Since I was a child, I've always just wanted everyone to get along and be happy. The downside of this was that I always changed my personality just enough around whomever I was with so they would like me and be happy with me. This was probably learned dealing with my parents, who tended to only pay attention to me "as far as I was translated correctly." In other words, if they liked what I was saying, doing, being, they paid attention to me. Otherwise, they pretty much ignored me.

The funny thing is that after the collapse of all my fake Mormon friendships, I realized that I don't care if people I don't respect don't like me. I thought of this today especially, when one of the counselors in the Primary presidency dropped by with my daughter's role in the Primary program next month. She is a nice enough girl - ex-BYU student, mid 20s, young, married, two kids and just got pregnant with #3. Very, very Molly Mormon. I told her, nicely but firmly, that my daughter wouldn't be participating. She looked surprised, then rushed to tell me it was OK...like she was scared to offend me. I know my evil bishop has been telling people I stopped attending because I was offended. He's an idiot but other people have been soooo cautious not to offend me again. It cracks me up because I'm not used to people bending over for ME. Usually, I feel it's the other way around. And I realized I don't care if any of these people talk about me, if they don't like it when I set boundaries, if they think bad things about me because... THEY AREN'T MY REAL FRIENDS. And I don't respect them, well, the ones that believed the gossip without even asking me about it. I haven't been rude or obnoxious to anyone so my conscience is clean. They don't have to like me and I really don't care. And that's a long overdue first.

Your attitude reflects a huge step in recovery! Congratulations on learning to be real and authentic. The rest of us have a lot to learn from your example.

I'd like to point out something else about the woman who showed up at your door. She assumed she knew what you were thinking and feeling and responded inappropriately because she got it wrong.

This muddled communication is common among mormons. They assume you leave because of being offended when you're not offended. Then they tiptoe through conversations trying to avoid offending you yet again. It's impossible to have a clear heartfelt conversation with someone who is tied up in knots and who is trying to read your mind based on false assumptions. But these kinds of situational interactions happen non-stop when we try to talk to TBMs, and it's frustrating whenever it isn't laughable.

I agree that it's very healthy and freeing to give up undue worry over trying to make everyone like you. Sometimes it's a better reflection on you to consider the source and realize that it isn't necessary to twist in the wind trying to please every mormon who comes by. If a rude, deluded, or foolish person likes us, it might mean we are the same as them.

Mormonism (most religion, actually)teaches we aren't good enough the way we are, that we need to change. And when we think we're doing a decent job of destroying our real self and making it over in the approved manner, Mormonism adds something else we need to be. That way they keep the believers in a subservient position, always looking to the authority figures for validation. Am I good enough yet? Does God like me now? How about now? If they ever totally validate you, then you become equal to them, which they can't allow.

CA girl Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "Since I was a child, I've always just wanted
> everyone to get along and be happy. The downside
> of this was that I always changed my personality
> just enough around whomever I was with so they
> would like me and be happy with me. This was
> probably learned dealing with my parents, who
> tended to only pay attention to me "as far as I
> was translated correctly." In other words, if
> they liked what I was saying, doing, being, they
> paid attention to me. Otherwise, they pretty much
> ignored me".

I can surely identify with this. I notice that as I change this behavior people really do not know what to do. I have seen them get angry or avoid me when the game changes.
>

Are you an ENFJ (MBTI personality type)? I am, and I have the similar "want everyone to get along" thing going.

It's very relieving to realize you don't have to falsely construct a persona to get along with people. And it's simultaneously funny and sad to watch TBMs do it.

I'm in a very similar personality boat. To bounce off of Molly Misanthrope's post on this thread, I'm an INFP. I spent a lot of time feeling my way around other people and trying to adapt myself to them.

Eventually I think the dance doesn't work, and so I'm often happier alone or with a very few, very select set of friends. Not Instant Friends (tm) from church, but actual friends who like me for who I am and for what I am.

Sometimes I think the only folks who thrive in the church are natural bullies, not evil people but people who are just kind of low empathy and who see others as levers to push and pull for this or that goal. That does sound close to describing the administrative mind uncorrected by a balanced personality.

I can't remember what I tested. But I know I'm more comfortable with small groups of people I trust and I'm beginning to realize how drained I feel in Mormon or Mormon-like settings with lots of people. I think there are people who's personalities are a good fit with the church, those who are desperately trying to fit and sacrificing their true selves, others who are faking it and paying a psychological price for it and others who just can't do it any more at any cost. I think I went through those last three people in my life and now I respect myself enough to not want to do Mormonism any more for any reason. I can be nice to Mormons but I can't betray myself by being one any more because it isn't who I really am.

PS, Derrida, thanks for your comments on Hassan's book on that other thread. I haven't gotten to that book yet - it's in the "to read" stack but I'm going to put it up at the top now. Thanks for reminding me to read it.

After so many years of Mormonism where you feel so fake because you're trying to look good to other people, make sure everyone likes you and seeking constant approval from church members and family, it's such a huge rock lifted off your shoulders when you can finally say, "why do I give a shit what they think." And it gets easier all the time. I care about what people I respect think about me. That eliminates 99% of Mormons that I know.

When I was young I cared about what other people thought about me but now at 55 I don't give two shits. And you know what? People seem to like me more than ever.

I've discovered that being my own person is the most important thing I've ever done. If people don't like me too bad. I probably don't like them either.

But damn my life is fun these days. I hang out with people I've known for years and they know me and accept me and I do the same for them.

I discovered a long time ago that everybody is weird. You may think you're normal but that doesn't mean anybody else does.

Charley Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You may think you're normal but that
> doesn't mean anybody else does.


Truer words were never spoken. Conversely, I keep telling my friends that I'm mentally ill, and they keep telling me I'm fine! Go figure

I don't worry about such folks.

Timothy



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/21/2010 08:38AM by Timothy.

The people who don't like me I tell this simply stand in line. But line is long battle it back. I like you, and that's all counts.

what they thought about me.

Then I realized that they are entitled to their thoughts and feelings, and I am entitled to have mine, too.

If we don't agree, then so be it.

I used to be the type that would try to mold to other people's expectations and wants and please them. I still do some of that, but a LOT less. And I'm much happier for it.

I can really relate to what CA Girl said about bending like a pretzel to win our parents' approval and attention. I was taught to "be seen and not heard," and that also meant to take my brothers beatings without whining about it. I could gain their attention best by getting straight A's and performing on the piano or in plays. It was all about performance.

Sometimes, I think I am so phony, that I don't even know who I am. I tell people what they want to hear, I'm positive and upbeat when I should be warning people. I act like I enjoy things I hate to do. I pretend everything is OK when it is not. I was always this way in the Mormon church, and I feel as though I just can't stop.

I was up all night worrying about my present lack of friends, and lamenting that I'm no longer "popular," as I was back in my hometown, in another state.

Maybe this is part of the answer why. In my home neighborhood, none of the kids were Mormons. As a young mother, my children's friends and our neighbors were all not Mormons. The friends I made volunteering in the schools, the soccer teams, and at work were all not Mormon.

I used to change to accommodate others, too. At BYU I had a lot of dates, and a lot of marriage proposals, because I could make myself into whatever a guy was looking for in a woman.

Analyzing all of this, I was historically capable of real friendships--outside of Mormon society. I helped people, and had fun!

If you are shunned long enough, by enough people, by the majority of your neighbors, you actually buy into their belief that something is wrong with YOU.

I've been trying to counteract this horrible feeling, by doing more things with and for my own children. I get together with my relatives and old childhood friends more often--people who truly know me inside and out.

Maybe Mormon "friendship" is an oxymoron.

Sometimes we are closer to the people we work with every day, day in and day out. I value these relationships, because they cross the gaps of race, culture, marital status, age, looks, etc. It is all about who you are, your personality, your disposition, and the work you actually do. The workplace eliminates a lot of the hype. You either do a good job or you don't, and you can't pretend.

Immediae family, work colleagues, good old friends, and clients (if your career demands it) should be much more important than silly, brainwashed cult-members, who are not in touch with reality. Mormons will never understand us apostates.

Human beings are programmed, in my observation, to be accepted and to fear and avoid rejection. It's part of being human and living in our "tribe."

There are only a few people that I want approval from: in some form, and sometimes it's odd. Those are the closest family and friends.

Strangers, acquaintances, and others, some level of even tacit acceptance, and approval may be all that is required in my case.

It's not necessary for everyone I have ever met or known to "like" me or approve or accept my life or decisions.
Voicing or showing their disapproval, finding fault, criticizing, gossiping, and on and on, is about them, anyhow, not about me.

Took me a long time to understand that though! :-)