CNN just did a full article on the role of the Mormon Church in Rob Porter's abuse of his two wives. It describes untrained bishops as counseling the women not to divorce their abuser, to avoid damaging his career, etc. It explains how the patriarchy and the supposed sanctity of celestial marriage discourage women from seeking help. And then it concludes by quoting at least one of the wives as saying she could not get out of the trap without going to an outside therapist for objective judgment and emotional support. I found the article accurate and devastating and invite all to partake.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/09/politics/rob-porter-mormonism-metoo/index.html

Apologies to Happy Heretic for basically reposting something s/he posted earlier. I just felt that the article is very important and perhaps needs a bit more context for people to see why it merits a close reading. In my view it is as direct an assault on the church over patriarchy and spousal abuse as I have ever seen in the popular press.

Coming on the heals of the public questioning of bishops' sexual interrogations of children, it completes the picture of a male-dominated hierarchy that systemically uses sexuality to damage people.

The Mormon Moment is turning out very differently from what the church originally hoped.

I agree. Quoting from the article:

"'Zero tolerance for abuse'
The "Church Handbook of Instructions," created for bishops and other local Mormon leaders, is unequivocal about abuse. "The church's position is that abuse
cannot be tolerated in any form," it says, according to a copy provided to CNN.
Mormons who abuse others are not allowed to enter sacred temples, nor can they work in church ministries. The handbook also provides hotlines for church
leaders to consult legal advisers and professional counselors, and requires clergy to report abuse to secular authorities.
Asked about the counseling that Holderness and Willoughby say they received, Eric Hawkins, a spokesman for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints,
said that it is "difficult to speak to specific circumstances without complete information from all involved, but the position of the church is clear.
There is zero tolerance for abuse of any kind."
"Church leaders are given instruction on how to prevent and report abuse and how to care for those who have been abused," Hawkins continued.
But the handbook does not offer instructions on how to spot spousal abuse, how to discern types of abuse, or how to talk to spouses about it.
Hawkins said that the handbook, which is private, is occasionally updated online, where the church also provides
additional resources for church leaders.
But some Mormons say the experiences of Holderness and Willoughby are not unique.
"The Rob Porter story typifies everything wrong with Mormon men not believing abused Mormon women," wrote civil rights lawyer Carolyn Homer on the
Mormon website By Common Consent.
"I can't even count the number of first-hand accounts I've heard at this point, and I only started paying attention a few years ago. Easily dozens. Probably
hundreds.""

The information about what is in the handbook of instructions (CNN says it obtained a copy) suggests that no matter how incomplete it is, a lot of bishops are not even reading it.

The LDS "church" is very good at piously claiming one thing and then in fact doing or promoting the opposite--as in the instructions in the handbook, as in that nonsense about being "pro family", and so on.

After all, if you're gonna try to influence people, are you gonna tell them "I'm a no-good rat, I lie, cheat, steal, and so on, or are you gonna claim the opposite?

blindguy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I agree. Quoting from the article:
>
> "'Zero tolerance for abuse'
> The "Church Handbook of Instructions," created for
> bishops and other local Mormon leaders, is
> unequivocal about abuse. "The church's position is
> that abuse
> cannot be tolerated in any form," it says,
> according to a copy provided to CNN.

.....unless that abuse comes in the form of the MORmON temple ceremony worship where prior to 1990 it was all right to blindside MORmON members with the following forms of abuse; A. molestation - ala being touche while naked during the washing and anointing in the name of god, B. coercing people into pledges of blind obedience to MORmON leaders in the name of god, C.extortion - ala coercing people into pledges to surrender any and all of their money and belongings to LD$ inc and its cause of MORmONISM to what ever LD$ inc demands those resources in the name of god D. pledges of silence on the previous matters backed up with death threats in the name of god.

> Mormons who abuse others are not allowed to enter
> sacred temples, nor can they work in church
> ministries.

Well, unless that abuse comes in officially approved form, like MORmON temple worship !!!!!!!.

> The handbook also provides hotlines
> for church
> leaders to consult legal advisers and professional
> counselors, and requires clergy to report abuse to
> secular authorities.

more as legal cover for LD$ inc than as functional thing !


> Asked about the counseling that Holderness and
> Willoughby say they received, Eric Hawkins, a
> spokesman for the Church of Jesus Christ of
> Latter-day Saints,

and for some reason it appears that LD$ inc official spokesmen are really just professional spin artists, as in LIARS, just like top MORmON leaders, who are sent out to deal with more pedestrian PR matters /the dirty work that MORmON ASSpostHOLES do NOT want to be bothered/ tainted with!!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4MRwjYZvPI

> said that it is "difficult to speak to specific
> circumstances without complete information from
> all involved, but the position of the church is
> clear.

and the really difficult thing for the official representatives of LD$ inc is telling the truth https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNHB9Rv6X4Y

> There is zero tolerance for abuse of any kind."

AGAIN !!! Unless it is abuse in officially approved forms like MORmON temple worship

WOW, Gordon BS Hinckley must have been a true MORmON PR-of-it Profit, because just as he said, things are only getting better for THE (MORmON) church !!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uA_rs0r8_AM

Are both ex-wives still members of the church?

But will it lose steam?

Will other news outlets follow up?

Will the evil and dark practices slip back into the shadows and flourish?

I've seen this over and over and nothing changes but the players.

It will inevitably lose steam.

But the effect is cumulative. The Prop 8 debacle, the policy against the children of gay people, the Porter problem, the investigation into the bishops' behavior, the Kate Kelley fiasco, the Dehlin excommunication: all of this has been in the national news. And among the people whom I meet, non-Mormons, this stuff has had an impact.

Every scandal has a subtle but important effect on the church's reputation in the eyes of the world. It also influences the thinking of Mormons who have trusted the LDS leadership. The Q15 would be mistaken if they thought this would not cost them converts and even members.

Mormons who abuse are allowed in the temple. Bishops are told to first call the Legal department, not the police. Church leaders are not given any instructions on how to spot or prevent abuse. The church has zero tolerance for abuse like Stephen Wynn's company had a zero tolerance policy: enforcement all depends on your place on the corporate ladder.

Face it, G-15: you are simply not doing your jobs. You are hypocrites or incompetent or both. Time to step down.

slskipper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Mormons who abuse are allowed in the temple. Bishops are told to first call the Legal department, not the police. Church leaders are not given any instructions on how to spot or prevent abuse. The church has zero tolerance for abuse like Stephen Wynn's company had a zero tolerance policy: enforcement all depends on your place on the corporate ladder.

> Face it, G-15: you are simply not doing your jobs. You are hypocrites or incompetent or both. Time to step down.


Hmmmmm…that wasn’t exactly my sweetie’s experience with church leaders concerning the sexual abuse of her daughter by her then Bishopric member husband.

Yes, the first thing the leaders were told was to use a “help line” phone number to the church where they consulted with professional counselors and legal specialists who could answer their questions and formulate steps to take. I consider this to be a GREAT resource for local leaders who may have little to no experience in dealing with abuse victims. They were able to contact experts who were experienced and gave sound advice and direction.

As far as, “Church leaders are not given any instructions on how to spot or prevent abuse”, hell, my sweetie wasn’t able to spot any signs of abuse with HER OWN daughter until she came forward.

“The church has zero tolerance for abuse like Stephen Wynn's company had a zero tolerance policy: enforcement all depends on your place on the corporate ladder.” That wasn’t my sweetie’s experience. Once the daughter came forward the church leaders actually got the ball rolling and displayed “zero tolerance” towards the offender…even though he was a healthy tithe payer, surprisingly.

“Mormons who abuse are allowed in the temple.” Not my sweetie’s experience either.

The conflict with church leaders occurred AFTERWARDS. When counseling with the Stake Prez and Bishop my sweetie and her daughter were “encouraged” to forgive, let the perv father return to the home, don’t break up a celestial marriage, testifying against him could lead to incarceration, financial burdens, break-up of the family/home, etc. That is where the problems with local church leadership set in.

I have a relative who was a bishop. He told me that that help line was primarily about keeping the church out of trouble, that on some occasions they'd gently suggested he avoid letting anything go public. He doesn't think line is really designed to help the victims.

I'll bet one or both of the bishops who interacted with Porter's wives availed themselves of the hot line.

I can only speak from the experience of my sweetie. The advice/counsel that her Bishop received from the "help line" folks was to contact the authorities and arrange to take the husband out of the home (put him up in a hotel).

Her church leaders took things on "head-on" and acted appropriately when it all came down.

That is nice to hear.

Jaxson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> slskipper Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Mormons who abuse are allowed in the temple.
> Bishops are told to first call the Legal
> department, not the police. Church leaders are not
> given any instructions on how to spot or prevent
> abuse. The church has zero tolerance for abuse
> like Stephen Wynn's company had a zero tolerance
> policy: enforcement all depends on your place on
> the corporate ladder.
>
> > Face it, G-15: you are simply not doing your
> jobs. You are hypocrites or incompetent or both.
> Time to step down.
>
>
> Hmmmmm…that wasn’t exactly my sweetie’s
> experience with church leaders concerning the
> sexual abuse of her daughter by her then Bishopric
> member husband.
>
> Yes, the first thing the leaders were told was to
> use a “help line” phone number to the church
> where they consulted with professional counselors
> and legal specialists who could answer their
> questions and formulate steps to take. I consider
> this to be a GREAT resource for local leaders who
> may have little to no experience in dealing with
> abuse victims. They were able to contact experts
> who were experienced and gave sound advice and
> direction.
>
> As far as, “Church leaders are not given any
> instructions on how to spot or prevent abuse”,
> hell, my sweetie wasn’t able to spot any signs
> of abuse with HER OWN daughter until she came
> forward.
>
> “The church has zero tolerance for abuse like
> Stephen Wynn's company had a zero tolerance
> policy: enforcement all depends on your place on
> the corporate ladder.” That wasn’t my
> sweetie’s experience. Once the daughter came
> forward the church leaders actually got the ball
> rolling and displayed “zero tolerance” towards
> the offender…even though he was a healthy tithe
> payer, surprisingly.
>
> “Mormons who abuse are allowed in the temple.”
> Not my sweetie’s experience either.
>
> The conflict with church leaders occurred
> AFTERWARDS. When counseling with the Stake Prez
> and Bishop my sweetie and her daughter were
> “encouraged” to forgive, let the perv father
> return to the home, don’t break up a celestial
> marriage, testifying against him could lead to
> incarceration, financial burdens, break-up of the
> family/home, etc. That is where the problems with
> local church leadership set in.

My wife has a good friend whose former father in-law sexually abused her daughters. When she approached church leaders about it, they told her to think about the stress it would put on this "Priesthood holder". She refused to back down and when she went to law enforcement, she was disfellowshipped. Sadly there was not enough evidence for law enforcement file charges against him. He made a very large donation to the church for the construction of the local temple and everything was forgotten by the church. He remains, to this day, in good standing. My wife's friend divorced her husband and she and her daughters left the church far behind. She was able to get some sort of protective order against her former father in law so the girls never have to see him. But clearly, if you have the right connections, or donate enough money, abusers can and do enter the temple.

alsd Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> My wife has a good friend whose former father in-law sexually abused her daughters. When she approached church leaders about it, they told her to think about the stress it would put on this "Priesthood holder". She refused to back down and when she went to law enforcement, she was disfellowshipped. Sadly there was not enough evidence for law enforcement file charges against him. He made a very large donation to the church for the construction of the local temple and everything was forgotten by the church. He remains, to this day, in good standing. My wife's friend divorced her husband and she and her daughters left the church far behind. She was able to get some sort of protective order against her former father in law so the girls never have to see him. But clearly, if you have the right connections, or donate enough money, abusers can and do enter the temple.


Hey alsd,

Your story sounds very similar to others I have heard and has some similarities to my sweetie’s story.

Initially the church leaders were great in dealing with my sweetie. They contacted the police, got him out of the house, arranged for counseling for ALL involved, etc. After a few months though, they started to encourage my sweetie to take him back, that he was repentant (but disfellowshipped), that it would be a shame if his daughter pursued charges (as it would blow up the marriage and family), etc. Being the true, true, TBM that she was, she followed their advice. Fearing a break-up of the family, the daughter ended up not pressing charges which pissed off the District Attorney.

When he came back into the home, instead of being sexually abusive he became verbally and physically abusive. He was in and out of the home three or four times before she finally could take no more and went against the counsel from her Bishop and Stake Prez by filing for divorce.

It was at around this time she contacted me. It had been 20 years since we last spoke. We had been college sweethearts but do to circumstances at that time, we broke up. I was her “Prince Charming” and I broke her heart. As she was going through this crisis with her family and ending the marriage, she reached out to me, her one true love. I was coming out of a bad marriage myself. Long story short, we reunited after our 20 years away from each other and had the best years of our lives together. We had plans to marry…but unfortunately…cancer is a bitch…and it took her from me after four wonderful years.

She left behind four children (two minors) who I took under my wing and provided for and supported as if they were my own. Once news of her death reached her molesting ex, he filed for custody of the two minor children even though they had had NO contact with him for several years and wanted nothing to do with him. At first I sought custody of them but was advised by our attorney that we had a stronger case if the eldest daughter sought custody instead. A custody battle ensued, and fortunately the court sided with the eldest daughter.

Documents from the case showed that the father had obtained letters of support from various people, one such letter being a GLOWING recommendation to the court from his Bishop (not the same Bishop that worked with my sweetie) a different guy who my sweetie only knew through correspondence prior in attempts to get paid child support and dealing with other issues. The things the Bishop said pissed me off. I told the kids that when the case ended I would give that Bishop a piece of my mind. Here is the letter I wrote to him. I have taken the names out. Enjoy. -



Bishop John XXXXXX,

This letter is to inform you that the guardianship for the children of *Molester* and *My Sweetie* has rightfully been awarded to the eldest daughter, *Molester’s victim*.  The time spent and costs incurred in the effort to secure the children from their deviant father was worth any and all resources required.

Imagine my disappointment though as I read the report of the comments you made to the court appointed social worker.  Your glowing support of an abusive child molesting bastard is despicable.  Your further characterization of the children’s mother in the report as being “very influential in the formulation of the minor’s negative opinion about *Molester* ” is downright sickening.  Let’s not consider the FACT that *Molester* was physically and verbally abusive to his children, or the FACT that they witnessed his abuse of their mother, or the FACT that he mounted their sister when she was 12 years old and ejaculated through his garments on her!!  Such events could never have influenced their opinion of him.  Nooooooo, they were influenced by their mother!!  You really are a piece of work *Bishop’s last name*.

*My Sweetie* desperately reached out to you for help in dealing with her sick ex-husband.  Her studies and research in Psychology greatly helped her recognize the controlling, manipulative behavior he was exhibiting.  She also realized that the ONLY  authority he would respond to in complying with his obligations would be the church (YOU!!).  This is why she sent you studies, articles, and paperwork detailing his deviant patterns so that you would be better informed and educated when dealing with him.  Obviously you considered this a nuisance, obviously you didn’t read the material, and obviously you chose to support the abusive child molesting priesthood holder over his victims.  This comes as no surprise as this seems to be a growing
epidemic in the church.

Fortunately the State of California has expert psychologists who rely on sophisticated tests for character evaluation.  These tests administered to *Molester* were far more accurate than your faulty “Spirit of Discernment”.  Amazingly, the test results mirrored EXACTLY the types of behavior that *My Sweetie* warned you still existed in him.  Perhaps she was more “in tune with the spirit” than you. According to the test results “ *Molester* presented as narcissistic and self-centered to enhance his sense of self-worth.  Prone to impulsivity and taking risks, he was vulnerable to poor judgement to gratify immediate needs, showing the tendency to be manipulative.  He also appeared to displace responsibility for his problems onto others.”  The test further concluded that “granting *Molester* parental rights would be psychologically detrimental to (the children).”

It is simply appalling that you would ignore the impassioned pleas for help from a loving protective mother in favor of the lies of a child molester.  I truly hope that if your daughters someday need the same assistance from a church leader as *My Sweetie* did, they will find someone more sympathetic to their needs than you.  And you are a Bishop!!??  One of the “Lord’s anointed”??  If you had any shred of decency you would resign immediately and give up the charade of being “led by the spirit”.

*Molester* saw you as someone he could deceive and manipulate.  *My Sweetie* saw you as a light of hope in dealing with him.  He was right, she was wrong.  I think you have a pretty good idea of how I see you.

Thanks for nothing.

Jaxson


I heard the molesting piece of shit father/ex remarried and has been re-fellowshipped into the church. To all you TBM’s who are reading this who attend church every Sunday, imagine that perhaps this molesting pervert is sitting in the row behind you. Perhaps he is playing, teasing, and making goggly eyes with your young daughter. Chew on THAT while you are chewing on your piece of sacrament bread.

I speak from personal experience, that the Mormon cult excuses, denies, and even enables abuse.

I was conned into marrying a sociopath in the temple, and he beat me almost every day, until, in order to save my own life, I legally divorced him, on the grounds of extreme physical cruelty. I had witnesses, but it went uncontested. No one believed me that the sweet, smiling RM, Elder's Quorum President, nephew of an important GA, "gentle giant" teddy-bear of a man would beat me. My bishop said I was "over-reacting," and that whenever my abuser would apologize, I should forgive him, and give our eternal marriage another chance. Staying in the marriage, I went to the hospital several times, and, twice, he strangled me until I lost consciousness, and thought I was gasping my last breath on this earth. In the end, I almost committed suicide.

If anything, the cult made the abuse worse! I was threatened that there was no escape. No one had ever been divorced in my TBM family.

For over 30 years, the cult refused to grant me a temple divorce, and each new bishop and stake president would tell me that I was STILL TEMPLE sealed to the thug who tried to kill me! Moreover, my children, fathered by my second husband, years later, also were sealed to the brute, as his eternal children.

The Mormon Mafia Priesthood holders broke into our house, and threw my sons out of their beds onto the floor, and kicked them when they were down, and forced them to get dressed, and shoved them out the door and into a van and to church, kicking them in the rear end, and hitting them. EVERY ONE of these men who did this were promoted up the ranks to bishop, stake president, and mission president.

Our bishop's son--an ugly, creepy high school senior tried to molest my little pre-teen girl at a church campout. She screamed, and many of the kids saw what was happening. The bishop threatened the kids not to tell--that all fun activities would be cancelled, and it would be the tattle-tale's fault. He told my daughter that I would be angry with HER, and punish HER. The bishop's son went on a mission, and was made Elder's Quorum President when he returned.

I wish every newspaper, periodical, and news broadcast would pick up this CNN story! The wards in which I lived were upper-class, supposedly respectable wards. My abusers and the abetters were "revered" Mormons.

Lying (in a divorce) doesn't disqualify a person from going to temple either.

G15 have diluted Love ( Kindness, Honesty, Respect for others) to the point they're AWOL from doctrine.


Humility, Compassion, & Empathy are unknowns in Morland.

The elevation of Hoax signals the 99% emphasis to legalisms in tscc.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/10/2018 11:29AM by GNPE.

I was so conscious of my shortcomings, I didn't try to get a TR.At the same time I saw how people who I _knew_ had to have lied to the bishop & SP, went and came back glowing and pretending they were oh-so-righteous.

What about the special priesthood discernment?

What a sham.

I love CNN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Finally a credible news source is telling it like it is in

Mormanville. Yay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This makes me so

happy. The good news is that it's all bad news about the

hateful Mormon church.

Hi Saucie,

It isn't just CNN. I just googled "Mormon Rob Porter" and got not only the original Daily Mail article and the CNN and Intercept pieces but also The New Yorker, Religion News, Washington Post, the NYT, Slate, USA Today, Bloomberg, and several articles by the SL Tribune." Some of these mention the church in passing but several are fairly detailed. This scandal is getting a lot of attention, some of it from prestigious sources.

Lot's Wife Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hi Saucie,
>
> It isn't just CNN. I just googled "Mormon Rob
> Porter" and got not only the original Daily Mail
> article and the CNN and Intercept pieces but also
> The New Yorker, Religion News, Washington Post,
> the NYT, Slate, USA Today, Bloomberg, and several
> articles by the SL Tribune." Some of these
> mention the church in passing but several are
> fairly detailed. This scandal is getting a lot of
> attention, some of it from prestigious sources.



I know!!!!! There are articles in Facebook as well.

I'm so glad to see that people are now getting

the truth about the church's misogynistic treatment

of women. It's been hidden from the public for all these

years and it's time that people found out.

I like seeing this issue spotlighted but I don't see it as having a long lasting impact because 99% of the time, religion gets a pass. Religion is not held to the same standards as every other organization. They live in this odd "sweet spot" because the idea that "we must respect each other's beliefs," is a concept that has permeated society and aids wife beaters and others as applied by the Mormon church.

Even Warren Jeffs in the 21st century, acting like Joseph Smith did in his day, and going to prison doesn't really change things. The "hands off the crazy beliefs of others," is strong in this country. Perhaps that has some merit--the allowing others to do what they choose---but there is dark cloud hovering over that concept even if it falls under the umbrella of freedom.

Many mormon bishops should be facing charges as accomplices in crimes. Oaks should as well, and BKP and SWK should have.

At the core though, I know with my own Mother that she will tell you that the church is not misogynistic as she pulls a veil over her face and bows her head says yes to the men.

Once again the Mormon church is backed into a corner. And so, even if there is enough outrage in the press, by the public at large, by women's movements, how does the Mormon church move past this? Do they start to train clergy? Do they start to notify police rather than their own legal department? Or, do they dig in their heels because, how can they change another tenet of their religion that they say is of God--untrained clergy guided by the Holy Ghost?

The untrained clergy has always been a bragging point. Men called of God and guided by inspiration. Mormons really believe they are getting advice that is of the spirit and if it causes pain that they should accept it, endure to the end, because it is part of God's plan and will all be made right in the afterlife. Everybody is going to be deliriously happy in the CK! So, why not endure the current tribulations? And that is why even the Me Too movement won't help this out. The women don't see themselves as standing up to the Mormon men. The women feel like taking their power for themselves is a slap in the face to their God.


Mormon women need to understand that their God does indeed need his face slapped. Somebody needs to knock some sense and decency into his highness. But if you can convince someone that coffee is evil, well . . . the game is already over.

Hasa Diga Ebowai?

The Intercept:

How Powerful Men Helped Rob Porter Keep His White House Job After Learning He Abused Former Partners

https://interc.pt/2ESRNYA

(Let The Intercept know if you think their article doesn’t emphasize enough the bad (to say the least) council Mormon bishops gave to the spouses. Bishops, too, are powerful men - in their tiny context, that is.)

I sent an email to the author trying to explain how the Mormon system works. He especially missed the mark when he referred to the bishop as a lay leader or some such. I explained that in Mormonism every leader is a lay-type one. I also pointed out that the bishop is to an LDS ward as a captain was to his ship in the 19th century British navy.

Good stuff, and great analogy with a ship’s (ward’s) captain.

My letter pointed out that bishops are indeed very important men from an LDS woman’s point of view. But I get it, the Intercept concentrated on the political holes that allowed Porter through, *knowng* him to be a wife beater. I may have liked more LDS focus, but I get that they may have seen that angle as more salacious and less pertinent, even though we know it is not.

Thanks for sending them a note, slskipper.

Cheers,

Human

The church probably doesn't consider it abuse when all he did was aimed toward saving her for the hereafter. Sometimes that might seem like abuse to us outsiders.

Not sure I'm following you here. I'm sure the church has it's own standards for abuse, but that in no way excuses that abuse. Beating an "errant" wife to get her to heaven is still abuse.

It doesn't SEEM like abuse. It is abuse.

Exactly... a slap, a punch IS ABUSE!!! There's no "seems like"

because it IS ABUSE.

You don't get it! I was beaten for NO REASON!

Sociopaths and psychopaths and thugs with violent tendencies don't need any reason to attack someone! It's not about the victim at all.

Often my ex-husband would come in the door, yelling, and chase me down, and throw me across the room, and I didn't have a clue WHY.

I get upset when someone says, "What did the spouse DO to make the other spouse beat them up.

A victim would be crazy to do anything to set-off an abuser. You'd better believe I was a good wife and a good church member!

Mother who knows, your story is heart wrenching and makes me want to destroy every person complicit in the abuse.

It's so true that the abuser will use any or no reason to abuse.

I would not put me anywhere near your category of abuse. My dad was awful to my mom and five sibs, but I got a small part of it by being very VERY compliant and invisible.

Every time I was abused, it was out of the blue. I'd park the car the same way for months and one day I'd have a purple faced, 6'4 man's fist an inch from my face for parking the car incorrectly. It's impossible to stop with "being good".

In the last 15 hours the Tribune has published at least three articles on Porter, his Mormonism, and US politics. My hunch is that this will reach and influence a lot of Mormons in Utah.

First Exhibit: An article explaining why bishops almost always side with male abusers and how Hatch initially criticized the "vile attack on such a decent man." The article ties the problem closely to Mormon culture and organizational structure.

Second Exhibit: Mormon leaders sympathized with Porter even after he was forced to resign. "Hatch is praying for Porter. Not Willoughby or Holderness. Porter." The problem is not just Mormonism but traditional values throughout the country, though it is exceptionally entrenched in Mormon culture.

Third Exhibit. This one decries the lack of response from the Family Values Crowd, noting that evangelical and conservative Christian groups have refused to express support for the victims of domestic violence. Reporters specifically tried, and failed, to get comments from the Family Research Council, Concerned Women For America, The Family Leader, and several individual evangelical leaders. Those guys are part of the united front that spans the distance from Washington to Salt Lake City and then Hollywood.

In that context it is not surprising that the leader of the government's Partnership for Public Service, which is supposed to handle issues like this, has failed to take a stand; so too the White House's Advisor for Violence Against Women. Why? Because the president has neglected to appoint people to fill those positions.

What we are seeing is that conservative organizations, religious, political, and especially Mormon, are completely unprepared to take spousal abuse and violence against women seriously. Steve Bannon (Exhibit Four) understands what's going on; he thinks the "anti-Patriarchy" movement spawned by Donald Trump, Harvey Weinstein, half of Hollywood, and nearly as much of Congress may soon undo 10,000 years of male domination. Correcting for his hyperbole, the truth is that things are going to change significantly and rapidly, very possibly starting with women's voting patterns in November.

The White House should take note. The GOP should take note. And the LDS Church had better wake up and start taking this seriously. If they don't, the hemorrhaging of women and the men who love them from which the church now suffers will get a lot worse, especially among the younger generation who already see little reason to stay Mormon.



1) https://www.sltrib.com/news/politics/2018/02/08/white-house-officials-ex-wives-say-their-mormon-bishops-were-no-help-when-they-were-abused/

2)https://www.sltrib.com/opinion/commentary/2018/02/09/jennifer-rubin-the-family-values-crowd-is-mute-on-rob-porter/

3) https://www.sltrib.com/opinion/commentary/2018/02/09/jennifer-rubin-the-family-values-crowd-is-mute-on-rob-porter/

4) https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/09/steve-bannon-womens-anger-is-going-to-be-bigger-than-the-tea-party.html

Apologies.

The second article is https://www.sltrib.com/opinion/editorial/2018/02/11/tribune-editorial-sen-hatch-and-the-lds-church-minimize-domestic-violence/

Wow Lot's wife. Nicely written

Thanks, Boss.

We are at a pivotal moment in history, I think.

My father, a family beater, always had his temple recommend.

I think such people may lose their social standing more frequently now.

There's no way spousal and child abuse will go away completely, of course, especially given the frequent proximity of abusers to power. But it is becoming more difficult to hide sexual and physical abuse.

I was given a priesthood 'blessing' to stay with my husband and be a good helpmeet to him. I should have left at 100 MPH in the opposite direction. But how do you dismiss a preisthood 'blessing'? And they wonder why I left and am still angry 30 odd hears later?

My heart goes our to both wives in this situation!

My heart goes out to YOU, Fluhist.

I appreciate this thread.

... and to Don Bagley, and the two women, and all the countless women and children and little boys and spouses and gays and missionaries who came home early, and coke-drinkers, and the list is way too long....

Lot's Wife Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> it completes the picture of a male-dominated
> hierarchy that systemically uses sexuality to
> damage people.

Oh absolutely. Years ago I was reading the travel blog of a Dutch celebrity. Coming from Yellowstone and on her way to the Grand Canyon, she travelled through Utah, visiting every single mormon sight she could. And while before her trip she couldn't tell a mormon from a Jehova's Witness, she gave her view on mormonism on her blog. It contained lots of errors but also a lot of hard facts, delivered with the brutal honesty the Dutch are so known for. Her first sentence was "It's a man's world". And it is.

To this day, I think any description of mormonism for dummies should begin with that phrase. It's a man's world! Women come third. Men first, boys second. Women and girls come way after that.

Was it hinkley or monsoon who made that cute public all in good fun quip about showing her the backhand..wink wink of course...these jokers come from the GOOD ole days when a few light slams was just good domestic management...saw plenty of it myself...received plenty of it...hopefully it won't take wild horses to drag these ol bastards kicking and screaming out of the good ole days...the spineless serfs around them sure as hell won't mention it..I'm not sure the boys evn read the paper any more...between naps...it'll be a battle...props to Those fighting the good fight

Mormon church full on assault against truth.