. He claimed to be just as clueless as the sister missionaries were. There was no group of "fence sitters" during the War in Heaven, there was no known reason for the black male priesthood ban, the LDS Church has never been racist, they only believe in one god and don't believe faithful Mormon men will become gods with their own planets and harem of women in the afterlife.

The local stake president also happened to be there and I knew these men were either flat out lying at best or delusional at worse. I don't think they were delusional.

OK, so this is the hypocrisy that gets me the most. They count everybody who has ever been baptized and hasn't resigned, or turned 110 years old (and we're not even sure about the ones who resigned) as part of their 14 million mormons. Not active mormons. Mormons. Period.

But when someone who is still very much on their records, hasn't resigned, isn't 110 and not only that, who they, themselves have elevated to Godhood, brings them bad press, that person is an EX Mormon. Whaaaat?

Nope. Sorry Tommy and friends, but you can't have it both ways. Pick a side. If all the other people who are disgruntled, disaffected, inactive, or completely cluess as to ever having been a member are Mormons and counted in your big numbers, Tom Phillips is as Mormon as it gets.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/12/2014 03:07PM by NormaRae.

Could it be that the "worker bees" are kept in the dark about a lot of stuff (like the rank and file members)?

Adcock's response is a typical response I have been getting from all the people I've socialized this (I, of course know differently and am waiting for them to see the light). They (Church PR and rank and file TBMs) perhaps approach everything from the idea that the Church is true and there must be an explanation for this.

With this mindset, it seems like every action brought against the Church must be bizarre, because of course the Church is true. What other explanation could there be?

My thought coming from a salesman's perspective is that if I know too much about the downsides (crappiness) of my product, it will psychologically diminish my ability to sell it (unless you are a born liar and manipulator by nature which I'm not). It would be a wise strategy on the Church's behalf to give PR enough information to do their job effectively (but not too much as to psychologically hamper them). I know I would have the ability to be a "gung ho" salesman at first until the realities of the nature of my product start creeping in.

Am I giving these PR folks too much credit in this situation???

I wonder how long it will take for the PR folks to start resigning...they just may start looking like **ADMIN EDIT** [PR people who start] not looking very convincing in front of the cameras (because [they] probably [aren't] believing all the BS that [is coming] out of their [mouths]).

Personally, I'd rather have a job cleaning up nuclear waste than do what [PR people have] to do.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 02/12/2014 06:38PM by Administrator.

Mormonism was founded on deception by a conman Joseph Smith.

It's what Mormons do, they lie.

LDS leaders are being found out for the fraud they do so well.

Tom, I greatly appreciate your efforts in helping to expose the deception.

I discovered the truth in 2006 on the Internet.

Wowza!

Yup, a lie from Day One.

What I've noticed about them is that they rarely say anything unless it's to tell a lie. I hardly ever nod my head in agreement when I'm reading some claim they've made. In fact, I think they are so accustomed to lying that they don't even realize that they're doing it habitually. So, they lie, then they lie to cover up their lies, and they respond to charges of lying with more lies. They probably think that whatever they say is the truth because they think they have God on their side.

A house of lies propped up by more lies.

I pointed this out on FB. (My hubby was the only one who clicked "like")

"Oh the Irony!

The LDS church is charged with criminal fraud in the UK (accused of WITHHOLDING important information that undermines their historical claims). In the Deseret News story, the church OMITTED the fact that they were charged with a crime and the specifics of the allegations, SUBSTITUTING a straw man description. (It's about conduct not theological beliefs. The allegation is that the church is not open and honest and hides stuff from members/investigators - just like it did in this article.)"



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/12/2014 03:15PM by crom.

How much is spent annually by LDS Inc on attorney fees alone. I bet this number is gigantic. Another reason they don't disclose the financials. Wouldn't look good that they spend 100 times more employing attorneys than they do in Humanitarian Aid.

Tom
Even the recently published 'essays' admitting as they do, that previous statements were false or misleading have actually bolstered your case. I believe they can easily be used, providing the publication dates are available, as further evidence of deception.

I really cannot understand the mindset of these people, it's as if deception has become so habitual & ingrained that it's become part of their personalities

wayback machine will show before and afters of the essays.

https://archive.org/web/web.php

Keep in mind this critical fact:

The press coverage that really counts is that presently going on in the United Kingdom, where the charges of criminal financial fraud have actually been filed and where the laws of the UK (not those of the US or the rest of the world) apply.

The British press has a well-earned reputation of being tough on fraudsters.

Gospel Principles, Chapter 31: Honesty


The 13th article of faith says, “We believe in being honest.” The Book of Mormon tells us about a group of people who were “distinguished for their zeal towards God, and also towards men; for they were perfectly honest and upright in all things; and they were firm in the faith of Christ, even unto the end” (Alma 27:27). Because of their honesty, these people were noted by their fellowmen and by God. It is important to learn what honesty is, how we are tempted to be dishonest, and how we can overcome this temptation.

Complete honesty is necessary for our salvation......

Lying is intentionally deceiving others. Bearing false witness is one form of lying. The Lord gave this commandment to the children of Israel: “Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour” (Exodus 20:16). Jesus also taught this when He was on earth (see Matthew 19:18). There are many other forms of lying. When we speak untruths, we are guilty of lying. We can also intentionally deceive others by a gesture or a look, by silence, or by telling only part of the truth. Whenever we lead people in any way to believe something that is not true, we are not being honest.

The Lord is not pleased with such dishonesty, and we will have to account for our lies. Satan would have us believe it is all right to lie. He says, “Yea, lie a little; … there is no harm in this” (2 Nephi 28:8). Satan encourages us to justify our lies to ourselves. Honest people will recognize Satan’s temptations and will speak the whole truth, even if it seems to be to their disadvantage.


https://www.lds.org/manual/gospel-principles/chapter-31-honesty?lang=eng

Mormons are like an arrogant sea Captain, so sure of the might of his country, and the supremacy of his mind, that he can't imagine a world where he could ever fail. He stands on his deck, behind the helm, trying to steer his ship, even as the bow vanishes beneath the water, after he has piloted into some obstacle.

The only honest Mormon is an exMormon.

"Are they inviting me to sue them for libel?"

I've been wondering about that since the first attempt to smear you with the statement about Bizarre allegations. The pinch they are in, obviously, is that there only defense to your allegations is to lie. If Monson chooses not to lie, then he must plead guilty.

"Is there no one on your planet who behaves in a way that's contrary to reality?"
http://www.hark.com/clips/lfjrwpwwfz-is-there-no-one-on-your-planet-who-behaves-in-a-way-thats-contrary-to-reality

They have no choice about lying in public. The entire church is

built on lies, they have to keep lying to keep the church going.

They make 7 billion dollars a year from tithing alone.... they

do not want to come clean and admit its all a huge pile of crap.

Keep in mind, this religion is a business, they are in it to

make money and as long as they lie they will be making money.

"Are they inviting me to sue them for libel?" - Tom I would consider this your engraved invitation to sue them for libel....
I continue to thank you and be appreciative of all you do. We are helping you as much as possible, but if there is something specific we can do, HOLLER!

saucie is right - the CULT is pretty much between a rock and a hard place. They have to lie no matter what they do. Unfortunately they have 184 years of experience in lying so they are good at it. But not good enough. Tom, you have them on the run. We have your back and I personally and very proud of you for having this kind of courage.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/12/2014 05:08PM by verilyverily.

Does anyone know if there were early apostles and leaders that received their second annointing and later left TSSC? I was wondering if anything was ever said about them by the prophets?

They are a fraud, thus acting as such. Their statement is for the beleivers, who are used to their church lying and just stick their head in the sand. The world at large has already dismissed mormonism as the hoax that it is.

When it becomes widely known that these are not 'bizarre allegations' the cult story will change, and the brainwashed will go along with the new story, forgetting the old.

Hopefully along the way, many will wake up to the fraud. Hopefully my family will be among them.