http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/13/opinion/sunday/will-this-election-be-the-mormon-breakthrough.html?pagewanted=all

"The accurate critique of Mormonism is that Smith’s religion is not even monotheistic, let alone democratic. Though the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints no longer openly describes their innermost beliefs, they clearly hold on to the notion of a plurality of gods. Indeed, they themselves expect to become gods, following the path of Joseph Smith. "



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/13/2011 08:14PM by PtLoma.

I think it must be the dementia of the aged leadership of the LDS church that can be the only reason they have not coerced Romney to get out of the race.

If they are considering the publicity the church will recieve if Romney becomes the candidate will be positive, they are very mistaken. The kindergarten logic of their spin will be very exposing of the LDS fraud.

I would just love to hear one of the pundits questioning the notion that Jesus was actually making grape juice.

I am hoping Romney is the candidate just to watch them squirm.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/13/2011 08:25PM by deco.

Agree. If he is nominated, TSCC will be placed under a microscope like never before. Their aged leadership may think that other Americans see them as just another Christian church, but they are badly mistaken.

The article failed to mention that Orson is Mitt's great-great-great uncle. (But wish the article had quoted Sarah Pratt instead.)

Here is what I think might happen.

Anyone who dares to question Romney about religion will get a flat rebuke for daring to bring up his religion. The questioner will be made into a religion intolerant prying jerk just for stating the obvious. Romney will not answer anything.

I'd love to have someone flat out ask about keeping his covenant made in the temple to put the church first and how he can possibly honestly represent the American people having made that promise.

Even if they did ask that, he would probably reply that Mormons believe in obeying the law of the land, blah, blah.

He can't deny making the oaths, because it would look like he flip flopped. Oh wait. That's normal for him.

I think that Romney is adept now at villainizing the person who dares bring up his religion and will get sympathy if someone makes that an issue.

No one is going to ask an Evangelical candidate if they really believe some crazy thing from the Bible point blank. Everyone cuts religious people wiggle room to allow for the nonsense they may or may not actually believe. If the candidate starts spouting religious nonsense, like some of the recent candidates have, that's one thing. However I don't think Romney will randomly start spewing anything that sounds like Mormon doctrine ever.

It will be interesting. Huntsman doesn't scare me like Romney does. I wonder if Huntsman would get Hillary's job if the GOP won.

Anyway, we can even see even from the small world here on RfM that people who corner anyone about their religion are viewed as a bully. I think that is how journalists will be treated if they try to corner him. Never mind if they are just trying to get him to clarify his stance. Religion is a protected topic and they pay a lot of money to keep it that way. Everyone is expected to respect a person's religion, deserving or not.

I'd like to write the following letter to newspaper editorial pages:

"Between the start of Mitt Romney's mission in the late 1960s and April 1990 (when major changes were introduced to the temple ceremony), Romney attended the temple endowment ceremony a minimum of 250 times, since the minimum standard for temple attendance is once a month. Given his twelve year service as a bishop and later a stake president, he likely attended more often than once per month.

During those 250+ sessions, he participated in:

--over 250 oaths in which he vowed to put the church before all else
--over 250 mockings of a Protestant minister as hireling of Satan
--over 250 ritual slittings of his throat, chest, and abdomen, (750+ ritual slittings in all) as "ways in which life can be taken" for those who discuss the temple ceremony with outsiders.

There is no evidence to suggest that Romney disagreed with any of these strange dogmas and rituals, and as stake president his role was to promulgate such rituals.

Still think you'll vote for him for President?"



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/14/2011 12:02AM by PtLoma.

Do it.

And even worse, has probably had a second anointing which deletes any and all accountability for ones actions.

Whether the candidate is asked the question is not the question.

If Romney is the candidate the media itself will do the digging, and they will find some of the more interesting facets of the LDS faith. There will be cover stories on LDS Inc over many magazines, blogs etc. It will not be about Romney, it will be about Mormonism. It will also not be the churches version of the 'truth'

Romney, and for that matter the church as a whole will be forced to deal with it (spin) because until now most people have not cared what mormons think or believe.

When an opponent, or a media outlet such as large readership blog starts to get info- such as the systematic questioning of prepubescent children about masturbation, Romney, or the church will not be able to get a blanket pass on the tough questions.

This will get interesting.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/13/2011 09:07PM by deco.

(c) All of the Above.

Romney is a gold mine for the media. They are tired of having to be "nice" around America's first black president. Church should be concerned. I am sure the GAs have realized this is a numbers game. The just need to sort through and find the gullible ones left.

If we get a mormon president all it will show is the Mormons are just as corrupt as anyone else. Romney has already demonstrated he is capable of lying and telling you what you want to hear.

It helps the church when it's ignored or politely patronized by the media, but when there's a prolonged spotlight...it gets the members thinking about things they normally don't think about.

I don't think the general public would care that much about Romney's religion, and I don't think they should. That's not the danger for the church. The public never EXPECTED to agree with his religion, only to approximately agree with his politics if they vote for him (except for some sectarian minorities who are driven by their own religious dogma and want an ultra-christian president). The public is largely used to abstract interpretation of religion anyway, and used to pluralism, used to people having another religion, and used to people taking liberties with their own religion, not assuming that because you have a religion you believe it all literally, and not assuming that one's private practice of a religion is imposing on others. I think Romney has largely shown that religion is private to him and that he won't take orders from the church in presidential matters. I believe him (I'm not voting for him, I'm voting Dem, but if I was voting Rep, I'd vote for Romney because the other candidates are, ironically, blatantly religious!)

So I think there's little danger that Romney would make the church look bad in the public's eyes or vice-versa.

BUT, I think there's SIGNIFICANT danger that the constant cognizance of MEMBERS about Romney's Mormonism (while they're overestimating how much everyone else cares) will make them insecure about their own Mormonism.
Some Mormons tend to greatly exaggerate the hostility of criticism, and take light, ordinary, everyday garden-variety disagreement, scrutiny, and skepticism as the influence of Satan...and with a Mormon in the election or in office they're going to be getting just that...all the time. It's not going to affect the public much, but it's going to be a constant reminder to members of whatever their private insecurities are...insecurities that used to just lay low between media storms, which were short enough to ride out anyway.

And, the public isn't going to care if Romney is living up to Mormonism...but some mormons are. See Harry Reid. He gets mormon hate mail.

I wonder if mormon mishies in other countries would bring it up? How would they be received?

I was a mormon mishie in Japan and we always used to talk about the Two Kents and some Japanese chick who were famous members.

I hadn't thought of this issue before tonight.