ificouldhietokolob Wrote:
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> Tall Man, Short Hair Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > This speaks volumes to our education system's
> > ability to indoctrinate their charges with a
> > specific political point of view while
> > simultaneously crippling their ability to
> actually
> > interact with reality.
>
> On the contrary, I think it speaks volumes to
> young people not accepting bullshit excuses
> offered by so many.
"Bullshit excuses?" You mean an actual constitutional right?
In a world where we're constantly aware that perception is reality, you choose to enthusiastically depart from reality in favor of an agenda that has never once proven effective in the US. We're not a country with loose gun laws. We're a country with a codified right to bear arms.
And your departure from reality is glaring when you recognize the number one reason people own guns is for personal protection. So your "bullshit excuse" rings in the ears of most gun owners as a complete devaluation of their right to security.
And while you seem to feel air travelers, concert goers, and football fans are somehow worthy of the protections afforded by on-site security, you place this inconvenience as far more undesirable than actually saving children's lives. "Yes, son we have a cure that is virtually always effective, but we're going to let you and your friends die in the pursuit of this other remedy that has never once ever worked. Ever. It's a long term goal, and the more of you that die, the more forceful our emotional appeal becomes."
Sorry Hie, by every actual factual measure, yours is the bullshit excuse.
>
> > While airports, courthouses, stadiums and other
> > public venues have measures that reliably keep
> > people safe, these kids somehow feel that their
> > only solution involves demanding something that
> > has never been seen on our shores, ever.
>
> And "our shores" have an inordinate amount of gun
> violence compared to other countries where
> "something" has been done.
Fine. And lots of kids living in New York City apartments want a pony. Adults are faced with the sometimes difficult task of explaining we're simply not living in a place where this is possible.
Have you looked at gun sales during the Obama administration? Since people view guns as a form of security, they feel threatened when politicians threaten to take them away. It's another one of those inverse relationships. The more you try to take away people's guns, the more they push back and gather more guns.
In what imaginary planet do you imagine the millions of gun owners--who see their weapons as a form of personal security--will gladly hand them over to a government that most trust less than a used-car salesman? You're asking for civil war.
But again, your ideological embrace of a never-before seen solution is far more important than implementing measures that we all know work. And exactly how many complaints are you hearing from Detroit schools where these measures are already in place? There aren't many. The kids are safer inside their schools than they are on the streets.
> They're acting based on evidence, and not
> accepting the idea that "security" comes from
> metal detectors and armed guards.
> I applaud them. They don't want to make the
> schools into places where there's a 3-hour line
> through metal detectors and strip searches to get
> in, when there are clearly better solutions.
>
I mention Detroit schools above. They're actually taking this issue seriously. Here's a recent editorial in the Detroit News. Their solution? On-site security. We can get that implemented relatively quickly. Your unicorn carrying a world where there are no guns and bad guys have no other harmful resources seems to have come up lame.
http://www.detroitnews.com/story/opinion/editorials/2018/02/17/schools-must-boost-security/110543390/Bullshit. Show me one time a gun control law has made people safer in our history. I know you likely love the Australian example, but will you listen to one of the lawmakers who implemented it? He says gun control advocates should stop using the Australian example. It would never work here. Australians never had a constitutional right to gun ownership, and they never had a culture that associated them so highly with personal security. That's part of our culture.
https://www.citylab.com/life/2018/02/australia-ambassador-on-why-gun-laws-cant-save-america/553655/> You consider these kids "useful fodder."
> Because they don't agree with you.
> That's just sad.
>
> Have you considered that their ideas are better
> than yours?
I'm all for sane gun control laws. But this specific example is an insane foundation for a sweeping gun control argument. The FBI was notified twice, he had dozens of interactions with local law enforcement, he publicly announced a desire to become a school shooter, and his school banned him from carrying a backpack. Give me a law that keeps guns from this kid for one or any of these reasons, and I'll stand with you. But don't take your anti-gun ideology and point to the millions of law-abiding gun owners and say they must surrender their guns because of a complete breakdown of common sense security in this case.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/21/2018 12:43PM by Tall Man, Short Hair.