Is there any way to figure out if a dentist is Mormon? We're looking for a new dentist, and I want to make sure the new one is not Mormon. In Northern Virginia, not the Moridor.

Sure.
Ask 'em.

I don't know why you'd need to be sneaky about it...

Those hands in your mouth may have cleaned a lot of church toilets haha. Maybe i need to ask my dentist.

You could try Googling the dentist's name. You might find clues from publicly available sources.

I always look at there bio on their website. check their FB. a lot of Mormons have FB profile pic of themselves wearing church clothes

You really can't ask. It's not PC, these days.

It is proper to ask where he went to college and dental school, where he is from, etc. "Have you always lived in (Northern Virginia)?" You can search for Utah roots, this way.

If he's from Utah, you can say, "Are you related to ______same name___family in Utah? They are Mormons."

Notice family pictures on his desk. A large group of children all dressed alike, is not a good sign. See what magazines he has in his office.

I found out one client was a Mormon, when we were talking about Boy Scouts, and he said he was an Eagle Scout. Mormons used to put great pressure on boys getting their Eagle Scout award--even if they had to cheat and cut corners--by the age of 16.

You can find out if he speaks another language, or has lived outside the US. Ask about his travels. If his wife is not from America, he might have met her on a mission. Are there foreign decorations in his office?

You can always try to peek at his underwear. This is a disgusting habit that Mormons have. They also feel your shoulder, to feel that capped sleeve of the upper garment. Check out his thighs, for that tell-tale line just above his knee. I know--that's creepy. Still, it is considered more polite than asking.

If you do have to ask, you can ask, "What religion are you?" instead of asking flat-out, "Are you Mormon?" However, if he says he is from Utah or went to BYU, you can then ask flat out if he is a Mormon.

afraid of mormons Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You really can't ask. It's not PC, these days.

You can, and who cares?

You're assessing a medical professional. If you don't want to have a mormon dentist, you can choose not to have a mormon dentist -- and you can ask. Just like you can ask if they're board certified, what dental school they went to, etc. You have every right to know the background of the medical professional who will be treating you.

ificouldhietokolob Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> afraid of mormons Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------

> You can, and who cares?
>
> You're assessing a medical professional. If you
> don't want to have a mormon dentist, you can
> choose not to have a mormon dentist -- and you can
> ask. Just like you can ask if they're board
> certified, what dental school they went to, etc.
> You have every right to know the background of the
> medical professional who will be treating you.

You can ask. He doesn't have to answer. You have every right to want to know the religion of anyone who treats you, but he has every right not to answer. I wouldn't answer, and would tell the patient to go elsewhere if the patient persisted upon my initial refusal to answer. (I'm not a dentist but am a health professional.)

The less obvious ways of knowing that others have suggested are good, and you aren't out of line in asking where a health professional was educated and trained, which sometimes offers clues. Facial hair is becoming more common among wealthy young male Mormons, which makes them a bit more difficult to spot easily, but there's still usually the absence of tattoos. It's human nature to want to know such things - I wouldn't necessarily want to be funding the LDS church with my dental insurance $, either - but it's out of line to ask. I still look a bit like a Mormon and have a Mormon surname and have been asked, usually BY Mormons. I pointedly decline to answer. If an employer cannot ask about religion in job interviews, why would it be appropriate for prospective patients to ask?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/27/2017 08:31PM by scmd.

I would avoid any doctor or dentist who wears tattoos.

Not because I dislike tattoos in general. They just don't go together with health professionals IMO and I consider them to be a sign of poor hygiene (even if they aren't.)

Tattoos go better on bikers; laborers; military; etc.

Not my doctor. Not my dentist.

In fact I've never had a single health professional feature a tattoo. There's a reason why they don't, in general.

Amyjo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I would avoid any doctor or dentist who wears
> tattoos.
>
> Not because I dislike tattoos in general. They
> just don't go together with health professionals
> IMO and I consider them to be a sign of poor
> hygiene (even if they aren't.)
>
> Tattoos go better on bikers; laborers; military;
> etc.
>
> Not my doctor. Not my dentist.
>
> In fact I've never had a single health
> professional feature a tattoo. There's a reason
> why they don't, in general.

I'm a bit prejudiced against them as well. None of the doctors I practice with have them. Some nurses employed by the hospital do, but the nurses employed by our practice are not tattooed. I don't even want my children's teachers (when my kids are old enough for school) to have them. I'm a trustee on my local school board. As such, I participate in the county's annual job fair for teachers and in a later panel interview. I'm either a pre-screener or a final interviewer at the job fair. I don't speculate about any tattoos that may be hidden beneath clothing, but I don't recommend anyone for hiring who has a tattoo that is visible in professional clothing (or who shows up at a job fair wearing unprofessional clothing whether or not it shows a tattoo, for that matter).

The board of trustees has to ratify every new hire in closed session. I go along with administration's recommendations on those unless I have compelling information that a candidate isn't qualified. If I'm part of the hiring process itself, though, the presence of a tattoo can be an issue.

It IS a prejudice on my part. I personally think tattoos connote a lack of professionalism. We use any method available to weed out candidates who may lack professionalism. I don't explain my reason for not recommending the person, as we are asked not to give details. I suppose I have rejected a few potentially good teachers, but I can live with that. I've noticed my counterparts at the job fair seeming to do the same thing.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/27/2017 09:20PM by scmd.

That's an interesting way of hiring teachers, scmd. Where I live in Maryland, the school districts are very large. For a teacher new to a district, I would say two interviews would be typical. You interview with an HR person with the district and with a principal. It can be in any order. The HR people have to verify suitability for hiring in terms of degrees, certifications, etc. but the principals do the actual hiring. Occasionally there is a third interview with other teachers with whom the new hire would be working.

School districts will sometimes hire very desirable teachers (i.e. special ed, STEM fields,) on an open contract where they are guaranteed jobs but will be placed in a particular school at a later time.

Large, urban school districts have to go far and wide to hire. Those districts travel all over the world to find prospective teachers.

I've heard of prospective teachers in certain Pennsylvania school districts being put through more of a gauntlet, including panel interviews including parents. These would be for jobs in desirable schools with better than average pay and a good pension system.

summer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That's an interesting way of hiring teachers,
> scmd. Where I live in Maryland, the school
> districts are very large. For a teacher new to a
> district, I would say two interviews would be
> typical. You interview with an HR person with the
> district and with a principal. It can be in any
> order. The HR people have to verify suitability
> for hiring in terms of degrees, certifications,
> etc. but the principals do the actual hiring.
> Occasionally there is a third interview with other
> teachers with whom the new hire would be working.
>
> School districts will sometimes hire very
> desirable teachers (i.e. special ed, STEM fields,)
> on an open contract where they are guaranteed jobs
> but will be placed in a particular school at a
> later time.
>
> Large, urban school districts have to go far and
> wide to hire. Those districts travel all over the
> world to find prospective teachers.
>
> I've heard of prospective teachers in certain
> Pennsylvania school districts being put through
> more of a gauntlet, including panel interviews
> including parents. These would be for jobs in
> desirable schools with better than average pay and
> a good pension system.

We're considered a mid-sized district with almost 20,000 students tK-12. We do our first hires of the year district-wide at the county teacher fair, which features mostly students from a nearby University of California campus, from another that isn't so near, from a large urban private university not terribly close, two California State University campuses, a large prestigious Christian university down the coast 100 miles or so, and a small private liberal arts college, though students from other institutions are welcome to participate. We're especially looking for special education, bilingual English-Spanish English Language Development, and STEM teachers there. Once they're under contract, principals either grab them for their school sites or the district office assigns them. We have to be conservative at this time because all we usually have is statements of intent from presently tenured or probationary teachers who have been invited for the next year. Those aren't legally binding. Once in awhile we can offer bonuses to teachers who have indicated on statements of intent that they will be retiring if they will hand in retirement letters, but we try to reserve that for slots we know will be tough to fill but for whom we wouldn't necessarily have a ready slot if the supposed retiree ended up not retiring. We also grab as many outstanding candidates from the pool of available teachers or prospective teachers as we feel comfortable hiring. In a worst-case scenario, we can use a few as full-time subs, though it costs us to do that, as regular subs earn considerably less than contracted teachers except in long-term situations. We haven't had to do that since I've been on the board, but I've been told it happened about ten years ago.

We hire the next batch district-wide (with site administrators participating and grabbing the candidates they desire) based on kindergarten pre-enrollment and projected overall enrollment for next year, which concludes in mid February.

After that hiring is done primarily by site administrators, OKed by district office staff, and ratified by the board. Panels come into play when a principal is replaced and the new administrator won't be on-site (in some cases haven't even been hired) in time to make the hires themselves. There are also times when more hires are at-large because district office plans a massive principal shuffle, and principals don't necessarily know yet where they will be administrating the next year.

I'm on the central coast of California. California school districts range from LA Unified, which is, I think, the second largest school district in the nation, to tiny one-campus rural districts with total enrollments of under two-hundred students. We're not far from the median.

We're the district of choice for most teachers in our area, so we don't have to go far to seek teachers. Prospective teachers of good quality are usually willing to come to us. We pay more than LA Unified and are a safer and more education-oriented community. Housing is expensive here, but we offer housing bonuses for first-time hires.

My wife taught kindergarten, sixth grade, [in Utah] and upper-division mathematics [here] before she was licensed to practice law. What do you teach?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/28/2017 01:46AM by scmd.

I teach at the elementary level. I've taught all grades from 1-6 full time, and I taught 7th grade math for part of a year. I also spent one year working as a full-time sub after my previous school shut down. I still think of it as my "year off."

If I were a pro baseball player, I would be thought of as a utility player. I can turn in a decent performance at almost any position, but am not outstanding at any position. I used to be outstanding years ago when teachers had more input into how the curriculum was taught. We had a great curriculum at the time, and I was very creative in my delivery of it.

My area of strength is in producing high test scores. I can do that with virtually any class. My weakness is in managing the behavior of the most difficult urban kids. I can make that work well enough to get the job done, but I struggle with it if I have a difficult group.

I can't stand the current teaching environment with the emphasis on data collection, data crunching, accountability, etc. Administrators, lawmakers, and regulators have taken what used to be a difficult but rewarding job, and have turned it into a difficult and thankless job.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/28/2017 07:33AM by summer.

I don't think it works to the kids' advantage either. It's just easily measurable, which is what all the managers want.

It's a pity.

summer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I teach at the elementary level. I've taught all
> grades from 1-6 full time, and I taught 7th grade
> math for part of a year. I also spent one year
> working as a full-time sub after my previous
> school shut down. I still think of it as my "year
> off."
>
> If I were a pro baseball player, I would be
> thought of as a utility player. I can turn in a
> decent performance at almost any position, but am
> not outstanding at any position. I used to be
> outstanding years ago when teachers had more input
> into how the curriculum was taught. We had a great
> curriculum at the time, and I was very creative in
> my delivery of it.
>
> My area of strength is in producing high test
> scores. I can do that with virtually any class. My
> weakness is in managing the behavior of the most
> difficult urban kids. I can make that work well
> enough to get the job done, but I struggle with it
> if I have a difficult group.
>
> I can't stand the current teaching environment
> with the emphasis on data collection, data
> crunching, accountability, etc. Administrators.
> lawmakers, and regulators have taken what used to
> be a difficult but rewarding job, and have turned
> it into a difficult and thankless job.

I've heard a lot of that sort of thing from relatives who re teachers. Two retired recently and are very upset that their twenty-two-year-old daughter wants to go into teaching.

What you're saying about managing severe urban behaviors is something you really shouldn't have to do. I'm sorry it's come to that.

There's something to be said for versatility and for a teacher who can produce high test scores at any level. I'm told it was easy in the olden days - all a teacher had to do was cheat. Now with the Smarter Balance test or whatever is your state's Common Core equivalent, a teacher has to be good to produce test scores.

It would be nice if teachers didn't have to practically follow scripts and could use more of their own techniques and could once again bring creativity into schools. The things I enjoyed most as a kid are not done in schools, at least around here, anymore.

As we're not urban, our teachers don't face the very worst of behaviors from students, though we have one area with significant gang activity. About 13% of our population lives below the poverty level. The schools here are considered strong enough that we have little home schooling and relatively little private school siphoning of students from our wealthiest areas. We have a couple of Catholic elementary schools and one Catholic high school that has to serve students from about a 100-mile radius in order to function. There's a small evangelical Christian campus that tries to function but isn't even accredited. Their students can meet legal requirements for school attendance only because the school orders accredited home-school packets for each of their students.

How many years more must you teach before retirement?

I could take a full pension after the '18-'19 school year, but I would still need to work another 4-5 years after that at a job that pays decently. Part of the problem is that virtually every other teacher who is closing in on retirement is looking for a way out, so the types of jobs that I would be interested in (teaching at a private school, working at a library help desk, etc.) are hotly contested. I will probably continue to work for the public schools as long as I can stay at my current school, which is in a relatively safe neighborhood. If I get transferred to a violent neighborhood, all bets are off.

I understand why your retired teacher relatives are upset with the one who wants to go into teaching. I actively discourage those who are considering a career in the field.

My urban school district is having an increasingly hard time finding even elementary teachers. Better pay used to be enough to keep the younger teachers, but the poor working conditions are driving them away to suburban school districts. Currently 5 out of the 7 teachers on my floor are job hunting.

Re tattoos:

My daughter has a small honeycomb tattoo on her wrist and others that aren’t visible. She is an amazing ICU nurse who will kindly save your life even while you pass ridiculous judgements on her.

MANY young people have tattoos. They are smart, industrious, and professional.

It may be time to lose the old ideas.

I am in my 60s and have a tattoo on my ankle. It is tasteful and has never been an issue as a teacher. I personally dont care to be covered by tats,but I dont judge those who feel differently. I agree. Lose the old prejudices.I also would not care if my dentist was a Mormon so long as he doesnt push it on me. I wouldnt ask , but if his personal views, religious or not, become an issue, I would find someone else



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/28/2017 09:57PM by bona dea.

Dorothy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Re tattoos:
>
> My daughter has a small honeycomb tattoo on her
> wrist and others that aren’t visible. She is an
> amazing ICU nurse who will kindly save your life
> even while you pass ridiculous judgements on her.
>
>
> MANY young people have tattoos. They are smart,
> industrious, and professional.
>
> It may be time to lose the old ideas.

Tattoos are still a bit controversial. I have ideas in relation to them that I readily admit are based on prejudices, but I'm not sure my ideas are because I'm old, as I'm 33. Most people beyond the mid-twenties wouldn't consider 33 to be old.

Anyone is free to have or not to have tattoos. I keep my prejudices to myself in my workplace as a physician/surgeon and partner in a medical practice and in my volunteer position. I have made the personal choice in the past not to hire an individual who sported tattoos visible in work attire. If someone else in a position to hire makes a choice different than what I would make, I have no problem with the choice that person makes. I work amicably with the relatively few nurses with visible tattoos who work at the hospitals with which I am affiliated. I might not have hired them had the choice been mine, but it wasn't my choice. I'm not the boss of the world or of any entire hospital. As long as they do their jobs and I do mine, it's a non-issue.

If the dentist doesn't like the question, move on to someone who isn't so easily riled.

I've had Mormon dentists that were actually very good.

It is challenging to find dentists for me these days that take my insurance, and are good at the same time.

I don't measure them by their religion.

I consider other things such as are they a member of the ADA?

I've had crooked dentists in the past in my NYC days who would literally remove perfectly good crowns to re-sell the gold or the porcelain settings and replace them with crappy crowns not worth anything that had to be replaced within a short time. After I realized what these two brothers were up to after losing a perfectly fine gold crown, and before they could take another perfectly good one from me I A) Fired them. And B) Called the ADA to make a complaint. They were not registered with the ADA so there was no ability to report their misconduct.

They were crooks.

Another dentist I visited in Manhattan for a checkup and cleaning drilled holes in my teeth while getting them checked. I'd had years of good checkups. After going to her one time, the next visit six months later to another dentist I had 2-3 cavities in the very same places she was jabbing during my cleaning.

She was a dentist who doubled as her own hygienist (and a crooked one at that.)

None of those people were LDS.

The LDS dentist/s I have had were fine, decent human beings, and honest.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/27/2017 04:19PM by Amyjo.

Exmo dentist here. Bottom line: find a dentist you can trust - Mormon or not! I’ve had patients prejudge me based on Mormon schools I’ve attended, number of kids,languages I speak, or conversely Mormons have judged me negatively based on inactivity in the local ward. I consider myself an honest dentist looking out for my patients best interests and am a strong believer/supporter in good business. Understand the flip side, as a dentist, there is nothing more nerve racking than working on a patient that doesn’t trust me. In fact, experience has taught me that if a patient doesn’t trust me, I help them find a dentist they can trust. Also, don’t be afraid to ask your dentist to show you the cavity. Whether on an x-ray or in your mouth. Some can only be seen on X-rays and some can only be seen in the mouth. It may be a black spot, sticky area, or hole. Understand also, finding cavities is a difficult business. You could go to 2 different dentists and be told different numbers of cavities with both of them honestly doing there job. An X-ray is a shadow image showing different densities in the tooth. Depending on the X-ray angulation and a myriad of other factors a cavity may or may not be found. This is one reason why 6 month check ups are important. Again, bottom line: find a dentist you can trust! And if you can, add a car repairman and physician to that list.

Screen them the way you would screen any dentist. And ask people for references. I'd give anything to still have my mormon dentist from Provo. Just because I liked HIM and he was extremely honest and frugal for a mormon. I would be leery of any mormon business person just because there's a greater chance that they are sleezy and unscrupulous. Luckily I live where a majority of my medical/dental professionals are Jewish and I love them all. But there are unscrupulous professionals of all stripes and there are mormons who are moral and honest, just maybe not as likely.

references?

It's not ethical to give patent names without permission;
would U want YOUR Dentist's possible candidates calling YOU?


I'm guessing that 'yes' would be a rare response.

Pretty sure she meant to ask people for references as to dentists they like...not the other way around :)

References. Meaning ask people who their dentist is and if/why they like him.

living in Utah most of my life I have had Mormon doctors and dentists . I really don't care. My only qualification for medical people is are they skilled and basically easy going. I am currently seeing a dermatologist who I am 99.9 percent certain is Mormon , but he took his time to explain my situation . Did the procedure with skill and was a basically nice guy.

larry fox is a Mormon dentist in burke- i don't think there are many in nova. a great dentist on rolling road springfield is peter cocolis and jim gyruciza also very good.
where in nova are you?

trouble is, the outcome - results aren't as easy to measure as their bill is!

Somewhat subjective, to be sure.


Me: I'm hoping genetic science comes up with a way to have us grow a third set!

I had a terrible mo dentist in LA, California on my mission who ruined my four front teeth. I haven't been able to smile because of the crowns he out in. The cost to fix his mess will be in the thousands.

While at the LTM (pre-MTC), a mormon bishop dentist volunteered to give the elders free dental exams before we left the country. Surprisingly, he found cavities on all who succumbed to his wiles. He said he was giving us big discounts to fix things, but who knows?

Is it possible to get six cavities in just four months? Cuz that's when I'd previously been to my dentist.

But hey, he was a bishop!

When looking for a new dentist call 2 or 3 local specialists
in each of three fields: Orthodontist, periodontist, and
endodontist. Ask each one who they get referrals from.

When you see the same name or names check them out.
I did that decades ago and came up with a winner.

Fast forward to a new city. After a decade with a dentist I
I wasn't pleased with I consulted with co-workers and
eventually selected a general dentist in a store-front group
practice.

This has worked out well. With any group practice there is
coverage and peer review. Win, win.

As for tattoos, I'm advised by an RN friend that medical
professionals are required to conceal them while seeing
patients. We don't see tattoos in a business setting any more
than we do intimate piercings.

BcE

Bicentennial Ex Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> When looking for a new dentist call 2 or 3 local
> specialists
> in each of three fields: Orthodontist,
> periodontist, and
> endodontist. Ask each one who they get referrals
> from.
>
> When you see the same name or names check them
> out.
> I did that decades ago and came up with a winner.
>
>
> Fast forward to a new city. After a decade with a
> dentist I
> I wasn't pleased with I consulted with co-workers
> and
> eventually selected a general dentist in a
> store-front group
> practice.
>
> This has worked out well. With any group practice
> there is
> coverage and peer review. Win, win.
>
> As for tattoos, I'm advised by an RN friend that
> medical
> professionals are required to conceal them while
> seeing
> patients. We don't see tattoos in a business
> setting any more
> than we do intimate piercings.
>
> BcE

RNs are in sufficient demand around here that one will not be fired for showing a tattoo. Most don't have them where anyone can see, but some do. None of the doctors I work with have them.

Eww, what about dentists with tattooed teeth!!

elderolddog Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Eww, what about dentists with tattooed teeth!!


I'd probably go to one just for a look at the art work.

I find this post inspiring.

Wow, didn't expect so many responses! Thanks.

WHY I ASKED
-----------

So, I've read so many posts about dentists and such becoming bishops that my search got me wondering. Anyway, the reason I don't want a Mormon dentist (all things begin equal), is because I know many Mormons equate success to their TBM-ness, so I don't want to fuel that sort of mentality. I also don't want any of my money going to TSCC.

SINCE YOU RESPONDED
-------------------

I'd be curious about the opinions of the dentists who responded, and/or other health professionals about why I'm fed up with my current dentist.

We get our health and dental insurance through my wife's job. She recently took an early retirement, and so they switched our health insurance plan. The company also recently offshored their HR operations to India. There are various options to select (lump sum, annuity, etc), and the dogmatic Indians would not fund the insurance plan until a bunch of things had been "completed," In reality, depending on the set of options selected by the retiree, certain of those things couldn't happen, so the health insurance wasn't funded, and the "manual enrollments" done by administrators in Virginia, kept getting cancelled.

So... in November my dentist's office texts me that I'm overdue for a cleaning and that they had a cancellation. So, I call and say I'm willing to come in, but I explain the insurance issue and and ask if they can verify that it's active before I come in (we already have a couple of doctor visits that we've paid out-of-pocket for and have to file claims, and that's an extra hassle I'd rather avoid (i.e. I'd otherwise wait until the insurance reactivates) because the dental insurance is even a different company than the health insurance with which we already have pending claims.

Anyway, they call back a few minutes later and say that the insurance is active, and I go in. The retiree plan seems to be a little less comprehensive, so when the hygienist would say "do you want such-and-such? It's usually covered." I'd ask her to check coverage to be sure (not 'cause I'm not willing to pay twenty bucks for flouride, but because I was just sort of curious about how it compared to the previous plan). My point though, is that they checked coverage multiple times: before I came in, and a couple times while I was there.

I mentioned to them that my jaw had been sore in the mornings. They suggest that I've been grinding my teeth and suggest a dental guard. I say "ok," and they take molds, charge me nearly $300 (because the new policy won't pay for it, but has a "contract price"?), and schedule an appointment for two weeks later to check the fit.

A couple days later I get a text from them saying my daughter is due for a cleaning, asking if she wants to take a cancellation. She was home from school for Thanksgiving, and was available, so in we go. When we arrive the girl tells us that the insurance isn't valid and that we'll have to pay cash.

I said we'd just come back later (again, don't want the hassle of filing extra claims, when simply waiting will make it easier). So, then she tells me that if we cancel an appointment with less than 24 hours notice, that we'll have to pay a penalty. I say the "appointment" didn't even exist 24 hours earlier. She says it's their policy. I say I'm not paying it and have the dentist call me if he wants to discuss it.

A couple days later, I get a voicemail saying that the claim for my appointment from the week earlier had been denied, and that I'll have to pay cash (nearly $600). This sort of surprised me, because, as I described above, they had verified the insurance before my visit, but I know the health insurance had been cancelled more than once, so it's also not surprising, but aggravating nonetheless.

Anyway, the voicemail goes on to say that they'll need to collect the payment when I come in to fit the dental guard, and asks if I want to cancel that appointment (i.e. I can't have the dental guard--which I already paid for--until the other appointment charges were paid. Again, frustrating because I wouldn't have incurred the charges if I had known there was no coverage, and I asked them to verify the coverage, and they did. It seems strange to me that the insurance company would sort of "retroactively" deny coverage for services provided on a day when there was coverage.

At the same time, I'm not naive. The dentist deserves to be paid for his work. I call back and say that if the insurance isn't re-activated by the time I come in, that I'll pay the bill and plan to file a claim. But, in the same space of time, I know things are moving with my wife's company because we got an email from the insurance coordinator saying they'd set up the company side and funded the policy, and we finally got the information necessary to start paying our monthly contribution (which I did immediately to avoid any further issues).

The appointment was more than a week away, and in the interim I know the coverage reactivated, because I could see it online myself at that point. On the day of the appointment though, my wife was sick, so I called to postpone, explaining why. She mentions the penalty again. I ask what's the charge for the fitting. She says no charge, it's included. I ask, how can you charge a penalty for missing a free fitting? Anyway, I dropped that and told her that I thought the insurance was active again, and could she please verify and let me know, and we could also then reschedule my fitting.

Well, fast forward nearly a month, and no call. My jaw had long since stopped hurting, so I wasn't thinking about the dental guard anymore. But my daughters both had appointments coming up right after Christmas, so I called last Friday to inquire about the coverage. She says, Yeah, she had just called the day before and verified it. I was dumbfounded that she not only waited nearly a month, but then didn't call me to let me know and/or set up a time to pick up the dental guard.

I was irritated, asked her why she waited so long. Explained that I wasn't even experiencing the problem for which the guard had been prescribed, etc. It occurred to me that she hadn't even followed up for me, but probably because they were getting near the month or year end and were looking to retry their unpaid claims. I asked her to have the dentist call me.

I wanted to complain to the dentist about this employee of his. She's been insensitive and rude, etc. I was so irritated after I spoke to her that I texted our girls' orthodontist and asked if he could recommend another dentist (and he sent two names).

Anyway, I cooled down and over the weekend I wondered if I had overreacted. Decided to go ahead and take my daughter in to her appointment today. Things seemed to proceed normally. I went in with her, and sat in the extra chair. After the x-rays, cleaning, etc, the dentist came in to do his part, plus superficial chit chat.

But I notice at some point that someone handed him a plastic case that's sort of dental shape, and it occurs to me that it's probably my dental guard. Sure enough, when my daughter gets up, he says it's my guard and tries to hand me. I didn't take it right away, but say that I had asked for him to give me a call about it. He says, "it's yours. You ordered it." I said that that isn't exactly what I wanted to talk about. He says they were just walking out for the day and holds it out again.

I asked what about making sure it fits. He said I could try it on as he left the treatment area. I sat there a few minutes, and figured we were done. When I wandered out he was already working on a patient in the next space. I said "see you tomorrow" to both he and the girl at the front desk, since my other daughter had an appointment.

Based on my thoughts the day before about maybe blowing out of proportion, I really wasn't in too bad a mood about it, but as the day wore on, it started to irritate me again.

First of all, I have this dental guard that I don't really even know if it fits properly. Don't know what to expect, how much to wear it, how to clean it, etc.

And when I came out, my daughter had gone out to the car. She said "I hate that girl." Turns out that the "lady" with whom I was having to deal with on all this stuff--who was rude and dismissive and insensitive--is just an 18 year old kid.

It also occurred to me that the dentist wasn't concerned with whether the dental guard fit. For what they had originally wanted to schedule an appointment to make sure it fit...he was content to just hand it to me. He just wanted to be rid of it.

He said they were "just leaving the building" that day, but he could have called Friday, or yesterday. My only recourse to complain about the girl, is through the girl. He doesn't want to hear me out. He knows her side of the story, and isn't interested in mine. He knew I wanted him to call me, and didn't bother.

The girl had made comments on the phone that implied that I didn't want the guard any longer, and his echoed them because he only knew her side of the story, but my problem was not the guard. My problem was the girl, at least initially (now I'm pissed at him too).

Assuming he thinks I don't want the dental guard, then he's so short sighted that he's willing to lose four long-term patients over a three hundred dollar dental guard. Because four patients is what's it's costing him.

So, I scheduled my youngest an appointment with the referred dentist, and then called to cancel tomorrow's appointment. When Miss Charming asked if I wanted to reschedule it, I just said "no."

Anyway, another observation: in the last six months, his entire staff has turned over. And it's about half the size. There used to always be two ladies at the front desk. Now it's just this 18 year old girl. So the "atmosphere" is different (and not as nice).

Also, one of my pet peeves with his practice is that its way over computerized. For example, I mentioned these texts that arrive. My old policy authorized cleanings every 90 days because I had once needed a deep cleaning or something (not sure about the new policy), and I'd always be reluctant to schedule too far out, because each semester I teach a different schedule, so I don't know when I can go until fairly close up. So, as soon 90 days elapses, I start getting bombarded with "overdue" texts and email invitations to fill a cancellation.

That's another thing that bugs me. 9 times out of 10 I'm filling a cancellation, so I'm virtually always doing him a favor. And when I need a little consideration, it isn't forthcoming.

Also, it's like he "harvests" the insurance policy. He wants to do anything and everything that it will cover (like cleaning my teeth every 90 days, whether I need it or not.

One of the reasons my wife retired early is that she's been sick and on short-term disability for nearly two years. Rather than go on long-term disability, it was better for her to retire. But we're getting fatigued by treatment, and have little tolerance left for bad care. I hate having to file claims, and they add up. Don't want more.

Ok, rant over.

I'm I justified in finding a new dentist?

I think you are.

It’s important to be comfortable with the people who provide your healthcare. It’s your body.

Yes, in your shoes I would find a new dentist as well.

I always do due diligence when selecting a health care provider. When I select a dentist, I carefully check for the dentist's education and training. For instance, my current general dentist not only has excellent credentials, she had also taught at a respected dental school. I also check referrals, both from friends and online. I also like that my dentist does charity trips to provide dental care to citizens of third world countries. I think that speaks very highly of her ethics. I have been very happy with her for over a decade. I would also suggest visiting the dentist's office to see if you feel comfortable there.

I also selected my periodontist in the same manner, and was satisfied with my experience with him. IMO he saved a tooth that would otherwise have been pulled.

Look at it this way, if the new dentist doesn't work out, you can always try again in a year or two.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/28/2017 08:08AM by summer.

Oh for sure you are.

Good dentists are hard to find. Since my regular one retired in 2014 I've been shopping for another dentist. Let's see, I've been to four now since then.

Hope I've finally settled on one who is friendly, personable, knowledgeable, professional. And so is his hygienist and front desk.

The dentist before him though not a crook, is cheap. He filled a filling with the silver amalgam instead of the white, because the white cost more - despite my insurance would have covered either of them for cost. He tried to charge me more for the white; and when I told him it is included in my coverage at no extra cost he proceeded to use the silver anyway - because he's cheap and didn't want to lose money using the better product.

So ... I fired him because of his lack of integrity and honesty with me, a patient.

The one before that is a sweetie but his hygienist isn't. She has a bad attitude and takes it out on her patients while cleaning their teeth. The first visit I chalked up to she was having a bad day. The second one six months later she was as bad or worse. So I fired that one too. No good complaining about the hygienist to her employer I decided; because I didn't want to cause more friction on a chance I ever go back in an emergency. That dentist was there for me for more than a decade, nearly two, to help out with root canals that my regular dentist didn't do. The sweetheart of a dentist should have retired long ago, and is hanging on because of his patients. He's pretty old and decrepid by now, so it was time for me to move on.

The one before him was alright, but their dental office looked like Grand Central, and when I had an emergency toothache they wanted me to wait all weekend before getting me in to get the tooth fixed. And I'd already been going there for a year when that happened. So I fired him too. It was the sweetie dentist who saw me the same day for that toothache. He is a mensch. But alas, his hygienist is a wench.

None of them were/are Mormons to my knowledge.

Being a Mormon isn't indicative of whether a dentist is good or not. I've had good Mormon dentists when I lived in the Morridor. And no, not a one ever had a copy of a BoM in their waiting area or played missionary on novocained patients sitting in their dental chairs.

That's what happens when you hire your daughter to help run your front office!

elderolddog Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That's what happens when you hire your daughter to
> help run your front office!

That's the truth. It's exactly the case with a dentist who practices across the street from me. He's going to lose too many patients to keep his practice going if his receptionist/daughter situation doesn't change.

We have a butt-load of LDS dentists here, most in the age 40 to age 65 range. Most of the wee pre-med and wannabe medical doctors. When affirmative action was in effect, medical school was incredibly difficult for white males to get into. One of my brothers had to go to Grenada for medical school, and he was 4.0 in microbiology/pre-med from Stanford with a 502 MCAT. A whole lot of them took dental school as a consolation prize when they didn't get into medical school. Affirmative action is no longer officially in effect, and there are also a lot more schools of osteopathic medicine (in some cases the programs have expanded greatly; osteopaths can now specialize in almost any branch of medicine, which wasn't an option thirty years ago) than there were a few decades ago. We are now beginning to have a butt-load of Mormon osteopathic doctors.

My PCP is an MD. She has a DO associate. I saw her for a persistent cough and she diagnosed asthma.

My first episode of gout, she told me that my (admittedly dumb) golf buddy's suggestion that I get a cortisone injection was silly. Well, her exact words were, "I've never heard of cortisone being indicated for gout.

But she did refer me to a rheumatologist, but by the time all that came through, the pain had subsided. When I showed up at the specialist's office, he was wearing a belt with syringes in little holsters, all cortisone... It's the go-to immediate remedy. I had to apologize to my buddy for thinking bad thoughts about him...

I hope you spread the word about that awful place to keep others from going there. that dentist needs to lose patients and not attract new unsuspecting ones.

Asking friends about doctors and dentists has worked well for me.

Just ask the dentist if he is a bishop.

Drop by his office. If there are BoM's lying around, he is the annoying kind of Mormon.

Same with Bibles and other religious kitsch. These types can't help but put their religion in your face. Plus, you already can guess the type of conversation they might have which can also be something that makes your visit awkward.

If they don't have religious or political crap out in their office, go for the one with the best recommendations.

Mine is a bishop. Superb dentist. NO Mormon literature in the waiting room or anywhere else I've been in the building....many non Mormon staff . Coffee cups in evidence. If he knows I'm out, he's never mentioned it. Always friendly (we talk sports). His dad (former stake and Alberta temple president) was our dentist for 30 years before his son took over the practice.

Rejecting a dentist based on his or her religion is pretty much a textbook case of bigotry. Just saying.

"Irish need not apply"

I'm am bigoted against a decently sized spectrum of humanity and mostly they don't even care. I don't plan to change.

I know I'll suffer for it in the everlasting lake of fire and brimstone, but I'm kind of bigoted against Noble People.

I disagree. I think people should see healthcare providers who make them comfortable. Personally, I don’t really care what other people’s religious beliefs are. If a provider does things to make his or her beliefs obvious enough to make me worry about being prosylitzed, I think I have every right to choose another provider.

I have a hard enough time seeing medical people without worrying about religious differences. I will admit that when I have looked for houses to rent, I have not considered ones with overt religious decor. Why? Because I have a feeling there would be a serious lifestyle clash between myself and the landlord.

I don’t think it’s incumbent upon me to give business to someone who makes me uncomfortable just so I can prove to others that I have an “open mind”. If that makes me a bigot, so be it.

Oh... and an Irish person can’t help being Irish. People can choose their religious beliefs... and they can also choose to keep them private.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/28/2017 02:29PM by knotheadusc.

They can also reject them for having blue eyes, or a cowlick, or for no reason whatsoever.

It's ridiculous to claim that the law forces anyone to have a dentist who makes them uncomfortable. Dental offices are not courts. This is where people go who deserve to get good care and feel comfortable with those who are there to help.

I think I'd be more worried about whether they are a good dentist.

And affordable, honest and pleasant.

I am from Northern Virginia - let me ask my sister who loves her dentist. By the way, I have a friend who is a convert. Which stake are you in? I'm a no-mo, though. But I have friends who left the LD$ church and some who are closeted apostates.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/28/2017 09:02PM by helenm.

There's probably a 2% probability that a dentist in NoVa is Mormon. Who cares?

^ True

Well, of course because obviously your chances are that they were but that's not what I was thinking.

But as a nevermo BYU student who developed a toothache that necessitated an emergency visit to the dentist, I found myself in the care of one Dr. Pinegar. I watched as Dr. Pinegar made his way directly from beside the chair of a little boy he was working to me-without making a stop at a sink to wash his hands. Too young and naive I was afraid to call him out on it. He asked me if I was Mormon and when I told him "no" he proceeded to bear his lengthy testimony as he worked on my mouth. With me unable to reply to any of his claims.

Still makes me angry after all those years.

That's one of the questions I asked, when I was looking for a dentist: "Do you charge for last minute cancellations?" If they do, it's a deal-breaker. Very few doctors and dentists have this policy.

I don't want to go to the dentist when I'm sick. It's usually impossible to know in advance, when I am going to be sick, and even more impossible to foresee when my kids are going to get sick.

I also don't want my dentist working on people who are sick and should be at home, but drag themselves out of their sickbed to meet their expensive appointment, and sneeze and cough all over everyone.

Wow, a lot of responses. I hate going to the dentist. Don't know if this is luck or just a coincidence, seeing this post. I have sn orthodontist surgeons appointment next week, only for a consultation.I need to have surgery and am worried about picking the right ( or wrong dentist ).
Are LDS dentist bad about not giving or believing in pain meds?
I have nothing against the surgeons religion if he's good, unless it's the recent pain med band wagon.
I have a couple of tumours that need to be removed from my gums, before getting s root canal later.
Would a LDS dentist not put me to sleep and only give a local for religious reasons?
Someone mentioned Jewish doctors and I agree that they're one of the best( most of my medical doctors have been Jewish)
I know that they take an other oath ( don't know if it's literal or just between them and God)on taking away or not causing a patients pain.
Just don't want a doctor who doesn't believe in pain control during the procedure and a couple of days after.
Those doctors do exist.

I wouldn't go back to a dentist whose staff had treated me the way your dentist's receptionist treated you. I wouldn't pay the cancellation fee, either, and would take him to court if he tried to refer you to a credit bureau for it. He probably doesn't have time for small claims court and would presumably drop it.

A dentist who used to practice in my city bought another dentist's practice. His RN wife, who also worked a couple night shifts each week for the local hospital, was his receptionist and office manager. When he first took over the practice, his wife scheduled appointments for patients of the previous doctor who were due, but didn't let the patients know until the day before the appointments. She called the day prior to the appointments to "remind" the patients of the appointments they had never before heard about. Mostly she got people's voicemail because people who work aren't always free to answer their phones in the middle of a workday. When they called back to cancel, the receptionist told them it was too late to cancel because cancellation had to be done a full twenty-four hours in advance, and that they would be billed the cancellation fee (I'm not sure what it was) if they no-showed. Most of the patients told her essentially to go to hell, but some were bullied into showing up for the appointments. The guy wasn't a great dentist and had a rotten personality, so hardly anyone went back a second time. His practice went under financially for good reason.