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Posted by: jett ( )
Date: June 09, 2018 06:43PM

I resigned a couple of months ago and had no problems doing so. The time it took to do so was fast. I have been told that the church keeps records on all members, even if they resign or are excommunicated. How can I go about getting my records permanently deleted from their computer servers and storage facilities such as Granite Mountain? How can I be sure my name is not being used for BOTD or any other purpose? I really want out for good. Can I sue them to delete the records? I really feel my life has been messed up because of this cult.

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Posted by: Cheryl ( )
Date: June 09, 2018 06:47PM

They keep them in case you decide to return or to restore your church blessings in temple rites after death.

In the US there isn't a way to wrench these materials away from the mormon church.

I've heard that this is possible in certain other countries.

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Posted by: jett ( )
Date: June 09, 2018 06:50PM

I am not going back (ever), and I have never been through the temple.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/09/2018 06:55PM by jett.

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Posted by: Thomas $. Monson ( )
Date: June 09, 2018 07:03PM

Cheryl Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> I've heard that this is possible in certain other countries.


It is definitely possible in Italy, through a court order — we also talked on this board about a former member who managed to sue the Mormon church and won — and it should be possible in all EU countries, since they have the same personal data legislation.

The procedure is described here: https://evidence-based.review/mormoni-tempio-roma-chiesa-gesu-cristo-santi-ultimi-giorni-setta-italia-6252626162.html (use Google translator)

I don't think it is possible in the US.

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Posted by: quidprostatusquo ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 07:55PM

Even so, they'd have to maintain a record of the deletion event, which of course would have to reference the name itself, otherwise how could the church demonstrate to the court that the deletion took place? Therefore, the name is still there, in a different kind of file.

You can check out, but you can never leave.

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Posted by: not logged in, nli ( )
Date: June 09, 2018 07:24PM

TBH, I doubt they wipe the records even in Europe. Most likely they transfer everything over to the US. Italian courts of course have zero authority here, and can't really do much about it.

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Posted by: Thomas $. Monson ( )
Date: June 09, 2018 07:34PM

well, I can't say you're wrong. In theory (and in practice) they could transfer the contested personal data to Utah just before deleting the data in Italy or in the EU. Technically this would be legal because they can communicate the removals to the court, but, as you said, the court has no authority to check outside the EU.


PS: come to think of it, there is no need to transfer anything… since, if I'm not mistaken, the data is already in Utah too right from the start.

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Posted by: Badassadam1 ( )
Date: June 09, 2018 07:28PM

If you ever figure out how to get totally off all records let me know.

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Posted by: jett ( )
Date: June 09, 2018 07:30PM

Mark N. says they do not have enough resources to take on this kind of case. Maybe someday this issue will make it to the Supreme Court (dreaming).

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Posted by: Thomas $. Monson ( )
Date: June 09, 2018 09:48PM

jett Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Maybe someday this issue will make it to the Supreme
> Court (dreaming).


Reality: it will never happen.

Dream: it would be the end of the Cult of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, because every temple ritual would be illegal in the US. Sadly, it's just a dream.

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Posted by: BiochemBlend ( )
Date: June 10, 2018 02:25AM

I think that some people are better off returning to the church; the really screwed up ones.

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Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: June 10, 2018 04:54AM

Why, so TSCC can screw them up even more than it already has?

That is pretty effed up, drive-by poster. Your synapses are missing some connecting wires!

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Posted by: BiochemBlend ( )
Date: June 10, 2018 05:38PM

I wasn’t talking to you Amyjo but I do appreciate your posts and that through your own walk you Have stayed a Christian. It’s the only thing that matters.

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Posted by: Babyloncansuckit ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 07:39PM

I thought staying a fan of your favorite NFL team was the only thing that matters.

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Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: June 09, 2018 07:31PM

Until or unless the US Supreme Court orders them to cease and desist in baptism for the dead, it will be a practice that will continue for you, me, and other ex-Mormons who've resigned after we're dead. Same goes for those who were excommunicated.

TSCC only followed the letter of the law concerning polygamy when it became a federal law prohibiting its practice.

Until people rise up and file a lawsuit prepared to take it all the way (yes, we do have legal standing to bring one,) our voices are silenced regarding cult practices of our names and the names of our loved ones who wish no association with the cult in life or in death regarding this reprehensible practice.

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Posted by: SL Cabbie ( )
Date: June 09, 2018 07:44PM

Is that your first name? Because if it is, you're probably in for a helluva suprise...

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: June 09, 2018 07:51PM

I understand your strong feelings on the matter.

You have done everything that you can to disassociate yourself from the church. At this point in time the Mormon church keeps your name in a special file indicating that you have resigned. There are currently no U.S. laws that compel the church to remove your name entirely.

European countries have different, and stricter laws regarding data privacy that may apply.

Unfortunately, nothing currently prevents a church member from performing BFTD on you one day. The church has come to agreement with members of the Jewish community regarding this, which even then is followed imperfectly. I find the practice as disrespectful and objectionable as you do. My nevermo Episcopal great grandmother (who has absolutely no Mormon descendants) was given BFTD on three separate occasions. The uncaring strangers who performed this ordinance were also very sloppy with her genealogy.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/09/2018 07:52PM by summer.

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Posted by: thedesertrat1 ( )
Date: June 09, 2018 08:23PM

Could this be a project for a really good hacker?

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Posted by: ificouldhietokolob ( )
Date: June 10, 2018 07:02AM

thedesertrat1 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Could this be a project for a really good hacker?

Wouldn't help.
This record-obsessed church has paper backups of everything. And microfilm. And probably several off-line digital copies.

Don't forget, this is an organization that dug a huge vault out of a granite mountain in order to preserve their precious records. It would likely be trivial to hack their computer system and remove stuff from the current database, but that wouldn't do anything about the copies and backups.

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Posted by: jett ( )
Date: June 10, 2018 07:39AM

ificouldhietokolob Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> thedesertrat1 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Could this be a project for a really good
> hacker?
>
> Wouldn't help.
> This record-obsessed church has paper backups of
> everything. And microfilm. And probably several
> off-line digital copies.
>
> Don't forget, this is an organization that dug a
> huge vault out of a granite mountain in order to
> preserve their precious records. It would likely
> be trivial to hack their computer system and
> remove stuff from the current database, but that
> wouldn't do anything about the copies and backups.


This right here is what I am talking about. The amount of information they have on people goes beyond creepy. Just knowing they have this information makes my blood boil. I am related to one of the top 15. Maybe I should start a letter writing campaign and tell him how I really feel about this cult.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/10/2018 07:42AM by jett.

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Posted by: Babyloncansuckit ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 07:43PM

They’ve had 190 years to perfect character assassination. Just look at the recent “MTC rape room” case.

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Posted by: exminion ( )
Date: June 09, 2018 08:34PM

I know just how you feel, jett.

I don't have enough pages to describe the abuse and torture that the Mormons and their cult perpetrated against me and my children--and we were always faithful, good people. I think our experiences were worse than usual.

One thing I needed to cut out of my life--like a malignant tumor--was a temple marriage to a wife-beater, who almost killed me. I got a civil divorce, but I and my family were physically threatened and stalked. I was afraid for all of us. The military took him away (his own family had disowned him for beating his brother and sisters), and he quickly found another TBM victim, who was as trusting and inexperienced as I had been, and he became obsessed with beating her to a pulp, instead of me. I tried for 20 years, to get a temple divorce, and the leaders would promise to look into it...promise to ask higher-up church leaders...when the leadership would change, the new leaders would try...yes, my hairdresser got a temple divorce, but her father was best friends with GBH...no, no woman could ever get a temple divorce...yes, my ex's second temple wife, and his third temple wife divorced him for extreme physical violence, too...oh, but this thug is still a "member in good standing" and is going to the Mormon singles dances looking for his fourth polygamous temple wife. He's two-up on Russell Nelson!

Anyway, you can imagine by my rant that I have a compelling reason to END my temple sealing and any connection whatsoever with the Mormon cult. My temple sealing includes my own children, born with my second husband several years later--the temple thug claims those as his eternal possessions.

It is becoming "eternal", because there is no hope.

I resigned officially in a letter, in which I quoted the cult's own "Handbook of Instructions" that ALL temple "blessings" are withdrawn! For example, if a resigned or ex-ed Mormon wants to re-join, they have to repeat each ritual, from the ground up, starting with baptism, as if starting over. If your records are still "in tact", then why does the cult need you to repeat all of this?

I quoted several officiators, one at my own temple wedding, who say in their temple wedding ceremony, "If both or one of you fails to live up to the commandments, your marriage is null and void! One of the commandments is "Thou shalt not kill", and my ex tried to kill me. Also, there's lying and cheating, and stealing, and breaking civil marriage covenants of loving and cherishing (the last two are not temple covenants).

If you are renouncing the Mormon religion, then your baptism and other covenants are null and void. I made it clear in writing (with copies) that my minor children and I have nothing to do with the Mormon church, or its temple rituals, and it is all a hoax, perpetrated to get money. Joseph Smith was nothing but a con-man. You will find your own words, and create your own beautiful letter. Send it to the COB!

I have ex-Mormon friends who resign again, every year, in that mass resignation at Ensign Peak, SLC.

Yes--it is all fake. It is all arbitrary, stacked against you. It is stacked in favor of the cult getting your money and your children.

You have a RIGHT--it is a human-rights issue--to declare yourself not a member of this cult! My simply declaring it, it is so, by rights. With all other churches, you just walk out the door, and not come back. No resignation is required, even if you have been baptized.

I thought it might help to have myself baptized into another church, and it did, a little, but it's all such a crazy-making mind game. I still believed in Christ, and during my baptism, I silently prayed away any connection with the "evil cult of Mormonism." Baptism into another religion helped my son, who, when approached by missionaries, simply says, "I'm Lutheran." and slams the door. It helps him put the name of another religion on hospital and doctors' forms, etc.

I don't want to belong to any church, though.

Finally, what helped the most was for me to get rid of the Mormon brainwashing. I still had fear, and superstitions, perfectionism, and low self-esteem, to get rid of. I went to a psychiatrist, thinking I was depressed, but he diagnosed me with PTSD (the abuse had been extreme), like Veterans have. It was all tied together, and it wasn't until I officially resigned, that I finally started to flush Mormonism out of my life. The day I walked out of the Mormon church building for good, all of my so-called depression vanished, and has not returned.

You are still better off than you were, right?

Sorry to ramble, but all these things worked, for me, and I really did have to work at it. Instead of "cutting out a tumor", I decided that the Mormon ugliness could be replaced, with other things. I forgot the memorized Mormon fake scriptures, and remembered quotes from Shakespeare, poems, Bible quotes, factual information, Spanish and Swedish vocabulary words. Happy thoughts replaced the Mormon negativity. Sounds overly simple, but that's how the memory works, by the "extinction" of thoughts. I got rid of all Mormon music, Mormon publications, Mormon clothes, anything at all Mormon, even Mormon recipes.

It was like I had given my life an enema!

It was all that I had the power to do, but along the way, I got busier and more involved with my family and career, found new hobbies, worked on old and new relationships, and, after several years (be patient) I can see that cult in the rear view mirror, appearing smaller.

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Posted by: Pooped ( )
Date: June 10, 2018 05:14PM

I had the same problem with a credit union I joined and then left. They wanted my business so badly they just kept sending letter after letter saying they wanted my business back. I kept writing them back to say I wasn't going to move back to their city and did not want to rejoin. They always had a reason why I should stay with them. Finally, they stopped sending marketing letters but it took a long time and I'm sure I'm still in their data base. Not much you can do. That is why privacy laws and computer security are such big issues. I really wish there was a way to get my private information erased from all the companies that do not need it and I don't want them to have it.

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Posted by: azsteve ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 09:07AM

The church has to keep some records of their past association with you. Otherwise, anyone could be excommunicated, demand and get (through legal enforcement) all records of them completely erased, and then join the church again as a new membernthe next day. The church would lose their ability to shun and shame you for a year or two while you work your way back in with them. If the bishop tells you that all records of you were removed, he could still say "..but I still remember excommunicating you last month". Then you could just move and get baptised in to your new ward as a new member. The church in Salt Lake would never find out in many cases. Being forced to remove all records of their affiliation with you would change how the church handles excommunication.

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Posted by: sbg ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 01:18PM

To me getting kicked out (excommunication) is very different than quitting. If you quit you should be able to demand your records disappear.

They should be allowed to keep the records of people they kicked out since they did not leave of their own free will.

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Posted by: jett ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 06:47PM

I agree, those that were ex'd should have a very basic record, like their name and offense and that is it. For those that leave willingly, all records should be handed over and all copies destroyed. My name is most likely in a file in Granite Mountain and will probably remain there for as long as it stands. Plus any name regardless they have will be used for BFTD. I don't want any part of that.

I called the cult IT department and they said currently destruction of physical or computer records is not possible. But they hinted at the fact that they were aware of issues with it and are working on a solution. He told me to call back in about 5 years, no joke. Is it just me or does the cult seem to be about 60 years behind the times?

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