I'm just curious as to your take on a kerfluffle that just happened between a friend and her friend(?).

My friend has bipolar and we just recently moved in together. It's a pretty nice situation -- we've known each other for decades and together we can afford a far better house than otherwise. Also, I am now employed part-time as her caregiver, doing what I would be doing anyway.

An old friend of hers from before we met showed back up in her life just as my friend and I were deciding to move in together. This woman has been a source of stress and anxiety to say the least.

She makes mean comments to my friend. Things like: "Boy I wish I had a caregiver so I could sit around all day." or "You can't do anything. Even cooking flusters you."

And she'd alternate these attacks with conversations that were innocuous. Oh, and she'd do it in the evenings, when someone with bi-polar starts to be more vulnerable.

So I convinced my friend (with her counselor's support) to call a halt to conversations after 6 pm.

Guess who just HAD to talk to her "just for a minute" or "just to give her a scripture" every night after 6?

Finally, today, after a lot of encouragement from me, my friend told her how she kept feeling after the hit and run comments. Her friend's response?

She flipped! She called me, apparently unaware that I'd been in the room the entire time. Insisted that my friend was very mean and attacked her. Kept it up even after I informed her I was right there and heard every word she said and KNEW that this wasn't an attack on my friend's part. Went on Facebook to post passive aggressive attacks. Etc.

So, just out of curiousity -- what does this sound like to those of you with experience.

(The nice thing is that I think the friend of a friend is probably going to disappear for a while -- not that I'm going to be upset.)

To me? Sounds more like NPD than Borderline, but I guess symptoms can cross.
Good on you for encouraging your friend to stand up for herself. Tell the frenemy to kick rocks!

It is the hardest thing in the world for her to stand up for herself.

I've praised her to pieces for her awesome stand. :)


On a side note any of you who've dealt with this sort of person...

Am I being overly optimistic to hope she'll take her marbles and leave? Should I expect her to return to renew the hostilities?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/27/2013 07:51PM by Rebeckah.

It's possible, but as long as your roomie keeps her brass ovaries on call, then the frenemy will take off and find someone else to abuse.

I've got her back, which helps, I'm sure.

Also, she's in a GREAT church that is totally supportive.

In fact, they're totally supportive of the frenemy too, but she can't let herself stay there. Maybe they're TOO supportive and she can't handle that they give her nothing to be mad about. ;)

I concur... I've had dealings with this type of person. A show of strength will get her to back off. Trouble is, they can be so nasty and underhanded that it can be hard to be strong around them. They prey on nice people who don't stand up for themselves.

Here's my take on what she is doing. She has come back into the life of your bi-polar friend because there is something that she wants from her. The methodology she is using is called 'trangulation'. She is driving a wedge between the two of you, so as to better control the situation. To drive the wedge she will, more than likely use smear tactics, using little negative remarks about you when you are not around. Never allow her to be alone with her. Your bi-polar friend is vulnerable, and may fall for it.

My mother did this with my sister and me, as she knows that my sister is emotionally vulnerable and would believe her. It worked.

When an NPD person is outed, like you did with her, they will go on an all out attack. It's called narcissistic rage, and can be very dangerous, in many ways. They will stop short at nothing to destroy the person who inflicted their narcissistic injury. In this case, it was you. Be careful, or she will isolate you from all of your other friends. She will literally steal your goodness, and project all her sick ways on to you, making you look like the bad one.

I really feel for you. NPDs often target kind caring people, like you are. If you would like to discuss this more, I can give you my email address.

As an example, last my NPD mother evicted me from a home I had bought from her. She reneged on the deed after the mother was paid, and I had no other choice but to leave, or she would have taken me to court. NPDs mean business when they are thwarted.

Just tell me what name to look for in case it gets sent to spam.

On the plus side -- my friend with bi-polar IS vulnerable but it's doubtful that she'll believe a smear campaign against me. We've been friends for decades and I've always been there for my friend. Right now, with me as her caregiver, has been the best her life has ever been (not that I'm saying I'm so wonderful -- it's just that she's had a pretty shitty life until just recently.)

However, the frenemy HAS tried dropping divisive stuff in conversations with each of us -- but my friend and I either talk to her while we are both in the same room or we talk via the written word. And neither of us have accepted "Don't tell ____ what I said..." from her. (Which is probably why she's now claiming she's been talked about "behind her back".)

Thanks. I'm really hoping she moves on to another victim but the aunt she was tormenting before my friend has just moved to another state and I'm not sure if there's anyone else in her life she finds vulnerable enough to be a victim. We'll see.

I'll send you my email address shortly.

I see the picture. The aunt moved, and the 'frenemy' lost a good source of narcissistic supply. So she moved on to your friend.

Oh, and the term I mentioned is spelled 'triangulation'.

That sounds like my ex-wife. She could not have any faults of any kind, and she would fight to the death to keep from having to acknowledge them -- no matter how insignificant. She would find fault with me so that she could deflect criticisms against herself. She wasn't actually evil, but she couldn't stand any criticism of any kind and she would completely lose her shit if she was confronted with anything. I think she was NPD, but she was never diagnosed. She refused to see a counselor, since it was impossible for her to have any flaws that might require help outside herself.

So, my friend went to church. Frenemy showed up (in spite of claiming she was done with this church now). Waited until the friend was about leave and got an unsuspecting church member to send her back in to "talk".

Friend thought that they were going to talk it out with the Pastor and his wife but it was more of an ambush (because the "Bible says to go to someone and make things right"). She assures me (through a barrage of text messages) that she was kind, and gentle, and loving, etc. etc. etc.

I basically kept repeating that if she wanted to "make things right" and "restore unity" then she needed to call the Pastor and his wife and set up a meeting time. She's finally said she would but I rather doubt she will.

Friend is devastated at being blindsided. Terrified of frenemy because she's talking about telling the Pastor and his wife all about everything she's ever done (and I'm sure a few of you are aware that a person with bi-polar can do some pretty inappropriate things in a manic phase) and so on.

Long story short -- I'll be attending church with my friend again. At least when Taunya has a witness the frenemy pretends to be nice.

Rebekah, is your friend at the point yet where she sees that the other woman is no real friend to her? If not, can she be brought to that point?

I had a "friend" like that as a child -- alternately nice and mean. The nice parts blinded me for a long time, but it got to the point where the meanness won out and I decided I was finished with her.

Unfortunately, her self esteem is still low enough that she's blaming herself a lot and she's terrified of this woman revealing all the things she's shared with her. (Bi-polar manic phases have left her with some regretted actions, although speaking as a non-religious person they're really minor things. But as she's really religious, they prey on her mind.)

Anyway, she's been blocked on Facebook and with any luck won't be calling or going to that church anymore. Supposedly she's willing to set up a conversation with the Pastor and pastor's wife but I'll believe that when I see it.

It appears my armchair psychology is wrong but I was in the ballfield. :)

(Meaning, I think you guys are right and it's actually NPD.)

Well, we'll see what happens. I'm not looking forward to going to church three times a week again. Not even a church as nice as this one.

I don't know about official diagnoses. NPD sounds likely, but even if the person is not a narcissist, they are an a--hole.

It definitely sounds like Cluster B. I'd leave it to the professionals to make the distinction. To the average Joe it's almost six of one, half a dozen of the other. A poison you and your roommate friend don't need.
The Cluster B has latched onto your vulnerable friend, and people troubled by either BPD or NPD can do that.