A test of loyalty to your religious oaths from a big-time NYC outfit? Waiting for a runner to get tomato juice?

https://ldsmag.com/article-1-15038/

Oh, merciful heavens, what a ridiculous story. Non-Mormons simply do not behave this way. If you don't want to share in a toast, simply lift your glass and set it right down on the table. Or request water from the waiter. Why send someone on a silly errand to find you tomato juice? That would be very poor manners. And absolutely no one cares (or will see it as a test of integrity) if you refuse alcohol.

I repeat, this is NOT how nevermos behave. Instead, this story is an example of Mormon virtue signaling. "I went into the belly of the beast and refused alcohol! And they respected me for it!" *sigh*

Who came up with this? Smells like a Paul H. Dunn story.

I'm sure this will be told from many Mormon pulpits now with that special faux spiritual voice they are all so good at.

On the other hand, we ate at Harmon's Kentucky Fried Chicken after I got my endowments in the SLC temple. We always went there when we were in SLC. It was good. No one offered us Sherry to test our faith.

I can't imagine any scenario where a Lehman executive would play "test a mormon" in that kind of situation.

If they knew one of the members of the team was in a religion that didn't eat pork, would they serve ham sandwiches to "test" that member?

If they knew one of the members of the team was a JW, would they offer him a free blood transfusion to see if he turned it down? "Hey, it's the way we do things here. We always have blood transfusions before signing the documents."

Totally absurd.

The only thing the Lehman people would care about in a financing deal would be the competence and reputation of those guys as business people, the value of the collateral they put up, the soundness of the business plan and their track record in past business dealings. They wouldn't give a rat's ass whether some Mormon does or doesn't drink alcoholic beverages. They only way it would be an issue would be if the guy did it in a rude way, like "I ain't drinking with these people."

Maybe Lehman Brothers should have spent more time testing subprime mortgages and less time testing potential clients religious beliefs.

I agree it sounds like your typical Mormon FPS.

This story reminds me of the propaganda story similar to the keeping the sabbath day holy ones. Didn't they use to make a big deal about the tannery making leather that would spoil on Sundays, but would be fine if the factory shut down until Mondays?

The worst part of these stories is that they are exaggerated and dishonest, but Mormons don't care as long as it's faith promoting.

This is a total BS story. Someone mentioned Paul Dunn. See my post about today's story about Millennial Mormons. I see mormons making a big show, turning their coffee cups upside down at breakfast restaurants, all the time. They can't just say "no" like Gentile patrons that don't want coffee? No. They always have to showboat.

Doesn't pass the smell test.

Right, Dave. Everyone waited for someone to run out for tomato juice? Has anyone ever seen a toast held up that long? And these wealthy men toast with cooking wine?

The story was clearly put together but someone who doesn't drink. And by someone who doesn't toast. Hmmmm...what sort of person might that be?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/29/2018 05:03PM by donbagley.

Interesting and ironic, even though we're talking a half-century's separation.

Yes, it has all the markings of faith-promoting fiction. A minor point for the challenge: They're in a restaurant, and somebody has to send a waiter out for tomato juice? They never serve Bloody Mary's?

Lastly, I find it implausible that a major investment banking group would set up a single make-or-break tripwire. Real adults in the business world don't pull such stunts.

Oh, my god. Only a Mormon would believe that tripe. What are the odds that the executives understood Mormonism? And even if they did, what are the odds they would care?

This is the kind of reach that Mormons pretend Mormonism has. They're lying to themselves.

I posted the article on facebook. I think it's an excellent example of Mormon thinking. Or lack of thinking, not sure.

It's an example of gullible mormons believing that the rest of the world is gullible. Nobody believes this shit. Except gullible mormons.

ziller can confirm this thred ~



ziller am tomato juice ~

What I find astounding is that the person who actually did write this did not know that the never-Mormon world is quite substantially populated with people who do not drink (for whatever reason: they are on medications which cannot be taken with alcohol, they have had previous problems with substance abuse themselves, they are the descendants or other relatives of alcoholics and do not want to mess with that possibility in their own lives, plus: there are many never-Mormons who just do not like the taste, or the effects, of alcohol).

What I see in this article is akin to what used to happen: someone sequestered in the former Soviet Union, or in China under Mao, or in North Korea now, trying to visualize a culture like the USA as they write a TV show, or film, or article about what they THINK American life is like--but their impressions and imagination totally fail them when they attempt to do this. (The WALL STREET JOURNAL used to periodically publish anecdotal stories of this type--a Russian head of state who visited the USA, for example, and misunderstood everything he was seeing, such as American supermarkets--and these were often incredibly funny anecdotes because they were SO FAR OFF of anything recognizably American.)

Obviously, whoever wrote this article just does not understand what actual, never-Mormon, culture is like.


EDITED TO ADD: The writer of this article also does not understand never-Mormon American manners. "People" just do not act like this, either in social situations or in the situation described in the article. (I have first-hand experience with this, because I am a vegetarian--so I have to go the "extra mile" in order to not offend those who eat meat, while simultaneously staying true to myself. The situation with someone who does not personally drink alcohol is identical.)



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 09/29/2018 06:51PM by Tevai.

If the Lehman executive had really acted in this way, it could have been characterized as a form of religious harassment.

You simply don't presume to insert yourself into another person's religious beliefs and faith in that way. Testing them? How presumptuous! What if the person in question was a Mormon from birth who had recently decided that they no longer believed?

No reasonable, non-Mormon executive at a prominent financial institution would even want to test a Mormon's testimony and dedication to Mormonism, other than as a joke or form of harassment (in which case, it would be the executive who would be shown to be an asshole).

Too bad this was never in an episode of 'Mad Men'. :-)


One thing I didn't realize was the "mormon" way of writing, especially "With everyone in the room carefully watching..." and "With a great sigh of relief, my father suddenly realized that he had successfully passed a critical part of the due diligence test..." and "He quickly went from having ridiculous morals to being the hero of the day."

Written like a GC speech, where most of the stories paint the protagonist as an outsider in a tight spot who wins because of his superior morals, i.e. he's mormon.

The guy's son wrote the thing, and says his dad's partner confirmed it, but I'll wager it didn't go down quite the way he wrote it.

It's the way people write who read a lot of Readers' Digest.

When I was growing up in Sandy, the first KFC was a sit down restaurant on the corner of State Street and 3900 South in South Salt Lake. I remember going there for dinner usually for my mom's birthday etc. They served more than just chicken dishes. The remnants of that building are still there and it's occupied by the fast food KFC, one of the few to have a KFC buffet.

Pete Harman who was a local businessman got the first franchise of KFC and it was called Harmon's Kentucky Fried chicken. They had a big restaurant on North Temple almost to 300 West and they advertised that it was the favorite restaurant for people going who were going the airport.

I'm not sure where Pete fits in this story we're, doubting, but at the one on 3900 S., there's a statue out front of Col. Sanders and Pete Harmon and inside there are several pictures and Col. Sanders memorabilia. (I admit it, I've eaten there before I go to the movie on 3300 S). In the early days, we went to one on Center Street in Midvale, and quite often you'd see Pete and/or his wife working behind the counter.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pete_Harman

https://imgur.com/a/EcFzRgi

I’ve heard several variations of this story, in different LDS contexts, with different individuals. The same message is, “The ‘gentiles’ are watching you!” Most nevermos have no idea about what’s acceptable or not, with the LDS healthcode. The Kentucky General’s Boner.

urban legend thru and thru...

This reminds me of a very old Mormon film about some military guy who didn't want to drink when they were doing a toast--he was warned he would be in some kind of trouble if he didn't drink, but he decided to "stay true to my principles". He ended up getting honored instead. I don't remember all the details but it was the same old, same old. Does anyone remember that old film?Does anyone want to?

He was the first Laminate* General Authority, who used to tell a variation of this meme. In his story, IIRC, he valiantly resisted efforts by the other Laminates to force him to drink alcohol.

The moral of the story seemed to be that if you stay true to the commandments and the gospel, you too can grow up to be a fine, upstanding "General Authority" and leader of the people, just like George.

A few years later, George was convicted of sex crimes, excommunicated for (the sex crimes, apostasy) and reportedly died at a relatively young age of complications caused by alcoholism.

So, yeah, always keep in mind how important it is to make a big public show of not drinking even one drop of alcohol, Show the world what it means to be a devout Mormon.


*To the tune of "Let's Call the Whole Thing Off":

You say Laminate, I say Lamanite
You say Moron-ee, I say Moron-aye
Let's call the whole thing off...

...is that this thread gave me a mighty hankering for fried chicken.

Do I need to point out that holy prophet and founder Joseph Smith, seeking "fortification" while in jail the night before engaging in a gunfight to the death, had his friends smuggle in a bottle of wine, which he happily partook of?

You know, the guy through whom the "word of wisdom" was supposedly revealed directly from Elohim?

Yeah, the story is bullshit.