It occurred to me that this may be the first step in eliminate the entire Book of Mormon from the Church's standard credo.

It's harder and harder to justify what is in it. So first step: de-emphasize it. Next push it back to the rear of the shelf. In a generation or two, perhaps eliminating it all together.

We've seen these progressive steps before - eliminating polygamy, denying the racist stance with respect to blacks in the priesthood - and later, simple things like discounting Miracle of Forgiveness, Mormon Doctrine, Journal of Discourses.

Perhaps in the future they won't use the BOM at all. If they get questioned by younger members, they can always say, "We explained that. Weren't you listening?"

I agree! This is their first step in a planned series to act as if the Book of Mormon is not part of their institution. Gradually, over time hope that it is relegated to dusty shelves then forget it entirely. (A bit like Community of Christ distancing itself from many of the texts?)

However, the great talents on Broadway won't let the Book of Mormon be forgotten ;)

It's possible that something like that will happen over time. There is no indication that it has begun yet in any serious way.

The missionaries are still using the Book of Mormon as their main prop/tool for recruiting new members. If I had to guess, it would be impossible to phase it out altogether within the next 50 years.

Unlike some things (like the JOD or King Follett discourse or parts of the temple ceremony), the Book of Mormon is too central to the church's identity--to the point that members are universally known as "Mormons" by most of the world.

OTOH, it wouldn't surprise me if they de-emphasize the full text and instead repackage it to only include highlights (i.e. more palatable, politically correct excerpts).

They could repackage it as a "Reader's Digest" version in booklet form (titled "The Book of Mormon Speaks to Our Time" or something like that.) At the same time, they could discourage members from studying the original full text, saying that the leadership has been inspired to focus the members' attention on passages and teachings that are most relevant to our time. They could also condemn people who make a "hobby" out of contentious interpretations of other contents are not in harmony with the spirit and that are not included in the teachings currently emphasized.

In other words, there are a lot of ways to make the most embarrassing parts fade away without completely abandoning it.

More long term, a lot can happen in 2 or 3 generations and I wouldn't be surprised if the church is gone or completely unrecognizable 130 years from now. Of course, what it is today would also almost be unrecognizable to members who lived in the polygamous (pre-Manifesto) version of the church that existed 130 years ago.)

Wally Prince, whoever you are, I like your ideas. The Mor--I mean, even the church of jesus christ of latter-day saints needs to hire you! You're a born business man!

Really, the Mormons might have to dump Joseph Smith, as well. They have already said that the scriptures aren't all that crucial, because they have a "modern-day prophet." The Mormons claim that whatever that modern-day prophet says overrides anything any previous prophet has said, that doesn't agree with the current prophet. Likewise, wouldn't "God's spokesperson on this Earth" supersede anything that has been previously written, also?

The Mormon scriptures will be like the old volumes of tax laws, updated quarterly, with hundreds of pages that have to be inserted in the appropriated sections, and hundreds of pages that have to be removed and thrown away. Well, they'll use computers, which make updates much easier, so there won't be any official printed "book," in the future. I already see Mormon members having trouble with the constantly changing interpretations and rules and vocabulary words and definitions, etc.

All these new updates will give the Mormons plenty to teach in the gospel doctrine and primary classes. They will never run out of changes and updates, for all eternity.

To eliminate the BoM entirely from TSCC would REQUIRE the ELIMINATION of it as a course study for one year in the CES seminary instruction AND the adults' gospel doctrine sunday school course study.

I don't see it happening.

To eliminate the BoM completely discredits Joseph Smith and every single general conference talk on 'its importance.'

You throw out the BoM, then you throw out Joseph Smith.

No more claims that the BoM is the 'keystone' of the religion.

I don't see that happening anytime soon. Nelson just spoke to 49k!!! members in Washington a few days ago and it's reported he was emphasizing to the crown the importance of reading the BOM.

My question...how much did it cost TSCC to rent that stadium??? Your tithing dollars at work.

I think it will take 60 to 100 years for LDS Inc to dump the BoM, and they may fail, but I think they are giving it the old "college try".

After the black priesthood ban was lifted, it took 25 years or so of GBH saying "that's all in the past", basically sidestepping the issue of admitting it was a racist policy, before the essay was released that finally did admit it was a racist policy. The essay didn't get wide exposure inside the church, but it is finally sort of on the record.

LDS Inc is very good at playing the long game.

The Hill Cumorah Pagent is still going strong. Acting out events that never happened. There is more truth in the BofM Broadway show than there is in that book of fiction. I guess lying to people is ok as long as you say good things about Jesus.

Until it learns the difference between truth and fiction, it is always going to get in the way.

It cannot remove the BoM. That is what gives it the distinction of being a cult.

It might also be a twenty year long segue to limiting the under rights/ little ones vocabulary reference and search engine terms. If songs and junior primary age teachers manuals coordinated church wide can distance the youngest from historic fraught vocabulary perhaps the central church headquarters can both steer or can maintain any cultural commandments routines as choice driven perhaps by primary songs. Watch the upcoming primary curriculum and song wording (vocabulary); for themes phrases doctrinal themes. Delineate the lifestyle that most important to them extricate the troublesome beliefs

Well <that last line- "delineate the lifestyle that's most important to them extricate the most troublesome beliefs" that's actually what I'd like to do, I dont actually know about them, at church headquarters! lol

Change the songs write new primary programs. Call generational leaders to primary chorister as per teachers. Inundate mothers with primary callings gain access to adults feathering nests with new doctrinal focus from coordinated weekly primary manuals paralleling new implemented ways taught through primary song lyrics

Encourage or script whole body and gestures in primary manuals as well as in primary choral numbers getting new ideas on board changing young families first

This could be a segue away from m o r m o n history, historic values, virtues & tragically unethical or paradoxical past incidents which contradict modern politics <kind of their version of extracting the statue from the park except they're erasing it from google maps label instead> what? It was never therr.....lol more convenient for the young <little ones>

More far more cognitive dissonance for the rest especially obedient scriptures scholars this change gonna ring a few bells like after an athlete in football ages gets confused. Mormon athletes the most obedient scripture based sincere oldsters might get a bell rung be confused when their lifelong self esteemed identity label gets refused by highest authority, they are no longer authorized to utilize their lifelong self and church authority based label privately or publically. The effort to change will need to be seamless one day, an authorized church identity with recommend and social status is called x and only inappropriate & unauthorized this unacceptable voices utilize old label <ie inactives, & gentiles/ outsiders) this making all writing & recorded videos inside the church "no longer authorized ie using old identifiers disbanded package /words"
As well all prior experience based writing here or anywhere...why did they gather and preserve all pioneer journals from families heirlooms (to package the descendants narrative stories neatly at church while actual family historic experiential writing was contained elsewhere)

It's a segue. Maybe that good old college try to keep the vest throw out the rest and limit the most indescribable unthinkable contradictory now abusive statements made by leaders in past m o r m o n his story

With enough faith, it can happen!

When I pass by the corner where the church built another mc meetinghouse, I just squint and the lovely pasture that existed before returns to my eyes.

My synagogue is getting paved over for a parking lot. (Pave Paradise, and put up a parking lot.)

Then, were someone to offer me 7.5m for my house to turn into a parking lot, I'd take it.

I hate seeing what progress does to old landmark buildings. It's sad.

"eliminate the entire Book of Mormon from the Church's standard credo"

Seems to me that would be an admission that Joseph Smith wasn't a prophet, he was just a conman.

The BoA already demonstrated JS was a conman. LDS Inc almost never mentions it anymore, though they still publish it, so far. I expect some day they will "update" their scriptures, dumping Moses and Abraham, and making the JS story part of the DandC. Presto change-o, no PofGP. Members will praise the inspired change.

That is their slippery slope. If they de-canonize the Pearl of Great Price it puts the Book of Mormon in jeopardy.

If they de-canonize the BoM, the entire 'house of cards' collapses! End of story.

Most members of the church don't care about doctrine. It's about being in a community. What keeps the church going is temple marriage. You look bad if you can't go to a relatives wedding and if you get married out of the temple you are less. The temple show is what keeps the church going. Why to you think they build so many on them? They could faze out the Book of Mormon. They would only have to cut it out from the primary programs and taper off talking about it in the conference talks and church publications. The Book of Mormon would be gone for the most part in 20 years.

You are probably right. I have noticed in conversing with some Mormons that they don't even know or seem to care about the teachings in the Book of Mormon. The basic belief that it is the keystone of Mormonism doesn't seem to matter, and the idea that if the Book of Mormon isn't true then Joseph Smith was a fraud doesn't seem to matter to them. It isn't even the same church that I once belonged to. Fairmormon really opened my eyes to how easily previous prophets and apostles are thrown under the bus. Even words from Joseph Smith are discarded. In fact, it was Fair that started me on my journey out of the church.

Yeah, I don't think they could get away with any formal de-canonization.

I think it will be a gradual de-emphasizing.

They already are increasingly having members focus on the official lesson manuals that are published each year. IIRC, they have also been discouraging members from supplementing the lesson manual content with their own research into things like the Journal of Discourses or scriptural passages that they think may be relevant to the lesson.

The idea that they are pushing on many levels is that the Church is providing them with pretty much self-contained lesson manuals that have inspired messages in them for our current times.

Don't mess up the inspiration by clumsily adding in your own research and, by all means, don't ignore the official lesson manual content and replace it with some hare-brained ideas you got studying the scriptures and historical works on your own.

As always, the Brethren are the experts. They have the inspiration needed to know what lessons are important in the here and now.

The standard works will always be there in the background. I think the Churchco management is just subtly trying to move them a few feet farther into the background every year...until at some point people won't really even want to carefully read them cover to cover, with any independent analysis. They'll just be there as props and for reading selected passages when instructed to do so by the official lesson manual.

Brother Of Jerry Wrote:
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> The BoA already demonstrate JS was a conman.

Conman he was! (and 24-7 poon-hound).

He was recruited and handled by educated flim-flam men whose names we know.

Those books were sharked up by those boy and fed to jo.

Scam religion.

I'm not so sure. The LAST think the church wants is for its members to read the New Testament without using the Book of Mormon filter.

The problem is the church gives us a new noun, but it does not give us a new adjective.

A Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints history site? That's just not going to fly.

Rusty needs a new adjective impressed on his mind.

Aren't they still pushing "ponderize" from 2015?

That's it!!!


The PONDERITES!

Why not call it the Bank of Jesus Christ. That's all the leaders seem to worship anyways; the money.

The LDS are stuck with the nickname Mormon. They tried to get rid of it back in the 80's and it didn't work. Won't work now.

And here I thought it was Big Nellie responding to my cousins' many posts on news article comments and such that the person in the story was "dumber than a Mormon".

Oh heaven forbid that the Keystone of our eternally unchangeable Religion could ever get any de-emphasization. Why I started posting here was because I want to do my part to help make sure that all apologetic efforts stay focused on accepting that the wondrous teachings of our beloved glorious gospel and peculiar legacy can never be ignored and that once a teaching has been declared as doctrinal that its with us for all eternity. If someone claims to be an apologist but they try to wiggle out of these things needing to be unchangeable then they are DISHONEST and such dishonesty could cause people to have doubts about the Church. Thus I shall give the Honest TBM answers, ummm I mean TB[long] as we've dropped the "M" in favor of a super long-winded phrase thanks to a recent super sacred revelation given to the super holy prophet Nelson, so people can see this wondrous legacy of ours for what it is in all honesty :) Heaven forbid that we ever allow anyone to try to get away with defending this wondrous legacy of ours via dishonest tactics. Thus I intend to post here, as time permits, for as long as there is a risk that some so-called apologist might decide to use dishonest tactics to try to defend this wondrous gospel.

So to be clear, the Book of Mormon is the keystone of the religion, period, and that can never be changed. One of the best ways to prove it true (as you read/ponder in preparation for praying) is to carefully analyze the DNA of most or almost all of the Native Americans and see that they have Hebrew genetic markers in them as literal descendants of the groups of Lehi and/or Mulek. If it wasn't for this being the case then the Church would of course be in serious trouble. Also keep in mind the prophecies about these Hebrew Lamanites blossoming as a rose so of course your Wards/Stakes around the world ought to be full of Lamanite descendants. Surely their numerous blogs, YouTube channels, and other online media help strengthen faith in all this. This is the keystone matter in the Church.

It also certainly helps to have D&C 77:6 reinforce the awesome scientific teaching about the age of the earth, having all the Egyptian symbols easy to find online to match up with the BoA facsimiles, the plethora of respect/stories about all of Joseph Smith's wives, the unwavering straightforwardness/honesty about polygamy, the powerful testimony about obeying your local leaders that the men in the Iron Stake taught us in 1857, the sacred record of a descendant of Ham in the Kinderhook Plates, and numerous other topics that I'm presuming that the faithful who study intently will be so overwhelmed with how open/transparent these topics are vigorously discussed in Primary/YM/YW/Sunday School/etc in all honest Wards/Branches of the Church :)

I'm presuming that when people read what I write and think to themselves "wow this Honest TB[long] person is so clueful, non-delusional, and that wondrous Church is so awesomely true, transparent, and honest --- I need to get assimilated" then they'll leave RfM and go to some "Recovery from Unassimilation" forum instead as they begin their labors to clean the chapels, obey the local overlords, and all the other things we amazingly have to do in this glorious peculiar religion. However I'm well-aware that my credibility is in horrible shape right now because I still haven't provided that link on the Church's website where you can find all the up-to-date summary financial/statistical/historical reports and get contact information to quickly answer any questions that such reports don't clearly answer. Oh where is that link so my credibility can be saved and you people not have an excuse to let evil Doubts form in your minds that might cause you to fall away from the Church and end up lovingly thrown into a lake of fire/brimstone by our loving Heavenly Father at Judgment Day.

Instead of saying “Mormon”, say “Mmm”.

I grew up “Mmm”, but I’m not “Mmm” anymore. Are you “Mmm”?

Mmm...no. I'm not. :)

I highly doubt it. Get rid of the Book of Mormon is getting rid of an entire cornerstone of the religion. What's the purpose of Joseph Smith without it? It's "another Testament of Jesus Christ" and that's "who the church is all about". Now, changing the name of the Book of Mormon I could see them doing. Or editing it down like another poster mentioned

My view is that it is the Mormon Church, members are Mormons and it will stay that way. Can't erase 200 plus years of history.

They could, in some distant future date, stop using the BOM. Not sure how that would work. They would have to get rid of all of Arnold Friberg's paintings (dozens of them, many in temples), all of the sales of the BOM figurenes by non Mormon merchandisers, and on and on.

They are not making it a total swoop. The Mormon Tab. Choir is still using the name and other place ...

Community of Christ managed to change their identity.

To some degree, the RLDS (now known as the "Community of Christ") did that.

They still have the Book of Mormon, but they don't give it equal rank to the Bible. They are now basically a mainstream-ish bible-based sect that has an odd and quaint history and they still sort of keep the Book of Mormon in the corner, in the back, in the dark, collecting dust...as a relic of that odd and quaint history, but they don't appear to feel any need to heavily promote it or spend time in Sunday School reading about the exploits of Ammon and the Jaredite barges that were "tight like unto a dish" and made great shakerato shake-mixers for livestock turd smoothies.

For a perplexing read, go to "mormon newsroom style guide"

auntsukey Wrote:
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> It occurred to me that this may be the first step
> in eliminate the entire Book of Mormon from the
> Church's standard credo.


Even at the extreme extent that the BS artists at LD$ Inc love and indulge in revisionism and denial and deceit (LYING) they can NOT jump dump the Book of MORmON. It is too integral to the MORmON BS story.