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Posted by: ExMormonRon ( )
Date: March 28, 2011 10:28AM

..someone stated that the church outlaws oral sex. That's not exactly right. In January 1982, Ol' Spence wrote a letter to Stake Presidents that stated, basically, that the first presidency had decided that oral sex as an "unwholesome and impure practice". Well, that started a shit-storm because some bishops and SP's started asking that in worthiness interview. Rut roh, said Spence and the boys.

Here's the link to the letter (see, specifically, page 2):

http://www.lds-mormon.com/worthy_letter.shtml

The following was posted by "Nick" on RfM about 7 years ago and he says it better than I ever could:

The First Presidency sent a letter (copies of it are available on the web) to Bishops and Stake Presidents (not intended for distribution to the membership at large), including the statement that they (the FP) viewed oral sex as an unnatural, unholy practice.

Several months later, the FP sent out another letter (according to several accounts, though copies of it don't seem to be nearly as readily available), which did not mention oral sex directly, but stated that Bishops and SPs should not ask about specific sexual practices in Temple Recommend interviews — indeed, even if members asked about specific sexual practices between married couples, the interviewer should not weigh in with an official pronouncement as to whether those practices are right/allowed/tolerated/etc. Whatever the truth about this second letter, the current TR guidelines state that the only sexually-oriented question that should be asked is whether the interviewee is "living the Law of Chastity".

This second letter is viewed as a tactical retreat from the hard line, without actually retracting the earlier letter (since oral sex is not mentioned explicitly).

Of course, the church is lousy with Bishops and SPs who believe it is their divine duty (as well as a way to earn more Celestial Kingdom points) to hold their flocks to a higher standard than the membership at large; also there are undoubtedly plenty (just as there are in other faiths) who get vicarious thrills from knowing the details of the sexual lives of those in their charge. So, there continue to be reports of Bishops and SPs asking about (and/or condemning) oral sex in TR interviews, priesthood talks, etc.

Further, because the Mormon culture at large operates largely in absence of official doctrine, rumors are a major factor in how its members view oral sex and other sexual practices (besides masturbation, which continues to be condemned at every opportunity). Countless Mormons "know" that oral sex is wrong, because they heard it from their RS/priesthood friends/family/etc. — even if they have never heard any sort of official pronouncement on the subject from a Bishop or Stake President.

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Posted by: EssexExMo ( )
Date: March 29, 2011 04:19PM

This is my experience.

My wife and and were *particularly* told that oral sex was against the standards for a temple worthy couple.

It DID impact our sex life.

I NEVER heard any local or general authority say "Sorry about that oral sex thing.,.... It's OK to do it now"

if you're brought up in an environment where you hear the Bishoprick or SP condemn oral sex, with the backing of some profit...... and you never hear ANY current GA mention it (for good or bad) then is it not valid to say that 'the church condemns it'?

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Posted by: snb ( )
Date: March 29, 2011 04:24PM

Our own personal experiences can not in any way be viewed as official church stances. Perhaps it is the official stance of Bishop Douchebag from the 3rd Ward, but we can not say that Mormonism outlaws oral sex unless it actually outlaws oral sex.

A good example of this is that my mission president told me that masturbation is ok until I got married. In no way do I look at that and say that Mormonism allows masturbation.

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Posted by: EssexExMo ( )
Date: March 29, 2011 05:11PM

But this was not some random MP, this was stamped S.W.(al)K

sealed with a loving Kimball

and we all know that when the profit speaks the thinking has been done..... until a different profit decides that it would be more profitable to think something different.


swk said it was 'a bad thing'

has any profit since said 'no it isn't, it's a good thing'?

if no one since has *officially* changed the church's stance on the matter, is it not fair to say "This is the church's view of Oral sex"?

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Posted by: snb ( )
Date: March 29, 2011 05:15PM

Does a letter to a stake president count as official doctrine?

I'm actually not sure on that point.

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Posted by: ExMormonRon ( )
Date: March 29, 2011 05:18PM

Well, it was from Spencer so how do you read it?

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Posted by: snb ( )
Date: March 29, 2011 05:21PM

According to what Mormonism itself thinks about official doctrine, technically no.

Outside of Mormonism, I'm not sure that a trickle down doctrine like that should be considered official either. I doubt that the majority of Mormons believe in it.

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Posted by: T-Rex ( )
Date: March 29, 2011 04:50PM

I would like the GAs to come out and say that JS never got a blow job from any of his many mistresses, then we know for sure they are lying.

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Posted by: Anon for this ( )
Date: March 29, 2011 05:21PM

Old Spence was probably chit-chatting with his advisers and found that his wife never had and never would put out in that regard.

In a fit of pique, he then clearly decided that if he missed out, everyone else's fun would be ruined too.

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Posted by: Misfit ( )
Date: March 29, 2011 05:52PM

I was in a student ward at UofU in 89 or 90 when a bishop told the whole ward in a meeting that oral sex was wrong. Crazy.

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Posted by: Duder ( )
Date: March 29, 2011 07:34PM

Ex Mrs. D used to tell me she was uncomfortable with the oral because she knew it used to be out of bounds, as particularly condemned by SWK.

I told her we had a hard enough time living the current commandments, without trying to hold to suggestions that were no longer taught. I also pointed out to her that SWK made other statements that probably weren't doctrine any longer. I even pointed out to her that SWK extended the priesthood to black men, and that should be proof right there that we should focus on current doctrine instead of pointing to past pronouncements as evidence of God's will.

She told me I went to a great length to justify a tenuous position on something so trivial. It must mean a lot to me. I told her the same thing.

It was a while before I got another BJ.

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Posted by: BadGirl ( )
Date: March 29, 2011 07:41PM

makes me wonder how some of you males ever got any sex at all.
Terms like "put out" and "BJ"???
Hello? If you were bringing your woman to the heights of ecstasy FIRST, as you should be, you would have been getting the sex of your dreams...
Oral sex goes both ways... Maybe the Mormon male leaders just didn't want to "put out" in that regard...

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Posted by: Omg ( )
Date: March 29, 2011 08:01PM

Terminology is usually nothing more than a function of where one grew up.

But as regards the content of your post, no disagreement here.

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Posted by: Duder ( )
Date: March 29, 2011 08:30PM

and she was always willing to go for a handy. I just really really really enjoy oral - as both giver and receiver.

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Posted by: T-Rex ( )
Date: March 29, 2011 08:47PM

If I was included in your criticism, I intentionally use salacious terms when speaking of JS to underscore his perversions. The guy was a serious creep and exhibited deviant behavior. I don't think my 20 word posts would have the same bang if I said, "I would like the General Authorities to come out and say that the Prophet, Seer, and Revelator engaged in lovingly mutual excitement and gratification that ultimately led to fellatio with his dear wife."

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Posted by: unworthy ( )
Date: March 29, 2011 09:45PM

I always maintained if you don't have oral sex,,missing half your sex life. The one thing that me and my ex had even in the last days of our marriage was a great sex life. I always wonder when she remarried and went through the temple,,did she give up oral???

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