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He has shown definite Joseph Smith Jr. attributes.
And on the not so funny side.
My father had 10 kids like Bishop. My father was a branch president when he was accused of molesting his adopted daughters. I know it isn't quite the same thing, but for me this multiply and replenish the earth, overworked little factories, and Joseph Smith's sexual predator legacy is just too much.
The fact of the matter to me is I was born into a multi-level marketing corporation masquerading as a valid religion. It tells crazy falsifiable stories of Ameri-Hebrews, angels, and God himself starting this madness. Sexual Celestiality and paradisiacal (parasite) glories in deluging people are symptoms of a rotten business grabbing people by the gills to exploit and be exploited "forever." The mentally weak, old, young, women, men, and powerless are the victims of this Moroni(c) Virus of millennial memes.
Edit: Reading this was very difficult as the victim of sexual molestation.
https://www.exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,2092187,2092299#msg-2092299
The Mormon Church is about as good dealing with it as The Catholic Church - attempting to make it go away.
Hopefully, some day religions won't be quite the places of opportunists they are now. Wait. What?
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2018 03:02PM by Elder Berry.
And on the not so funny side.
My father had 10 kids like Bishop. My father was a branch president when he was accused of molesting his adopted daughters. I know it isn't quite the same thing, but for me this multiply and replenish the earth, overworked little factories, and Joseph Smith's sexual predator legacy is just too much.
The fact of the matter to me is I was born into a multi-level marketing corporation masquerading as a valid religion. It tells crazy falsifiable stories of Ameri-Hebrews, angels, and God himself starting this madness. Sexual Celestiality and paradisiacal (parasite) glories in deluging people are symptoms of a rotten business grabbing people by the gills to exploit and be exploited "forever." The mentally weak, old, young, women, men, and powerless are the victims of this Moroni(c) Virus of millennial memes.
Edit: Reading this was very difficult as the victim of sexual molestation.
https://www.exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,2092187,2092299#msg-2092299
The Mormon Church is about as good dealing with it as The Catholic Church - attempting to make it go away.
Hopefully, some day religions won't be quite the places of opportunists they are now. Wait. What?
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2018 03:02PM by Elder Berry.
BTW, I recommend the following transcript be read by every ExMormon.
https://mormonleaks.io/wiki/documents/f/fd/2017-Joseph_L_Bishop-Transcript.pdf
It is a window into a real "honest" church leader.
I'm betting he is past caring at 85. They guy was just doing what he was told to do, was bored at BYU, and kinda complained about being "bounced around."
It is a relatively honest look into what happens to a person who happens to climb high in life, get recognized by church leaders, and doesn't really drink the koolaid in leadership. He says he had spiritual experience in the church but seems more like it was in spite of what he was doing for the church instead of a direct result of serving the church.
Bored. Made an attempt at LDS fame through books he can't remember much about writing. Lost in Mormon space oblivious to those he abused. Whiny big old Mormon baby spoiled by the church.
He didn't even care much when he got a call from someone in The First Presidency.
He was a rule follower who tried to get what he could on the side. It probably fits a not uncommon profile. This guy will never actually attack the church. He just won't defend himself with it when he is too old to care about it. He would never make apostle because he lacks the psychology of being a more heinous abuser than he already is. He won't bite the hand that fed him only whine and whimper at the lives he harmed when faced with one of them.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2018 05:26PM by Elder Berry.
https://mormonleaks.io/wiki/documents/f/fd/2017-Joseph_L_Bishop-Transcript.pdf
It is a window into a real "honest" church leader.
I'm betting he is past caring at 85. They guy was just doing what he was told to do, was bored at BYU, and kinda complained about being "bounced around."
It is a relatively honest look into what happens to a person who happens to climb high in life, get recognized by church leaders, and doesn't really drink the koolaid in leadership. He says he had spiritual experience in the church but seems more like it was in spite of what he was doing for the church instead of a direct result of serving the church.
Bored. Made an attempt at LDS fame through books he can't remember much about writing. Lost in Mormon space oblivious to those he abused. Whiny big old Mormon baby spoiled by the church.
He didn't even care much when he got a call from someone in The First Presidency.
He was a rule follower who tried to get what he could on the side. It probably fits a not uncommon profile. This guy will never actually attack the church. He just won't defend himself with it when he is too old to care about it. He would never make apostle because he lacks the psychology of being a more heinous abuser than he already is. He won't bite the hand that fed him only whine and whimper at the lives he harmed when faced with one of them.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2018 05:26PM by Elder Berry.
Bumping for people to read the transcript.
It is one of the best indictments I've found in how harmful Mormonism is.
RfM should post it permanently.
Reading this man's words you would think he is a victim yet he used Mormonism for his own narcissistic designs and yet feels existential angst in the end of his life hoping one of the victims he married, divorced and hopes to remarry with fill his empty and meaningless life of church service.
It is one of the best indictments I've found in how harmful Mormonism is.
RfM should post it permanently.
Reading this man's words you would think he is a victim yet he used Mormonism for his own narcissistic designs and yet feels existential angst in the end of his life hoping one of the victims he married, divorced and hopes to remarry with fill his empty and meaningless life of church service.
He acts as if his loyalty to the church was somehow betrayed. He worries about his legacy and how his "addiction" is going to affect his family.
Meanwhile, the victim has struggled over the years as a single parent because she can't trust men or the priesthood because of people like "Joe".
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/21/2018 02:30PM by messygoop.
Meanwhile, the victim has struggled over the years as a single parent because she can't trust men or the priesthood because of people like "Joe".
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/21/2018 02:30PM by messygoop.
And because of her wounds, the woman's children will grow up with fewer resources both emotionally and financially. They may even have trouble developing stable romantic relationships themselves and thereby disadvantage her grandchildren.
Thus the sins of the "fathers" are visited on the children unto the third and fourth generation. And the "fathers," the Bishops, will go to their graves confident that they are the victims rather than the victimizers. . .
Thanks, LDS church, for ensuring that this dynamic continues. You are truly doing God's work.
Thus the sins of the "fathers" are visited on the children unto the third and fourth generation. And the "fathers," the Bishops, will go to their graves confident that they are the victims rather than the victimizers. . .
Thanks, LDS church, for ensuring that this dynamic continues. You are truly doing God's work.
Yes I agree that Joseph L. Bishop has shown definite Joseph Smith Jr. attributes. Smith was just the most amazing person ever. Oh how we should wish it was Dec23rd right now so we could celebrate that very important annual holiday at this special season when we commemorate the birthday of that beloved prophet.
Yes I agree that this is on the not so funny side because of how I feel about Laughter. I do like stuff that's funny. But when its so funny that it causes the decibel levels of my laughter to rise to a certain level over medium then its unthinkable to raise the decibel levels anymore.
One flaw I see that Joseph Bishop had like your father is in only having 10 kids? What a small number :( It looks like someone possibly wasn't doing all they could to produce tabernacles.
Good for him in getting such a holy calling of trust to be a Branch president. Sorry to hear of him being accused. Yes I hear that Joseph Bishop was accused of some stuff. But on reading the Church's news release it makes it seem like that perhaps Bishop did some stuff but its no big deal. The real big deal in the eye of the Church is on that woman. In order to be a loyal TBM I suppose I'm going to need to go yell at all my neighbors as I disparage that woman for criticizing that holy man Joseph Bishop. But alas as we're given so many burdens to bear that we'll probably just ignore this press release altogether. However if this holy man Joseph Bishop does get made an Apostle then unquestioningly we will focus on getting more girls to spend time with this holy man and others like him.
Uh oh as soon as you wrote "Joseph Smith's sexual predator legacy" I had to stop reading what you wrote as that could cause a Doubt to form and my mind is well-conditioned to immediately shut out all such thinking so we can stay within the bounds of the well-correlated way of thinking.
Hopefully what I write helps you make perfect sense of how sensible the TBM way of thinking is. I'm always fearful that anyone claiming to be TBM might dishonestly try to spin things so I try hard to present things from the honest TBM perspective so people can see how wondrous this way of thinking is.
Yes I agree that this is on the not so funny side because of how I feel about Laughter. I do like stuff that's funny. But when its so funny that it causes the decibel levels of my laughter to rise to a certain level over medium then its unthinkable to raise the decibel levels anymore.
One flaw I see that Joseph Bishop had like your father is in only having 10 kids? What a small number :( It looks like someone possibly wasn't doing all they could to produce tabernacles.
Good for him in getting such a holy calling of trust to be a Branch president. Sorry to hear of him being accused. Yes I hear that Joseph Bishop was accused of some stuff. But on reading the Church's news release it makes it seem like that perhaps Bishop did some stuff but its no big deal. The real big deal in the eye of the Church is on that woman. In order to be a loyal TBM I suppose I'm going to need to go yell at all my neighbors as I disparage that woman for criticizing that holy man Joseph Bishop. But alas as we're given so many burdens to bear that we'll probably just ignore this press release altogether. However if this holy man Joseph Bishop does get made an Apostle then unquestioningly we will focus on getting more girls to spend time with this holy man and others like him.
Uh oh as soon as you wrote "Joseph Smith's sexual predator legacy" I had to stop reading what you wrote as that could cause a Doubt to form and my mind is well-conditioned to immediately shut out all such thinking so we can stay within the bounds of the well-correlated way of thinking.
Hopefully what I write helps you make perfect sense of how sensible the TBM way of thinking is. I'm always fearful that anyone claiming to be TBM might dishonestly try to spin things so I try hard to present things from the honest TBM perspective so people can see how wondrous this way of thinking is.
LOL!
You nailed it. And here is a huge rub. My adopted sisters accusing my father to a high school counselor caused DFS and the police to get involved.
If they had only gone to the bishop what would have happened?
Oh, well, I will tell you what did happen.
People stuck by my father knowing he did it. The church excommunicated him and wouldn't let him back in for a decade. He was pissed because while everyone treated him really nice he couldn't go to his beloved temple.
You nailed it. And here is a huge rub. My adopted sisters accusing my father to a high school counselor caused DFS and the police to get involved.
If they had only gone to the bishop what would have happened?
Oh, well, I will tell you what did happen.
People stuck by my father knowing he did it. The church excommunicated him and wouldn't let him back in for a decade. He was pissed because while everyone treated him really nice he couldn't go to his beloved temple.
I personally know Joseph Bishop and his late wife Carolyn. I also lived in their home the summer of 1985 while he was then President of the MTC in Provo.
They have 5 sons not 10 Greg, Robert, Michael, Steven and Scott.
They lived in a large home in Sherwood Hills in Provo, the home was owned by the church and given to them to reside in while he held that calling. All bills were paid, including the telephone which I used a lot during that time to call my family in England.
During my stay there there were often GA's visiting and staying. Two I remember were Dallin Oaks, because i cooked him breakfast. And Robert Wells, he talked about his daughter who was the then "Miss America".
Joseph and CArolyn were nothing but nice and helpful to me. I was a newly divorced 26 year old with a toddler daughter. They treated me as family.
Joseph did have many one on one conversations with me during my stay, kind of like a bishop would who was giving advice. I wonder now if I was being groomed. We shall never know.
He never made me feel uncomfortable or that the conversations were not as they should have been.
He even got me a part time job working at the MTC. He also helped me get into BYU and helped me with the difficult details of obtaining student loans.He was nothing but helpful.
So reading what we now all know, has been very unsettling and shocking to those of us who know him.
Listening to that tape of him, he is guilty very guilty. I also think he might have the start of becoming senile. Or if chooses which things to remember and which to forget.
His son Greg is now representing his fathers case, and of course it labeling the lady who recorded it as no more than a nutcase and someone with serious issues, that he has said she has done before, his father is not the only person to feel her wrath. Of course he is going to defend his father, who wouldn't.
But regardless of what the church "statement" is ..... Joseph admitted to molesting woman .... he even said he would be excommunicated if the church knew ....
I think he was interviewed back in 2010 when they were first told of this, i think at the time he lied through his teeth because there was no tape. Now there is .....i doubt they have listened to it. How you could not find him guilty after listening to it is insane.
They will more or less ask him to go away quietly and without fuss, and simply slip into the back ground somewhere.
I have no doubt he has had his second anointing ....but so did that GA who got exed last year and they made it public. ... we don't know why they exed him, all very hush hush. But we do know what Mr Bishop has done, this is a terrible PA for the church, doesn't shed good light on them at all, and we all know how they feel about that.
When I was living with Joe and Carolyn he had already committed this "act" with the sister missionary who has now brought this to our attention ... did I know, of course not. Could I tell from his actions he was a sex preditor ....nope no clue at all. He certainly hid it well. I may have become a victim myself if I had not moved out of that home. We were alone many times in that house.
My heart goes out to his family ....for they must be shock, even if they don't believe the stories, the fact that someone has brought this to the attention of now the world ....I'm sure it crosses their mind and the woman in the family might question some of his actions over the years and wonder? I know I would.
They have 5 sons not 10 Greg, Robert, Michael, Steven and Scott.
They lived in a large home in Sherwood Hills in Provo, the home was owned by the church and given to them to reside in while he held that calling. All bills were paid, including the telephone which I used a lot during that time to call my family in England.
During my stay there there were often GA's visiting and staying. Two I remember were Dallin Oaks, because i cooked him breakfast. And Robert Wells, he talked about his daughter who was the then "Miss America".
Joseph and CArolyn were nothing but nice and helpful to me. I was a newly divorced 26 year old with a toddler daughter. They treated me as family.
Joseph did have many one on one conversations with me during my stay, kind of like a bishop would who was giving advice. I wonder now if I was being groomed. We shall never know.
He never made me feel uncomfortable or that the conversations were not as they should have been.
He even got me a part time job working at the MTC. He also helped me get into BYU and helped me with the difficult details of obtaining student loans.He was nothing but helpful.
So reading what we now all know, has been very unsettling and shocking to those of us who know him.
Listening to that tape of him, he is guilty very guilty. I also think he might have the start of becoming senile. Or if chooses which things to remember and which to forget.
His son Greg is now representing his fathers case, and of course it labeling the lady who recorded it as no more than a nutcase and someone with serious issues, that he has said she has done before, his father is not the only person to feel her wrath. Of course he is going to defend his father, who wouldn't.
But regardless of what the church "statement" is ..... Joseph admitted to molesting woman .... he even said he would be excommunicated if the church knew ....
I think he was interviewed back in 2010 when they were first told of this, i think at the time he lied through his teeth because there was no tape. Now there is .....i doubt they have listened to it. How you could not find him guilty after listening to it is insane.
They will more or less ask him to go away quietly and without fuss, and simply slip into the back ground somewhere.
I have no doubt he has had his second anointing ....but so did that GA who got exed last year and they made it public. ... we don't know why they exed him, all very hush hush. But we do know what Mr Bishop has done, this is a terrible PA for the church, doesn't shed good light on them at all, and we all know how they feel about that.
When I was living with Joe and Carolyn he had already committed this "act" with the sister missionary who has now brought this to our attention ... did I know, of course not. Could I tell from his actions he was a sex preditor ....nope no clue at all. He certainly hid it well. I may have become a victim myself if I had not moved out of that home. We were alone many times in that house.
My heart goes out to his family ....for they must be shock, even if they don't believe the stories, the fact that someone has brought this to the attention of now the world ....I'm sure it crosses their mind and the woman in the family might question some of his actions over the years and wonder? I know I would.
Thanks for bumping that, EB. It's pretty harrowing reading, although the woman is extremely brave (and restrained, IMO). It really shows the internal workings of the so-called church.
No action was taken - except that he never became a Seventy... Aah, diddums :-/
Tom in Paris
No action was taken - except that he never became a Seventy... Aah, diddums :-/
Tom in Paris