I have a good friend who's Mormon who swears he's not a racist.

This is his response when I asked him why Mormons discriminated against blacks by denying them entry into the temple when you don't need the priesthood to get into a temple?

MORmON: I hear hate in your message the same hate that your taking about is the same hate on your message. Did Jesus not die for our sins?

Me: I'm not the one who hates. I hate hate. Mormon scriptures are full of racist hate. I quit because I couldn't justify the hatred that is still alive and well in Mormon scriptures. until the racist 19th Century bogus myths get redacted from the Mormon scriptures, any kind of an apology for racist practices in the past is meaningless. Mormonism is still one of the most racist institutions in America.

MORmON:What scripture?

Me: Scriptures that describe a God who turns people black when they sin, white when they repent and black again when they sin again.
That's racist AF.

After listing scriptures:

MORmON: Thanks I’ll go ask the missionaries about this, I’m in institute I’ll get back to you shortly.
They’re not actually talking about skin color but the presence of the devil within them. I pray in the name of Jesus Christ the that he frees you of demons and releases you from your bondage.

Me: Apparently you have a reading comprehension problem. It says numerous times it's their skin color. Try and be honest and I'll listen.
I was Mormon for 40 years. Not stupid.

MORmON: No you have lost the priesthood your unclean and it hard for you to feel the spirit to interpret the doctrine correctly

Me: So why'd Mormons discriminate against black skinned people if it wasn't about skin color? Quit telling me I'm evil because I ask for honest answers, just to have you tell me bullshit. That's not nice. I'm not calling you evil, just because you're in a church that's racist AF. You can't tell me it's not racist and have no answer to my question as to why they discriminated against blacks for most of their history.

MORmON: Your calling be racist and your full of hate give me a break And yes I think your being tricked by the devil
That not your real problem with the church.
Let me ask you a question.

Me: You belong to a racist church. You can't answer why it discriminated against blacks for most of its history, so you tell me I'm evil? I quit because I realized how racist it was to remain a member of a racist church. If you're not racist, then why do you make excuses for racism? And lie about it, saying it wasn't about skin color, when your scriptures are all about skin color as were the racist practices of the past. Lying is evil and you're lying through your teeth. When you say racial discrimination wasn't about skin color. BULLSHIT
It says right in black and white, it was about skin color in Mormon scriptures. Still is.

MORmON: I would love to pay you a visit and explain each one of those scriptures to you with plan logic. This is just some sort of misunderstanding.

Me: "the Lord God did cause a SKIN of blackness to come upon them." Is that not about black SKIN?

MORmON: Ya he mark of the devil
It was a curse
The devils dark curse
Your have to be a leader of your family
As a father or they will have the dark mark of the devil upon them.

Me: Obviously you've got a mental block that prevents you from reading what's written in black and white. It doesn't say anything about being a Father, or the devil, but it does say a lot about how dark skin is a curse and white skin is a blessing. That's white supremacist/racist AF. but if it's what keeps you on the straight and narrow, then more power to you Buddy.
To me, racism, misogyny and homophobia are what's really evil and Mormonism does those three more than any other church, besides the Fundamentalist version of Mormonism and their Prophet is rotting in jail for doing the same thing as Joseph Smith, sticking his dick in his follower's wives and teenage daughters.
You sing his praises knowing that? And you call me evil. haha
Hey, at least I'm not singing the praises of a cuckold bull/pedophile, so I sleep great at night.

MORmON: Ya most psychopaths do

Me: Now I'm a psychopath?
At least I'm not singing the praises of a child rapist, while children are getting raped in the church. Children I know.
Lots of them, who were enabled by this patriarchal CULT of hero worship.

Wow. Do not waste your time on such a brain dead individual. The apologetic approach to malign the questioner is a sign of desperation as there is no reasonable answer to your basic question other than it was racist.

This is textbook example of the brainwashing being 100% complete. He has reached the top level and has bought wholesale that "when the prophet has spoken, the thinking has been done."

The Mormon indoctrination and brainwashing combined with the facts you were offering would cause cog dis in a person who had not been brainwashed to the point of having no integrity at all or any awareness of how reasoning works. His brain has been placed on the Mormon altar and burnt to a crisp. He has been successfully turned into a conduit for the Mormon agenda. To him, anything his leaders say is true. Just like my family. So I say nothing. Sick of talking about the weather however.

..."Thanks I’ll go ask the missionaries about this, I’m in institute, I’ll get back to you shortly."

Like, that is going to be the definitive answer......yikes!!!

Run!...Run Like Hell!!!

Either, this is a fabricated conversation or you are speaking with the dimmest light bulb ever.

jacob Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Either, this is a fabricated conversation or you
> are speaking with the dimmest light bulb ever.

You dont know the half of it.
I finally unloaded both barrels on him and made it real personal. I didnt publish that because its too personsl. But lets just say he agreed with me in the end, that singing the praises of a kiddie rapist isnt cool when I got a 396page document detailing links to Mormon sex abuse, 6 pages of which involve the up abuse and cover up and payoffs that happened in my Ward growing up.

Always remember that cult members lie, even to themselves. Likely the fool believes every word he's saying.

I guess I kind of glossed over all this when I was a kid, but hearing about this now and seeing it crop up more and more especially as the whole 40th anniversary thing has come around has made me realize the kind of 19th-century white superiority racist nonsense Joseph Smith clearly bought in to. I don’t know if it was a common belief at the time that Native Americans were part of the curse of Cain or that their dark skin was an indicator of their inferiority, probably a little of both, but it’s pretty obvious to me that Joseoh Smith Adopted these contemporary thoughts about race and the origin of the indigenous people of the Americas for his religious drivel.

For some reason it seemed less odious to me than the priesthood ban but it really isn’t, they’re both horrible. At least the people who wrote the old testament have the excuse of having written it over 2000 years ago - if that is when it was written - and it’s hardly much of an excuse at all.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/13/2018 10:28PM by midwestanon.

in answer to the question, I would say no, here is an example. America was a racist institution during the Jim Crow days. And there were many blacks that were patriotic Americans and believed in manifest destiny and the rest. Many fought in wII. Even today there is still racism in the form of voter repression of black men especially in the State of Utah. And yet many are still patriotic and believe in America.

So you're saying those here who once participated in church were racist. I can say I never had any racist thoughts. Never thought that deeply about church teachings, except blacks being excluded from priesthood, which I found embarrassing, so went overboard to not be racist.

When you over-generalize, you lose credibility. And I believe that is the definition of bigotry, which ironically is what you claim to be against. You have hatred of all Mormons - no different than hating a race of people.

First of all, almost all racists think they are not racist. They see their attitudes as perfectly justified.

In the specific case of Mormons, their attitude is that they are not racist, they are just following orders from God. So, if you're going to blame anyone, blame God. since God is by definition blameless, any further conversation is irrelevant and absurd.

That's their attitude. It feels perfectly reasonable to them.

The first thing a racist will tell you is that she/he/it is not a racist.

And at least nine times out of ten phrase it as "I'm not racist, BUT (say racist crap)."

You are right. It's the first clue. You will also hear things like "I have a (black, gay, etc) friend, so how could I be racist/homophobic, etc?" Or they work with plenty of minority people. People's definition of racist (bigoted, homophobic, misogynistic) can be different. But if you think it's ok for someone to be treated differently because of any of those traits, you are there.

No, I don't think all mormons, people of other religions, republicans, etc. are racist or bigoted. There are people who identify with those institutions who are truly bothered by it. But at the very least, if we don't speak out or act for change, we are tolerant of racism/bigotry. And I don't know if that's any better. Tolerance of it is probably enough to earn us the title.

NormaRae Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You are right. It's the first clue. You will also
> hear things like "I have a (black, gay, etc)
> friend, so how could I be racist/homophobic, etc?"
> Or they work with plenty of minority people.
> People's definition of racist (bigoted,
> homophobic, misogynistic) can be different. But if
> you think it's ok for someone to be treated
> differently because of any of those traits, you
> are there.
>
> No, I don't think all mormons, people of other
> religions, republicans, etc. are racist or
> bigoted. There are people who identify with those
> institutions who are truly bothered by it. But at
> the very least, if we don't speak out or act for
> change, we are tolerant of racism/bigotry. And I
> don't know if that's any better. Tolerance of it
> is probably enough to earn us the title.
Which is the point NOMism becomes untenable, st least for anybody with a shred of morals/ethics.

I found it impossible to oppose Mormon racism as a New Order Mormon. In fact I was threatened with excommunication if I shared the truth with other Mormons.
"Even my Wife and kids?" I asked my asshole Bishop
"Especially your wife and kids!" He replied
He had my resignation the next day.
Fuck racist Mormons!