Recovery Board  : RfM
Recovery from Mormonism (RfM) discussion forum. 
Go to Topic: PreviousNext
Go to: Forum ListMessage ListNew TopicSearchLog In
Posted by: praydude ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 01:01PM

Just to follow up on this topic I posted a couple of weeks ago...

(backstory)[ My nephew graduated from BYU-I with an mechanical engineering degree last winter and he still has not been able to find a job 6 months later. This leads to the question "is an engineering degree from BYU-I worth anything?"]

I read all of the wonderful advice I got from posting this the first time and I talked to my brother (the grad's dad) about some possible remedies for this situation. I have found out the following:

= My nephew graduated near the top of his class with a 3.8 GPA.

= He has had several interviews that led nowhere
- He has put approximately 50 resumes out there
- He is not looking to stay local
- He does NOT have any mechanical hobbies like fixing cars. It should be noted here that he is seeking a job in aerospace and my brother DOES HAVE a dilapidated aircraft that he could be working on. I think it is a Piper Arrow. When I asked my brother about it he said that fixing it requires an A/P licence and my nephew doesn't want to get one. Hmmm...

I did point out that the act of fixing the airplane would show his potential employers his passion for aviation.

- He has no interest in joining the military. I suspect he is too overweight and doesn't want to do anything about it.

One final note - He is a member of the ASME and is scheduled to take the certification exam next month.

I don't really know my nephew that well. We have probably spent a couple days over our whole lifetime together. I suspect he is a bit arrogant and entitled (TBM/RM after all). Perhaps being a mechanic is beneath him. That could be a big turn-off. I'm not sure he is that socialized since he was home-schooled (up until college) his entire life by his TBM mom. IMO he probably does not interview well. - So there's that. I will let you all know when/if he gets hired as soon as I find out.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/11/2018 01:03PM by praydude.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Bite Me ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 01:09PM

Nothing from BYU-I is worth it.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Lethbridge Reprobate ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 01:12PM

Level of trust in a bridge built by an engineer from BYU or one from MIT...hmmmmm

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: smirkorama ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 01:15PM

praydude Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Just to follow up on this topic I posted a couple
> of weeks ago...
>
> (backstory)[ My nephew graduated from BYU-I with
> an mechanical engineering degree last winter and
> he still has not been able to find a job 6 months
> later. This leads to the question "is an
> engineering degree from BYU-I worth anything?"]
>
> I read all of the wonderful advice I got from
> posting this the first time and I talked to my
> brother (the grad's dad) about some possible
> remedies for this situation. I have found out the
> following:
>
> = My nephew graduated near the top of his class
> with a 3.8 GPA.
>
> = He has had several interviews that led nowhere
> - He has put approximately 50 resumes out there
> - He is not looking to stay local
> - He does NOT have any mechanical hobbies like
> fixing cars. It should be noted here that he is
> seeking a job in aerospace and my brother DOES
> HAVE a dilapidated aircraft that he could be
> working on. I think it is a Piper Arrow. When I
> asked my brother about it he said that fixing it
> requires an A/P licence and my nephew doesn't want
> to get one. Hmmm...
>
> I did point out that the act of fixing the
> airplane would show his potential employers his
> passion for aviation.
>
> - He has no interest in joining the military. I
> suspect he is too overweight and doesn't want to
> do anything about it.
>
> One final note - He is a member of the ASME and is
> scheduled to take the certification exam next
> month.
>
> I don't really know my nephew that well. We have
> probably spent a couple days over our whole
> lifetime together. I suspect he is a bit arrogant
> and entitled (TBM/RM after all).


> Perhaps being a
> mechanic is beneath him.

that is the way that many engineers feel -the ones who could not change their own flat tire, and that pretty much suck at engineering, the kind that I deal with all the time, correcting/ doing their work.

> That could be a big
> turn-off. I'm not sure he is that socialized
> since he was home-schooled (up until college) his
> entire life by his TBM mom. IMO he probably does
> not interview well. - So there's that. I will
> let you all know when/if he gets hired as soon as
> I find out.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: praydude ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 02:56PM

That's what I'm thinking. It seems like he COULD overcome the fact that he got his degree from a below-average school if he showed some enthusiasm for all things mechanical.

I'm not even sure if it is a good career for him because he is an avid gamer and he should probably go into game design or something that aligns with his passions.

It baffles me that he is seeking a job in aerospace but does not want to get his A/P licence. Especially given his easy access to an aircraft that needs work.

I'm a 20-year vet from the USAF and I understand how important the FAA certifications and requirements are. I suppose I'm frustrated at my nephew's (and brother's) shortsightedness. Of course they know all the answers because they are TBM's and I'm an apostate.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: weeder ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 03:02PM

I'm glad it isn't on mine.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Anon 3 ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 03:13PM

Have him hire a headhunter to make his resume more computer friendly and look for leads. They are wonderful. There are several job interview questions online like star that can be practiced and most of the questions revolve sround teamwork.

These colleges all have to be certified to train the same tecniques. The one thing he should have done was an internship and his GPA, but if he comes off as a loner, theyll pass on him

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: ificouldhietokolob ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 03:28PM

If he's had several interviews that led nowhere, I suspect the issue isn't where he got his degree...

Maybe some help with how to conduct yourself in an interview would be the next step? It's not a skill everyone knows "naturally..."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/11/2018 03:28PM by ificouldhietokolob.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: scmd1 ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 03:38PM

I agree with those who suggest there's a problem beyond where he obtained his degree, though BYU-Idaho is close to as far from prestigious as an academic institution can get. The acceptance rate there was 99.6% in 2015.

If he's like many TBM males, he may be difficult to help, because he may not want to admit there's an issue in the areas where he truly needs help. I obviously don't know him, though, so I may be making unfair assumptions.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: caffiend ( )
Date: June 12, 2018 04:13AM

It's possible to get pushed into a field one does not like, or start, and commit oneself, to a program (major) and get so far into it that it's not feasible to change course (pun intended). Sometimes people get deep into a career path because of family pressure or something.

In which case, he just has to make a hard decision to either move forward or explore other options.

I read an article in the WSJ that not only is the nation short on long-haul truck drivers, but the Permian Basin (west TX/NM) is especially desperate. Truckers are making $100K+ there. Maybe CDL training might do the trick. Or chef's school. Or take his engineering degree and pick up construction management courses. Have him think outside the proverbial box.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: East Coast Exmo ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 04:11PM

Perhaps it's time for a master's degree at a better school.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: East Coast Exmo ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 05:24PM

Or perhaps a certificate program in project management or a good programming course that's aimed at mathematical modeling.

The worst thing for your nephew would be a blank gap on his resume.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: MnRN ( )
Date: June 12, 2018 12:25AM

I worked with a very good nursing assistant who had an engineering degree but couldn't get a job because he was painfully shy, visibly uncomfortable with others, and had poor communication skills. He went back to get a masters degree but still could not get an engineering job.
Years ago I read a story, which may be apocryphal, that MIT required a social skills class for all their masters candidates.
Interviewers are looking for people who have emotional intelligence as well as intellectual achievement. Employees with low EQ often end up being an HR nightmare; and in the current litigious state of our country employees who cannot get along with others can cost a company a lot of money. You may find articles referring to EQ (vs. IQ). There are trainers and life coaches who specialize in "soft skills" (how to interact with others).
Home schooling can be a great thing for people who naturally flourish in social situations, but traditional schools teach things some parents can't give their kids at home.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: summer ( )
Date: June 12, 2018 05:33AM

My brother got a civil engineering degree from MIT long ago. He knew he had to think more broadly, however, so he joined a fraternity there in order to increase his social skills. He also took liberal arts courses (as the school required,) in order to be a more well-rounded person and graduate.

Another thing he did was to join the ROTC (Army Corps of Engineers.) It gave him a guaranteed job when he got out. Along with his engineering degree he learned computer programming languages in school, and the army loved that.

Eventually he got his graduate degrees in project management. He wanted a very practical, hirable field. He had an excellent career that held his interest for many years. He built a number of important, high-visibility projects.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: thedesertrat1 ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 07:26PM

His attitude bespeaks arrogance. This will affect interviews adversely. In the current job market he is non placeable.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: JoeSmith666 ( )
Date: June 11, 2018 07:42PM

He needs to get his head out of his ass and go for a job - not expect a "position".

North Dakota oil fields are hiring. The State has 30-40,000 job openings. Much in the Oil Patch and Wind Energy field. Some are sure to be Perfect for mechanical engineering degree grads.

Add in the State is leading the way in UAV research with University of North Dakota partnering with the US Air Force in Unmanned Aerial Vehicle research, performance and training.

If they kid can't get a job - it is because he does not want one.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: June 12, 2018 12:43AM

My uncle has his master's degree in Mechanical Engineering from UC Berkeley.

He got his start at Texas Instruments. But that was early 1960's. It's a different world out there today.

Your nephew likely needs to get an advanced degree to specialize in his field. My uncle was self-employed after his initial entry into his field, post-university.

Uncle invented microchips and has 28 patents of things he's invented. He rode the highs and lows of Silicon Valley by re-inventing himself into an expert witness and satellite consultant. After that, he re-invented himself again into a con artist to keep up appearances.

Last I heard he was a sales consultant for Apple. That's most likely a ruse. We haven't spoken since he committed a bank heist where I live. Only my children and I were able to ID him from Crimestoppers. He freaked us all out. He went from mechanical engineering degree to sociopath. Still hasn't come clean. Sociopaths don't.

Your nephew though should seriously consider a graduate degree.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: summer ( )
Date: June 12, 2018 05:38AM

Like others, I'm wondering if your nephew needs help with his resume and his interviewing and communication skills.

Also, given his interest in aeronautical engineering, I'm wondering if the kinds of companies that he's applying to are simply hiring aeronautical engineering grads as opposed to mechanical engineers.

He may be turning up his nose at the military, but that's how my engineer brother got his start (Army Corps of Engineers.) Later my brother went to work for the state of California, and only after that, turned to private industry.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: praydude ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 01:25PM

So...I talked to my other brother yesterday and he had some observations on the situation...he suspects our nephew is gay. Not that being gay means he doesn't want to get a job BUT my brother thinks our nephew has a lover in the area and he doesn't want to move far away.

My nephew is a TBM/Rm who served his mission in a South American country and has married a girl he met down there. She has a greencard and was very poor so moving to America seems like a good move for her.

Reasons why we suspect he is gay: 1 - gayness runs in our family. I have an uncle and aunt who are gay and my son is gay. 2 - My wife (who has excellent gaydar and lots of gay friends) has said she thinks he's gay. 3 - a year ago when my nephew was newly married he and his wife were visiting their dad she was sent back to Rexburg on a BUS BY HERSELF so her husband (my nephew) could hang out with a close friend in Vegas for a week!?? Who would put their new bride who has only been in the country for 6 months on a bus by herself for a ride across 3 states? That doesn't sound like love to me. Obviously he wants to be with his friend more than his own bride. Hmmm...

I suspect my nephew is deeply conflicted and I hope he can move forward with his life while being his true self. I think he may be at a crossroads and doesn't see a way forward without dying inside.

My other brother and I suspect that he has been throwing away his job interviews because he doesn't want to leave but he needs to find a job because he can't be a good mormon husband while living with his wife in their dad's basement.

Has anyone out there heard of RM who marry disadvantaged women so they can have a wife and remain in-the-closet?

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 02:25PM

Mormonism: the scam that keeps on giving.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: midwestanon ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 04:55PM

My cousin married a woman so he could continue being a child molesting pedophile and piece of shit scum of the earth. I’m not sure if he’s gay or straight; i’m not sure if he knows .

Without further digression though I suspect that practice is very common for Mormon RM’s to have beards. In fact, I think I saw some LDS video that was promoting it, talking about a man who had previously identified as gay and was now so happy to be married and have children.

Whatever the church says otherwise I am sure they are still, maybe in a more underhanded and low profile fashion, encouraging male members who are gay to marry in an effort to “fix” there homosexuality, even though I’m pretty sure in the church handbook of instructions this is explicitly decried.

As for your nephew, if he is not willing to leave the area and his sexuality has become a distraction to the point that he is unable to move out from under his parents or find a job, he has some serious thinking to do about his life, not just his career, and if he is truly living such a part of his life in secret, those kinds of things end up being outed, no pun intended, eventually. It’s often hard to decipher the true intentions of people who are keeping so much secret, so their could be many valid or no valid reasons for his inability to find a job.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/13/2018 04:58PM by midwestanon.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: praydude ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 01:36PM

...so men growing beards to not be gay have never heard of the Bear community. BTW I love my friends who are bears. They are a great group of people who are organized and contribute to a lot of worthy causes.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: summer ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 05:10PM

Well, most parents get tired of supporting their employable adult children sooner or later. And most adult children get tired of being poor if they have better options.

I think my family gave me 1-2 months worth of living expenses after I got my B.A., and that was it. I was already living on my own. I had to figure it out after that. They later gave me housing and meals for a set period of time when I went to grad school. But again, after a certain amount of time I was expected to be on my feet.

In the nevermo world in which I was raised, married couples were/are expected to be self supporting. You don't get married if you can't support yourself.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: anontoday ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 09:47AM

work with a engineering with degree from BYUI. He has a barely passable technical skillset and gravitates more toward the program management side of things. he is working on a masters from a decent school... An undergrad degree just opens the door. Most employers rely more on the interview than the school on the degree.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Eric K ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 10:08AM

I worked in engineering my whole career changing disciplines within engineering a few times. I hired many engineers. The school one attended was not a major factor. Technical ability and getting along with others are the most important. I would ask prospective process control engineers, electrical engineers in automation, to draw a simple motor start/stop PLC or boolean logic diagram on a blank sheet of paper from memory. That weeded out 50% immediately. The remaining candidates who could converse and discuss electrical or automation work with some intelligence would get offered a job. Again, the school becomes irrelevant.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/14/2018 10:18AM by Eric K.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Hello99 ( )
Date: June 16, 2018 03:49PM

I have hired engineers and agree with Eric. It comes down to ability. Basic engineering questions weed out the engineers from those who just passed the classes. Doing things outside of class, like working on cars or programming robots, etc is critical.

Getting an A&P is actually pretty hard due to the experience requirements.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Ron ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 02:35PM

The three most important items to get across in an interview, which are the main traits that employers look for are:

1) That you get along well w/ people - good soft skills.

2) That you a hard worker (i.e. that you will put in a solid 8 hour day)

3) That you are dependable (i.e. don't take a lot of sick leave, on time, make deadlines, etc).

Appearance is also critical. You said he is overweight. He should go on an immediate diet and drop about 50.

Options: ReplyQuote
Go to Topic: PreviousNext
Go to: Forum ListMessage ListNew TopicSearchLog In


Screen Name: 
Your Email (optional): 
Subject: 
Spam prevention:
Please, enter the code that you see below in the input field. This is for blocking bots that try to post this form automatically.
 ********  **      **  ********  ********  **     ** 
    **     **  **  **  **           **     ***   *** 
    **     **  **  **  **           **     **** **** 
    **     **  **  **  ******       **     ** *** ** 
    **     **  **  **  **           **     **     ** 
    **     **  **  **  **           **     **     ** 
    **      ***  ***   ********     **     **     **