It never came up when I was a member, so I have no experience with the attitudes or policies regarding transgendered individuals.

I'm asking because my husband has recently come to the conclusion that he should be a she. It's not actually too much of a surprise. He always was different from other men, never had guy friends. I'm more of a tomboy than him even. Lol! I enjoy the great outdoors, camping, sports, landscaping, woodworking, always did the home repairs, etc. None of that ever interested him.

I've had awhile to get used to the idea and am comfortable enough to talk about it in a safe place, where family members wouldn't find out. He's been going through childhood memories, and now recalls that he basically lived like a girl when at home, until he was about 6. He had a dress-up trunk and always wore dresses and wigs, and even had a girl's name he gave himself. At about 6, his parents took away his dress-up stuff that was girly, took away his dolls or any girly toys, and started making him play with other boys. He'd always preferred playing with girls. I've seen some home videos of him as a kid, and he was very effeminate, acting a lot like our own daughter.

So I know his parents stifled his female attributes and pushed him toward boy stuff. He's never had a good relationship with his father, a sports fan and outdoorsman. He would like to pursue gender therapy in the future, after he gets some health issues under control and loses weight. We've talked openly about it. His gender dysphoria isn't to the point where he's suicidal or anything, but he did come out of a huge funk after realizing this and accepting it. He's no longer escaping into video games and neglecting his body. He's more attentive, more nurturing, more help around the house and with the kids. He's a different person; a better person. He's trying to find a counselor right now that specializes in transgendered issues for him to see, and us to see as a couple too. He wants to take hormones eventually, wants to transition.

I'm scared to death of how this will affect his parents, his family relationships. I know his family were big supporters of Prop 8. They are very anti-gay too. If he transitions, it will mean that they have a daughter who is legally married to another woman and in a lesbian relationship. I don't think his folks could handle it in the least. His whole family on his mom's side are very Mormon; not a single jack or exmo in the bunch. Thankfully, his dad's side is more diverse. His uncle is a Methodist minister, but his congregation accepts everyone regardless of faith, gender, sexual orientation, etc. His aunt has lesbian aunts who attend and are close to his family. One of his uncle's kids is an atheist, like us too.

I'm really afraid that his family, at least his parents, grandparents, and mother's side will completely disown him.

Has anyone known a Mormon or former Mormon who is a transexual and has pursued transition? Does anyone know what the church's policy is on transgendered people and how that might affect his relationships with his family? Thanks.

TTFN,
Jenn

It's grounds for excommunication.

but I was taught that God doesn't make that kind of mistake, putting women in men's bodies and vice versa.

I have a PDF of the 2006 Handbook of Instructions, Book 1 for Stake Presidencies and Bishoprics. I don't see anything specific to gender identity in the section of policies on "moral issues"--just "homosexual behavior" and "same-gender marriages," both of which I imagine would apply if your husband stays married to you and lives as a woman.

According to this, there's no official policy for this situation:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexuality_and_The_Church_of_Jesus_Christ_of_Latter-day_Saints

Whatever the time limit is, it expired while I was editing.

I didn't see "transsexual operation" in the index and didn't think to look in the section on disciplinary councils. See Heresy's post below.

The CHI also says a person who "has undergone a transsexual operation" may not have the priesthood or a temple recommend and their baptism has to be authorized by the First Presidency. So I guess if some rich transsexual wanted to join the church, they might authorize that.

And there obviously IS an official policy on the status of transgendered persons. It is that they are allowed to pay tithing.

I think you know how his family will react. The church values gender roles so much that there is simply no room for acceptance of natures natural but unusual cases.

I'm glad you've adjusted so well. He is lucky to have so much support, especially after his family learns about it.

Church Handbook of Instructions, 2006, page 111

Transsexual operation

Church leaders counsel against elective transsexual operations. If a member is contemplating such an operation, a presiding officer should inform him of this counsel and advice him that the operation may be cause for formal Church discipline. Bishops refer questions on specific cases to the stake pres. He may direct questions to the office of the 1st presidency if necessary.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/18/2010 03:46PM by Heresy.

You can't even get a straight answer out of the Church Handbook of Instructions.

Well, it's a good thing we resigned nearly 6 yrs ago then. LOL!
Not that he'd care if he were excommunicated if he hadn't left when I resigned.

My question is Jenn...how are you?? I know you have been through a ton lately and I worry about you and even if you suspected, this must have been a pretty big shock.
I know you love each other and are good for each other, so I am sure you will get through together, but still, I worry with all the illness, kid issues and everything. Take care of yourself hun.

A fascinating new adventure for you and your husband to experience together! :-) And kind of wonderful, given the amazing lives you, he, and your family have already lived together.

I'm happy for all of you, because the way you present this, it this sounds like something you're all going to benefit from as the journey unfolds.

I wish you all the very best, and the happiness all of you deserve.

One thing: Did you know there is a 2003 film titled NORMAL, starring Jessica Lange and Tom Wilkinson, which is available on DVD from Netflix? I just saw this recently, and it's an important film with very good insights. It's about a conservative, church going, Midwestern farm country family, married twenty-five years, when the husband reveals that he's transgender and wants to transition to female, including SRS. (The male-to-female surgery.) The film shows how this year-of-him-transitioning affects his wife, his children, his birth family, his church and the church community, and his blue collar job and job mates, and the people in his small farming town--all of the important people in his life. The film DID address all of the important issues, including sex with his wife (both during the transition and afterwards), and how to deal with the transition with his children (his young daughter, who begins to menstruate during these months, and his adult, out-on-his-own son). There's a lot packed into this film, and it's all done very well. I'm very glad I saw it.

I wish you all the best, eloher. It sounds to me like your husband definitely picked the right wife to share his life with!

I wish the very best for all of you.

A book you both might enjoy is Crossing: A Memoir by Deirdre McCloskey. Professor McCloskey is an economist by training, but also teaches English literature and history at the University of Chicago. She transitioned in her 50s and wrote a memoir about the whole experience. Unfortunately, her children haven't accepted it and she's not spoken with them since 1995. I enjoyed the memoir very much.

You may wish to see her website.

http://www.deirdremccloskey.com/index.php

I really am doing ok. It was a shock, I had a few hard weeks, but we're ok, I'm ok. My hubby has come out of a funk/depression he'd been in for years. He's happy now. Just admitting it, having goals to work toward, have changed his whole outlook on life. He's much more attentive, caring, supportive, and no longer burying himself in his video games. He's like a different person. It's been great. I hope it lasts.

I found "Normal" for $7 at Amazon. At that price, it was certainly worth buying. We both loved it. It was a wonderful movie with great insight into transitioning and the effect it has on the family. I read a book, "Luna" too, which is about a teenage transgendered boy/girl and his younger sister. Both the book and movie opened up opportunities for lots of communication/discussions between us.

When it comes down to the basics, it's an easy decision. We love each other. We are best friends. We have a great honest, open relationship. We've weathered some serious problems already, including leaving the church, a horribly stressful adoption, and my health problems, and just came out stronger. We have a family together that we worked very hard to create(1 bio child and 3 adopted through foster care). He's basically the same person. Nothing has really changed. We work so well together, I just can't ever imagine having that with another person. I don't believe in soul mates or fate, but if I did...we were meant to be together. I'm also glad that we live in more liberal CA, and that he works in San Francisco when he does go into the office. It would certainly be more daunting if we lived in UT or the South, or just about anywhere else.

Thank you all for your kind words, your concern, and info. I appreciate it.

TTFN,
Jenn

Good luck to both of you, I hope that those emotionally close to the two of you have the acceptance that you posses.

I would not be very optomistic about the Mormon side of the family being understanding. It might not be a great loss, however.

Oh, I think my husband's family will probably disown him. I really don't hold out much hope that they will be accepting at all. I forsee them leaving CA and moving to UT to be closer to his sister. After all, she's probably all they'll acknowledge as having left. I know they love our children and they love my husband and I, but this will be too much for them to handle. I really wish I had more hope for their relationship with my husband to continue like usual, but I don't think they have it in them. I won't support our children visiting them or having much to do with them if they can't accept my husband as he is, as she is...when the time comes. They are not the kind to abide by our wishes and I know they would talk ill of us in front of our children. We've already run into problems regarding church issues, where they've overstepped their boundaries as grandparents IMO.

I hope I'm wrong. Time will tell.

Oh my goodness...you have gone and will be going through so much! My input here is to give you both, a dose of realism as well as of hope. Many years ago, I was on intimate terms with GAs and one of them had a son who was overdosing on drugs as well as parading in town (downtown SLC) in women's clothing. One day, I called to see how they were doing and asked how Julian (not his name) was doing. Their response was that he was no longer their son...they no longer had a son called Julian. Julian spent some time at the mental institution in Provo. Though I was young, I was astounded that someone with the inferred wisdom attributed to a GA would turn their back on their child. He realy was a good kid except for...those problems. A few months later, when I stopped by their house for a visit, they had welcomed Julian back into their home and were lovingly supporting him with his recovery!

So, although your TBM relatives may seem to reject you, if they love you all as you express it, give them time, this is a high shock situation, they will come to embrace you all back!

I wish you the very best. You sound very strong!

I admire your love and support of your spouse. I'm lucky enough to have a wife who has gone through hell being married to a bi-bordering-on-gay, addiction-prone and mental-health challenged husband and still stuck by me. You bring a smile to my face this morning thinking about how wonderful my wife has been to me, as you have been to yours.

Even through all that, I'm not 100% positive she'd be able to deal with it if I were to come out as transgendered, and I can't say I blame her. While I do think she'd love and accept me, I don't know that she'd be able to remain married to me.

You must be an incredibly strong individual to be as loving and accepting as you are and your husband/wife is very lucky to have you. That's really what's important - screw his family if they disown him. (I was going to say screw them if they can't handle it, but in reality they probably won't be able to at first. It's the long-term acceptance that matters.) You and your children *are* his family, I think more often as time goes on that unconditional love and support is what makes a family, not blood relations.

On behalf of both my wife and I, we wish you the best of luck.

First the brain/spine surgery, now the transgendered husband. I already know the issues with your kids (practically identical to mine all the way around).

I honestly don't know how you are even functioning at this point! I'm glad you've found a safe place to work through all of these issues.

I don't know specific church policy - but it is surely not good for transgendered folks. I know you guys have resigned and are athiests now anyway, so I'm assuming you are asking your question so you can gauge the eventual fall-out from your TBM family members.

From your other posts, it already sounds like your MIL is distant, unhelpful and judgmental . . . so I'd say that's pretty much your answer if hubby suddenly ups and becomes a woman. You have zero support from his family anyway - that's definitely not likely to change.

I'd look to the GLBT community for support.

You are amazing to choose to stay in the marraige - I'm not so sure I could do it.

(((((((HUGS)))))))

;o)

Wow! What did I miss out on--brain and spine surgery!

This will be a tough road--but what I see is also that he can finally be true to himself. It isn't always EASY for someone in your position. I really believe, at this point, life is what you make it. I'm very much at peace in my unconventional life.

Even though your husband isn't gay, I did like how this guy handled his family situation (I am blown away by how unloving families can be when presented with these situations)--but "Perfect: . . . " (I can't remember the name of the book!?!?)--something about the journey of a gay mormon that can be found on lulu.com

Good luck and keep us posted--we'll be pulling for you.

Oh--I was going to say and forgot--the attitude will be "see how far you fall when you leave the church?"

I was told some years after we left the church that my ex had then "chosen" to be gay--just kind of the natural course of those who don't cling to the teachings. THEY NEVER considered (even after being told) that he was gay all along--EVERYONE (not most of my family--thankfully my family is not extreme TBM--but even my extremely TBM aunt loves my ex--she has a gay son of her own)--but all the ward members were waiting for us to fall flat on our faces and they have a really hard time dealing with the fact that we haven't.

Much of the time, there are misunderstandings that are easily worked out.

Maybe you can hire a teenager to help with the kids after school, for instance, also.

I had contact with a "sister", Brandi, who was an RM. I think the worst that happened to her was that "he / she / they" could not exercise priesthood and could not marry a man in the temple.