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Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 02:15PM

"A new gene study presents serious difficulties for the scientific theory of evolution, while bringing science one giant step closer to the Biblical story of creation.

Dr. Gerald Schroeder, an Orthodox Jewish physicist with a Ph.D. from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT), was unperturbed, noting many ways in which new discoveries such as this show how science and religious belief can be complementary.

Mark Stoeckle from The Rockefeller University in New York and David Thaler at the University of Basel in Switzerland analyzed mitochondrial DNA collected from 100,000 animal species stored in the US government-run GenBank database. Their findings were recently published in the journal Human Evolution.

In analyzing the DNA barcodes, the researchers found an indicator that showed nine out of ten of all the species of animals alive today emerged about 100,000-200,000 years ago, approximately the same time that Homo sapiens appeared.

The researchers did not provide an explanation as to what led to this sudden explosion of life, but Dr. Schroeder, did suggest a theory for this phenomenon.

“We have seen that when men show up in an ecosystem, they tend to kill off the large animals,” he told Breaking Israel News. “The presence of the first Homo sapiens 100,000 years ago may have caused a man-made bottleneck and caused a significant change in the animal population. Humans have a disproportionately significant role in these natural processes, which may be what was meant in Genesis....”

When discussing the timeline, Dr. Schroeder explained that the 100,000 year timeline did not contradict the Hebrew calendar which sets man’s creation at 5,778 years ago.

“The Biblical calendar of 6,000 years does not relate to the beginning of species,” Schroeder argued. “All animals have a nefesh (animal soul) but only Man has a neshama (human soul). Homo sapiens as a species did appear about 100,000 years ago but they wouldn’t be recognized as a person in the same way that we are. They had a nefesh but didn’t have a neshama. In scientific terms, people, as Homo sapiens, go back 100,000 years. But the Bible’s definition of a person is different. It includes a neshama. Science will not see the break, the change that occurred in man 6,000 years ago when we received a soul.”"

https://www.breakingisraelnews.com/109362/new-genetic-study-90-of-species-appeared-almost-simultaneously/?utm_source=Breaking+Israel+News&utm_campaign=8889a635cc-BIN_morning_6_18&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_b6d3627f72-8889a635cc-83499769&mc_cid=8889a635cc&mc_eid=48feea58f4

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 02:20PM

To me this is fake news.

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Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 02:21PM

It is most certainly not fake news. Look at the sources.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/13/2018 02:22PM by Amyjo.

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Posted by: baura ( )
Date: June 19, 2018 06:09PM

Amyjo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It is most certainly not fake news. Look at the
> sources.


The source is "BreakingIsraelNews, Latest news, Biblical
perspective." Religious propaganda sheets are not usually a
reliable source for scientific information.

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Posted by: Tevai ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 02:37PM

Elder Berry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> To me this is fake news.

I agree.

We know, because of increasing and proven archeological facts, that human beings were "acting human" a minimum of tens of thousands of years ago, and making a 6,000-year-ago distinction between a nefesh ("animal soul," as used here) and a neshama ("human" soul) is absurd, since we now have so great a volume of scientifically-verified data to the contrary--especially at this moment in history, as more and more scientifically-verified facts are collected which indicate that the "line" between what we have formerly considered "human" (as versus animal species we categorize as "non-human") is far more inclusive, and fluid, than we imagined even a couple of decades ago.

Sorry, Amyjo, but in my opinion, this is just Jewish right-wing, literalist, meshuggenah. ["craziness," "insanity"]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/13/2018 02:39PM by Tevai.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 02:48PM

It is assuredly fake news.

Read the underlying study: https://phe.rockefeller.edu/news/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/Stoeckle-Thaler-Final-reduced.pdf

It has nothing to do with the "biblical story of creation." It is solid science with no religious content.

What happened is that a biased publication/website took a scientific study and spun the hell out of it.

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 05:23PM

Right -- I'm at a loss as to why any religious concepts had to be mixed in with it. You also have the Cambrian Explosion approximately 541 million years ago when "most major animal phyla appeared in the fossil record."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cambrian_explosion

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 06:31PM

Yeah, summer. I think it was a biased publication with biased authors. So they took a reasonably serious study and spun the hell out of it to support their (unrelated) contention.

Just tendentious nonsense.

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Posted by: ziller ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 02:37PM

ziller can confirm this thred ~


ziller have neshama ~

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Posted by: Tevai ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 02:41PM

ziller Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ziller have neshama ~

Of this I have not the most microscopic doubt.

:)

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Posted by: Babyloncansuckit ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 07:06PM

I think they have a pill for that. Or is it blotter paper?

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Posted by: Chicken N. Backpacks ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 07:01PM

I have asthma.

But I treat it with med's.

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Posted by: MCR ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 02:42PM

Its not fake news. It's also got nothing to do with some kind of problem with evolution. Look at the actual paper, which was cited in the article. It's arguing that mitochondrial barcoding may be an effective way of isolating what is a species, citing the apparent similarities of animal species to humans--about which, much is known. That's what I got out of it anyway, having got no expertise in the subject.

However, clearly, the scientists responsible for the paper don't think they've upset evolution at all. They seem to be trying to better define what is meant by the work "species." The article, on the other hand, is trying to tie the Hebrew Bible, and theories about what it means, to a scientific paper. It's a stretch to say the least. But at least they're trying to make their revealed wisdom correspond with real science, not trying to defend their book with fake science, as others do--ahem.

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Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 03:03PM

Thank you for your insight. I couldn't agree more.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 04:20PM

"A new gene study presents serious difficulties for the scientific theory of evolution, while bringing science one giant step closer to the Biblical story of creation."

Surely that is fake news.

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Posted by: Babyloncansuckit ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 03:04PM

I would read this as the morphic field of mitochondrial DNA in animals emerged between 100,000 and 200,000 years ago.

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Posted by: slskipper ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 03:26PM

So 90% of the species alive today arose about the same time. Their progenitors did not.

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Posted by: midwestanon ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 04:37PM

I am also failing to see how this presents serious problems with evolution.

That 90% of the species that are alive today came about in the past 200,000 years seems consistent with what very little I know about biology and the rise and fall of animal species.

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Posted by: SL Cabbie ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 05:45PM

>>"A new gene study presents serious difficulties for the scientific theory of evolution, while bringing science one giant step closer to the Biblical story of creation."

Give me a B... B!

Give me a U... U!

Read the headline, peeps...

>>Animal Souls 100,000-200,000 Years Old; Human Souls Around 6,000

Now let's dissect the article:

>In analyzing the DNA barcodes. [mitochondrial] the researchers found an indicator that showed nine out of ten of all the species of animals alive today emerged about 100,000-200,000 years ago, approximately the same time that Homo sapiens appeared.

MtDNA giving an indicator involving speciation?!? Specifically the timetable for speciation?!?

Curelom Dung!

Speciation would be a function of autosomal (nuclear DNA), seriously.

What it is showing is that most of the animals extant 1-200,000 years ago have relatives that haven't gone extinct yet.

It is useful for determining how species are related, but the research is problematic.

Spare us the tabloid trash, seriously.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/13/2018 05:50PM by SL Cabbie.

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Posted by: Done & Done ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 07:55PM

Date: 06/13/2018 07:52PM

Haha "Giant step!" How desperate to claim that.

Even if this is not fake news or news presented with a biased slant, this "news" does not present a problem for the theory of evolution. While the religious are busy cherry picking to shore up their Bible, scientists are fact finding for the purpose of discovery and are quite excited over every find no matter what it is. New information is their prize, not proof of dogma.

The theory of evolution has no problem because it has nothing to lose. Unlike religion, the theory of evolution has no agenda. Evolution is something to study, a search for information that leads to ever increasing understanding of how life came to be with no foregone conclusion, such as Adam and Eve, already reached.

Religion is always having a game of Creation VS Evolution in their stadium, but the scientists in general--I dare saY--aren't even aware that the game is on. They are too busy exploring and following leads.

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Posted by: spiritist ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 08:13PM

I certainly don't believe in the 'bible' version of creation and do believe in evolution.

However, what the information may be indicating is a possible 'major catastrophic event' or other possible intervention that impacted the normal, undisrupted evolution process.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/13/2018 08:14PM by spiritist.

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Posted by: Happy_Heretic ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 08:19PM

I am frequently amazed at the illiteracy of some americans when it comes to evolution by natural selection. And it seems the more ignorant the person is, the more delighted they are to undertake the task of inevitably demonstrating... not only thier own ignorance... but, how solid the theory clearly is.

In the end, like the OP, they callow away and say ‘that is what I meant all along.’

Baffling.

HH =)

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Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 08:33PM

At least the MIT PhD didn't correlate the species timing to Noah's Ark.

:D

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Posted by: thedesertrat1 ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 08:51PM

Once again if we go to the ancient Sumerian Cuneiform tablets we see how yes all of these were brought here at once to take care of the slave species created to mine the gold necessary for preservation of the planet Nibiru. Now you can dismiss this as legend but more and more these legends are standing up under scrutiny. So giving them consideration becomes logical to the investigation.

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Posted by: spiritist ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 09:50PM

I have studied these to an extent and applied intuitive techniques to them and yes I say parts of these 'legends' cannot be ruled out.

I haven't noticed any major 'intuitive people' making any statements on this specifically but many agree 'aliens' have had an impact on Earth and human history.

The 'intuitive people' I am talking about are key members of the past life regression, remote viewing (while they worked for the government/CIA they did a lot of 'alien' projects as early as the 1970's), psychic, and medium communities.

It is very strange the government/cia would task and get positive results on so many 'alien' projects when they and the main stream media they hire appear to want the public to believe the existence of UFOs is questionable let alone 'aliens'!



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/14/2018 12:21AM by spiritist.

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Posted by: midwestanon ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 10:11PM

By many, you mean the ‘many’ community college professors of ufo-ology at the peoples correspondence college of Tampa?

Come on.

I too could purchase my L. Ron Hubbard-esque PhD from Sequoia university And start peddling bullshit nonsense about UFOs.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/13/2018 10:11PM by midwestanon.

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Posted by: Babyloncansuckit ( )
Date: June 19, 2018 01:16AM

I liked the documentary starring Will Smith and Tommy Lee Jones. If it weren’t for that darn neurolyzer, I could tell you all about my alien encounters.

Well, it’s more believable than golden plates.

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Posted by: jacob ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 10:12PM

In other news failed carbon dating on billion year old rock formations mean that they can't be a billion years old.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 12:11PM

LOL! Love it.

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Posted by: nevermojohn ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 10:32PM

So a study based on genetic evolution of mitochondrial DNA is supposed to create problems for evolution. Hmmmmmm. That does not make any internal sense.

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Posted by: Dave the Atheist ( )
Date: June 13, 2018 11:56PM

Fake news.

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Posted by: Elyse ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 12:33PM

Well, it most likely means that animal, plant and human life was seeded from another intelligent world/planet/galaxy etc.

Having the chemical building blocks for life in our soil does not mean life was created on our planet.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 12:45PM

There is nothing in the report that changes the traditional view of how life evolved on earth, so there is no need to reach for extraneous hypotheses.

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Posted by: Elyse ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 12:51PM

Evolution is a theory, just like anything else.

The fact is, we simply don't know.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 01:09PM

Evolution is a cluster of theories, most of which have been proven. That is why courts accept DNA evidence; it is why we people's ethnicities can be traced through genetics. It is why polar bears diverged from grizzlies and are, with global warming, merging back.

Some evolutionary theories are unclear on certain points and will be revised. But evolution as a whole is not "just like anything else" unless you mean it is the same as generally proven theories like relativity and quantum mechanics. You know, scientific theories that are the basis of the much of modern life including our ability to communicate via computer devises.

When the dominant theory explains most things quite reasonably, there is no reason to leap for extraneous "theories"--used this time not in a scientific sense but rather as a synonym for "fantasy"--as a superior story. There is nothing in this story that requires any amendment in the established theories of evolution, so there is no need for God or for seeding by some hypothetical extraterrestrial intelligence.

That much we do know.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/14/2018 01:10PM by Lot's Wife.

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Posted by: Elyse ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 03:01PM

Huh?

DNA is separate from "evolution".
Of course courts accept DNA

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 03:09PM

"DNA is separate from 'evolution.'"

You don't want to stick with that argument very long, Elyse.

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Posted by: Elyse ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 04:42PM

Apples and oranges.

DNA is solid science.

Evolution is just a theory, or whatever you choose to call it.

P.S.
I'm not a creationist. Just trying to keep an open mind.

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Posted by: jacob ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 04:44PM

Nucleic acid is the solid science at the core of the solid science of evolution.

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Posted by: jacob ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 01:42PM

To me this is like saying that we don't know who first used what berry as a dye for textiles.

Having a piece of something that isn't yet understood doesn't invalidate all other pieces of knowledge.

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Posted by: SL Cabbie ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 02:16PM

You're confusing the word "hypothesis" with theory; admittedly in the vernacular, "theory" doesn't have the precision that scientists give to it, but essentially a theory is scientific proposal that we can't find any evidence to refute.

Honest, it was "Atomic Theory" that leveled Hiroshima and Nagasaki in 1945.

Identifying something as "theory" in order to discredit it is an old "talking point" from the Intelligent Design/Creationist crowd.

Within the study of evolution, emerging understandings involving molecular biology are giving powerful confirmation that evolution is a fact, period.

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Posted by: Dorothy ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 03:27PM

Gravity is a theory as well.

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Posted by: jacob ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 04:48PM

Law 1: Always and inevitably everyone underestimates the number of stupid individuals in circulation.

Law 2: The probability that a certain person be stupid is independent of any other characteristic of that person.

Law 3. A stupid person is a person who causes losses to another person or to a group of persons while himself deriving no gain and even possibly incurring losses.

Law 4: Non-stupid people always underestimate the damaging power of stupid individuals. In particular non-stupid people constantly forget that at all times and places and under any circumstances to deal and/or associate with stupid people always turns out to be a costly mistake.

Law 5: A stupid person is the most dangerous type of person.



All theories.

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Posted by: Dave the Atheist ( )
Date: June 18, 2018 11:44PM

Another ignorant person who doesn't know what a scientific theory is.

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Posted by: ificouldhietokolob ( )
Date: June 19, 2018 09:38AM

Elyse Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Evolution is a theory, just like anything else.

No, evolution is an observed fact.
The "theory of evolution" (properly called the "modern synthesis") takes all of the observed facts and evidence, and uses them to explain how the observed fact of evolution works.

> The fact is, we simply don't know.

YOU might not know -- but "we" do. Because "we" bothered to learn.

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Posted by: Dorothy ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 01:36PM

Nefesh and Nashama. It's fun to learn the words for how I stayed Mormon despite believing in evolution.

I remember sitting in church and deciding that about 6,000 years ago man began knowing the difference between right and wrong and that's when God stepped in and called them Adam and Eve.

Later I realized how ugly and misogynistic the whole story was. Men don't pay for Adam's transgressions, but Eve makes all women suffer in childbirth? How is that fair?

The story wasn't needed in anyway to explain how we got here.

It felt very peaceful to stop with the mental gymnastics and just deal with evidence that makes sense.

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Posted by: koriwhore ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 02:36PM

A simple Wikipedia search would reveal Homo Sapiens are at least 300,000 years old.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homo_sapiens

Ans Homo's (Humans) are at least 1.8 million years old.

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Posted by: Aço ( )
Date: June 14, 2018 05:53PM


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Posted by: saucie ( )
Date: June 15, 2018 12:14AM

It's got to be a joke.... its got to.

somebody never heard of evolution... oh god help her/him....

how can some one be old enough to write here and never have

heard of evolution as if everything just suddenly came to life

simultaneously... Oh god... say its not true that some one

could possibly believe that.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: June 15, 2018 11:18AM

I would have thought it was The Onion.

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Posted by: fossilman ( )
Date: June 15, 2018 11:27AM

Consider the source.

It is just a preposterous comment added to real news.

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Posted by: Greyfort ( )
Date: June 19, 2018 02:31PM

A theory is as high as science gets. It means that, based on current evidence, this is our current working theory until it’s proven otherwise. But a lot of testing goes into a hypothesis before something can graduate to being the current working theory.

Unlike religion, science knows better than to call things a fact, to the point where there can be no new facts discovered.

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Posted by: donbagley ( )
Date: June 19, 2018 04:45PM

100,000 to 200,000 years ago, most species that are extant were emerging. And this proves what?

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: June 19, 2018 05:11PM

That all that time went into producing fake news.

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