Every time I ask a predatory MORmON Doomsday CULT representatives a serious question like, "How do you sing the praises of a man who married his followers wives and teenage daughters as young as 14?" They lie.
They either
A. Deny he married them.
B. Claim God commanded Joseph and Brigham to marry them. Or
C. Claim other Prophets married their followers wives. Or
D. Claim that was a long time ago so we cant judge right and wrong from 200yrs away.

Or when I ask, "Why did MORmONs discriminate against blacks prior to 1978 by excluding them from their temples when you dont need Priesthood to enter a temple?" They lie by
A. Claiming God commanded it for some unknown reason or
B. Ir was a loving gesture meant to protect blacks from negative consequences or
C. Claim we don't know why, but it doesnt matter because God loves us all equally, now, and everybody gets in.

Personally it seems to me like every answer Ive heard are blatant lies and Mormons know it. If they feign ignorance, thats no excuse 20yrs after Google.
I do think the 2nd option, delusional, is also a possibility, since they persist in erroneous beliefs despite superior evidence to tge contrary.

I'm sure the church is about to go belly up, as hundreds, if not thousands of missionaries review your chat transcripts with them. Then they probably pass them around at district, zone and mission conferences.

You know, sidewalks in front of mormon churches are public, so to really get the church crumbling, get a bullhorn and start asking these questions where dozens, maybe even hundreds, of mormons can hear you, 'stead of just two or three missionaries at a time!

Record these episodes for YouTube, so that it's not just words on paper! Videos of you shucking the testimonies from all those lying, delusional or willfully ignorant mormons, like they were ripe ears of corn, would certainly go a lot farther than 'lunch with the online missionaries' every once in awhile.

If Sundays are not convenient, do it during lunch, at a school near you, in front of a seminary building! C'mon, man! Elevate your game!!!

So now I've contributed to the collapse of la iglesia mormona! Imagine how well I will sleep tonight.

When I was forced to admit there really is only one logical answer to my questions, its a fraud, I quit.
Causing CogDis by expecting real answers to real questions and not settling for cliches or bullshit is the Socratic Method, which still works, even in this post-truth "fake news" era, believe it or not.
"I cause Cognitive Dissonance which will either drive them insane or drive them sane. I hope for the latter which is all I can do after all." Ayan Hirsi Ali
I follow her advice.
If you've got a method that works better than her method or the Socratic Method feel free to test it and report the results.
Once you have 2,500 yrs of proven test results, I will use your method instead of the Socratic Method.

Hi Koriwhore.

Please help me understand something

You spend your lunch hour hurling loaded, combative questions at some poor kids; sorry, I mean “grown ass adults” staffing a scripted call center. Then complain that these people don’t depart from their script to honestly answer your loaded, combative questions. You loudly accuse them of lying and coverup.

You bemoan the fact that your hybrid “Socratic Method” has no effect but continue to endlessly employ this tactic in the undying hope that somehow, someday, cog-dis will catch hold and cause a mass exodus from the call center.

Let me try to turn this around.

Many on this board may actually agree with your hoped for outcome. Many others have made it clear that your tactics are faulty. “you can attract more with sugar than with vinegar” or something like that.

But no. Those suggestions go in one ear and out the other with gale force. It’s as if you are reading from your own script. Helpful, rational suggestions are dismissed out of hand. And then those offering suggestions are accused of siding with the call center people and assisting with the so-called coverup. And apparently these attempted helpful suggestions generate no cog-dis that your tactic may be wrong. You refuse to depart from your script.

Question. How are you so different from the call center staff?

I’ve burned my lunch hour writing this. I will now retreat certain that this will go nowhere, but maybe somehow someday cog-dis will catch hold.

But I doubt it.

koriwhore Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> If you've got a method that works better than ...
> the Socratic Method feel free to test and report
> the results.
>
> Once you have 2,500 yrs of proven test results, I
> will use your method instead of the Socratic Method.


The Socratic Technique is a 'teaching' method in which the student does his or her best to respond to the teacher's questions. Cooperation and mutual respect are involved.

You cannot call what you do "the Socratic Method". That is the last thing it is.

The Socratic method is to willfully suppose their asserted premise politely. And then to ask a question which answer leads to another question until the answerer's premise is understood by the answerer to be unsupported.

The sicratic question is never an attack but a question necessary for the questioner to understand the premise.


An attempt at an example: kw Is koriwhorey is missionary

Kw
So Jospeph Smith was a polyagmist?

My
Yes, as a prophet he recieved a revelation that it was necessary.

Kw
Oh, and this revelation says what exactly?

My
It's in doctrine and covenants 132. (Some summary given)

ky
So why shouldone accept that as divine rather than, say, self serving swinging?

My
We know he was a prophet because it is confirmed to us in prayer. Have you prayed about js?

Kw
Wait a minute and we'll get to that. So any prayerful confirmation is accurate and reliable?

My
Of course. God speaks to prophets and confirms their Revelations to us in prayers.

Kw
And we know this how?

My
The scriptures say so.

Kw and we know the scriptures are revealed as prayer confirms that.
My
Correct.
Kw
But the scriptures are contradictory, even js said so.
My
that's why we need continuing revelation to know the corrections

Ky
Isn't that circular that the scripture say the way to know is to pray and God will tell you it's right? But it's not right and needs corrections. Maybe the prayer part was wrong. Why wouldn't God save the extra run aroundand tell us all directly. Then we wouldn't have to fuss with faulty scripture and prophets who are fallible. I mean a prophets claim is just hear say and only gods words to him. God would have to speak to me first so I would know what he actually said. I'm not bound by what he tells someone else.

My
But the scriptures say we have to follow the prophets.

Ky
but that's just part of that self justifying circularity.

My
I know that God answers prayers about the scriptures and we have a prophet...

Ky
How do you know that's god? Isn't that back to the circle again?

Some, might be, yes. Certainly not all.

My experience is that most members I know and have known personally, (including my husband) are true believers. They will stake their entire life on their "spiritual witness" and testimony, that they know the claims of Joseph Smith Jr. that he "Restored the Only True Church of Jesus Christ with the keys of authority to perform the Saving Ordinances on Earth" is true. This is 100% truth. They are not lying about anything. Never. Not even possible. Even to question is not ever considered.

There may be some that know that the claims can only be believed by faith even though they know they not able to be factually proven with evidence. As one told me, "we claim the Church will bless your life."

True believers place their unwavering faith on inverting the LDS Church claims. They will follow the prophet without questioning. They are, for the most part, honest, ethical, moral, hard working people. They are without guile.

Oh how I'd like to talk to my husband now. He passed away Jan of 2013.

My view is that the LDS Church is solid, financially. The membership may dwindle, but the organization is solid.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/10/2018 09:35PM by SusieQ#1.

Hey. I've been following your posts for a long time. You're still trying to apply rational answers to an irrational organization. Mormonism started as a scam and still is today. It's about power, women and money. It's a cult, with a cult leader. Maybe if you'd stop expecting LDS Inc. to behave like real religions,instead of a real estate pyramid scheme, you'd sleep easier.

Having lived in UT for several years and visited many times, it became abundantly clear that Mormonism is a generational, very organized religion with a unique language and culture of it's own. Nothing escapes the Mormon belief system. The leadership of the church has immense power over the government in UT, also.
I've been told that much the same can be said for Idaho and many parts of Arizona.

So? It's still a real estate and investment company, masquerading as a religion. Their sole purpose is to enrich those at the top of the pyramid. To try to compare them to caring, loving, fair and honest religion, is futile.

StillAnon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So? It's still a real estate and investment
> company, masquerading as a religion. Their sole
> purpose is to enrich those at the top of the
> pyramid. To try to compare them to caring, loving,
> fair and honest religion, is futile.


Here's my take on the whole shebang. The LDS Church leaders knew some many decades ago, it would never survive on it's own claims, and membership, hence the ever increasing, massive real estate and investments.
It's become an empire, happily touting their mounting coffers.

“Nothing escapes the Mormon belief system.”

Except the truth.

StillAnon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hey. I've been following your posts for a long
> time. You're still trying to apply rational
> answers to an irrational organization. Mormonism
> started as a scam and still is today. It's about
> power, women and money. It's a cult, with a cult
> leader. Maybe if you'd stop expecting LDS Inc. to
> behave like real religions,instead of a real
> estate pyramid scheme, you'd sleep easier.

I sleep like a baby, but I just expect people to not target me with false advertising, like promising me "Real Answers to Real Questions" like the Morgue does every GD day. This is my way of holding them accountable for exploiting me and 7 generations of my family by lying by omission. They're still lying by omission and commission, when confronted on their lies, to get gullible people to pay 10% of their income into a fraudulent pyramid scheme for the honor of singing the praises of a pedophile. I feel obligated to warn those people, who come here, like I did, to do independent research, so that they're not such easy targets of this brainwashing abusive doomsday sex cult.

Another blatant lie I get all the time when I ask about racist scriptures still being published and distributed every day by the world's biggest army of Doomsday CULT recruiters, is that when the scriptures say God cursed the Lamanites and descendants of Cain with 'black skin' or 'dark skin' that really wasn't about "skin", but more about being cut off from the spirit of God or

"They’re not actually talking about skin color but the presence of the devil within them." (direct quote from a Mormon friend recently who asked the missionaries)

My response: I quit because I realized how racist it was to remain a member of a racist church. If you're not racist, then why do you make excuses for racism? And lie about it, saying it wasn't about skin color, when your scriptures are all about skin color as were the racist practices of the past.
Lying is evil and you're lying through your teeth.
When you say racial discrimination wasn't about skin color. BULLSHIT
It says right in black and white, it was about skin color in Mormon scriptures. Still is.
"the Lord God did cause a SKIN of blackness to come upon them.'
Is that not about black SKIN?
Alma 3: 6
'And the SKINS of the Lamanites were dark, according to the mark which was set upon their fathers, which was a curse upon them because of their transgression and their rebellion against their brethren
is that not about SKIN, when it says it right in black and white?
they shall be a white and a delightsome people."
Is that not about SKIN?
"And their curse was taken from them, and their skin became white like unto the Nephites."
Is that not about SKIN?
that ye revile no more against them because of the darkness of their SKINS;
and they were a mixture of all the seed of Adam save it was the seed of Cain, for the seed of Cain were black, and had not place among them.
Is that not about SKIN?
What am I misunderstanding about Mormon scriptures that talk about black skin always being bad and white skin always being good, when the Bible does neither?
Nor do any other scriptures I've ever read.

MORmON's response: Ya the mark of the devil
It was a curse
The devils dark curse
I would love to pay you a visit and explain each one of those scriptures to you with plain logic. This is just some sort of misunderstanding.

Me: Obviously you've got a mental block that prevents you from reading what's written in black and white. It doesn't say anything about the devil, but it does say a lot about how dark skin is a curse and white skin is a blessing. That's white supremacist/racist AF. but if it's what keeps you on the straight and narrow, then more power to you Buddy.

koriwhore Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ...I just expect people to
> not target me with false advertising...

Given...well, all of history, that seems a rather unrealistic expectation to have :)

Watch out for the predatory mormon doomsday cult representatives. Also, we should avoid hyperbole.

Koriwhore()

If haven't done it yet read the CES letter, https://cesletter.org.

Many, if not all, of your questions have been raised. The lack of answers show the lack of the church's validity to their policies and beliefs.

It may give you some peace of mind that you aren't alone in this dilemma.

Maybe in the future, when you want to show someone the truth of LDS, you might like to direct them to the CES letter and let them come to their own conclusions.

PAX



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/11/2018 01:41PM by tumwater.

tumwater Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Koriwhore()
>
> If haven't done it yet read the CES letter,
> https://cesletter.org.
>
> Many, if not all, of your questions have been
> raised. The lack of answers show the lack of the
> church's validity to their policies and beliefs.
>
> It may give you some peace of mind that you aren't
> alone in this dilemma.
>
> Maybe in the future, when you want to show someone
> the truth of LDS, you might like to direct them to
> the CES letter and let them come to their own
> conclusions.
>
> PAX

I'm quite familiar with the CES letter, but that's the tactic Mormons use, read the paper on this subject on LDS.org, which answers all of your questions.
No it doesn't.
Think about it.
When I was forced to admit there really is only one logical answer to my questions, its a fraud, I quit.
Causing CogDis by expecting real answers to real questions and not settling for cliches or bullshit is the Socratic Method, which still works, even in this post-truth "fake news" era, believe it or not.
"I cause Cognitive Dissonance which will either drive them insane or drive them sane. I hope for the latter which is all I can do after all." Ayan Hirsi Ali
I follow her advice.
If youve got a method that works better than her method or the Socratic Method feel free to test it and report the results.
Once you have 2,500 yrs of proven test results, I will use your method instead of the Socratic Method.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 07/11/2018 02:22PM by koriwhore.

What you do is not the Socratic method. Anyone with a legal education knows that.

You could learn what Socratic dialogue is and try to apply the technique if you wanted, but that would stand as much chance as suggesting you read a Taoist text before telling us what it means. The bottom line is that you like to claim the authority of great thinkers without doing any thinking yourself.

As for the efficacy of your approach, the CES letter has produced hundreds if not thousands of people who directly credit it for their liberation. Can you document three people who have left the church because of your assaults?

"As for the efficacy of your approach, the CES letter has produced hundreds if not thousands of people who directly credit it for their liberation. Can you document three people who have left the church because of your assaults?"

Really Mrs. Lot? "Thosands"..and you know this how? Can YOU in fact document that "thosands" of people have left d/t the CES letter? You want him to document three people, let's see you document the "thosands" of people who credit their liberation. Should be very easy to do Mrs. Lot. Crickets.

By the way, speaking of misogynistic undertone, your moniker, "Lot's Wife"...I don't know, it seems rather misogynous to me. Be proud of who you are Mrs. Lot, don't hide behind your husband.

I feel your pain, Bill.

I'm sorry that your mother was as mean to you as Koriwhore's wife was to him and hope that you both transcend your insecurities. With the benefit of therapy you may find some measure of balance and inner peace.

Best of luck on your quest.

Lol..you're a crack up. You see I think the exact same way about you...you are very insecure, in need of therapy, etc.

So you can dish it out...but wow, somebody gives it back to you...yikes. Watch out. You come out w/ all sorts of insults. My goodness.

On the 'Lot's Wife' matter, you aren't seeing the what a stab the name is at religion and conformity! Not to mention, humorous!

The biblical story is a cautionary tale, at least as far as her character is concerned. "Listen to those who know better and do what they say!" And then they omit her name! Why?

Could be for one of many reasons, certainly misogyny might be a principle one. And you don't even have to be facile to get it...

Oh thanks so much for explaining this...

They are all three--liars, delusional, and willfully ignorant--- and proudly so.

Because, to them . . .

Lying for the Lord really isn't lying and "sometimes the truth is not useful."

What we call delusional they call feeling the spirit.

And, what seems obviously willfully ignorant because, well, it is, would just be them showing their immense faith.

Believing the unbelievable is an art and those three Mormon skills are useful.

MORmONISM is a quantum phenomena, where mutually exclusive contradictions exist simultaneously. Where discreet numbers have several values at the same time !!! Where FLDS do not exist, but Nephites DO !!!!! That is the MORmON Marvelous Work and a Wonder in action. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jcd0AKMArrM

I always say 'there are two types of Mormons, those who don't know, and those who don't care'.

That pretty much sums up this religion. The numbers that don't care has grown in recent years, but when they're in it for their own motives, you'll end up with a narrow pool of sociopaths battling each other for leadership positions.

Yes

PFFT !

and there are "Attention Whores" in the world as well...

When I was a devout Mormon I'd say I was deceived and overly trusting of authority. I was a convert. But when Mormons know the things I now know and are fully adult and still remain devout I'd say they are mainly brain washed, naive, scared of change, scared of confrontation with family, and content with status quo. And many truly are delusional. Many are ignorant and cannot think for themselves. They were taught that the thinking has been done for them from and early age and they don't know any other way to see religion.

I agree. Trusting of authority was my biggest problem. If it was said by a person who was called of God, who was I to question? It was so fully indoctrinated in me, I based all my major life decisions on what some men in SLC said and who had never met me or knew anything about my life.

Unfortunately in the Church there have been some awful wolves who have been terribly dishonest in how they try to defend the Church. For example, ever heard of Daniel C. Peterson of FARMS. Very dishonest approach that causes people to form Doubts in their minds about the Church being true because anyone with honest faith knows that we should just be super straightforward honest and have faith that God


I'll answer your questions. But keep in mind that my scope of preparedness is limited to just the glorious bubble of approved thinking that I'm so accustomed to sticking to. The Correlation program teaches us to obey and not question our leaders. I could not possibly consider questioning them because that would be doubtful. All it takes is one little Doubt and I'm on the road to Heavenly Father lovingly frying me for eternity. So I got to be super careful and on guard at all times.

You wrote: How do you sing the praises of a man who married his followers wives and teenage daughters as young as 14?"

Answer: Only a liar could deny that he married them. It is what it is. We certainly should do much more to honor/praise his wives. I know in our manuals I read about one of them a lot. Her name was Emma. Ever heard of that one? Of course God loves all women equally so only an evil person would treat the other wives with less respect and notoriety. And of course it was a sacred commandment for Joseph and Brigham to marry these women. Every honest informed true believing woman in the Church will jump for joy in hearing about the wondrous joys of living in plural marriage and sharing their husband :) Yes 200 years ago was a long time ago but in the eyes of God its hardly a blink in the eye. And even if it was 200,000 years ago then it still wouldn't change anything as God's plan is eternal/constant. Anyone who suggests that the plural marriage doctrine is less doctrinal today than just a mere 100-200 years ago is a big fat liar or they really believe that God is a super fickle unstable God.


You wrote: "Why did MORmONs discriminate against blacks prior to 1978 by excluding them from their temples when you dont need Priesthood to enter a temple?"

Answer: It would be a horrible lie to claim that God had them do it for some unknown reason. It has never been taught as "official doctrine" that it was some loving gesture meant to protect blacks from negative consequences. Its also a lie to suggest that it didn't matter. Of course it mattered, unless one suggests that the priesthood is all make-believe nonsense, that all these families of blacks didn't get to have the priesthood in their homes. Its also a lie for people to claim that skin color isn't a matter of importance in the Church now since 1978. If they doubt that then they need to read the "most correct book on earth" and see why the Book of Mormon was emphasized so much right after 1978 in the Church.

I suppose that I could have my own personal views on racism and other matters. However I'm reminded how the Correlation program has completely geared me into the way of thinking I adopted because at the super wise mature age of 8 I made a big huge promise which I should be stuck to living by. The local holy leaders will guilt trip me into sticking to if I ever have any questions start to form or ever start to think any Doubts. So rather than have my own thoughts on racism or anything else I'm reminded that as long as I'm in the Church and doing anything to build it up that I've got to stand fast in support of these sacred racism teachings and everything else.

When you read what I write and you think "Honest TBM is non-delusional" then its a good indicator that its all true. Maybe you too can have the wondrous blessing of having this super special Correlation program engineered way of thinking?

I get that "Honest TBM" is satire, but, having said that, their response is far most honest than any answer I've ever gotten to my questions from a TBM.

Honest TBM Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Answer: Only a liar could deny that he married
> them......And of course it was a sacred
> commandment for Joseph and Brigham to marry these
> women.

Only a liar would claim that God commanded anybody to 'marry' their neighbor's wives, since there has never been a word written in all of scripture or a law written in all of Western Civilization permitting polyandry and plenty of words condemning it as adultery, including 2 of the 10 Commandments and even more damning, 5 different times in "The Law of the Priesthood" which Joseph claimed to have received straight from God. That claim makes the God you worship a hypocrite, who could care less about the rape victims or their ONLY real husbands.

> You wrote: "Why did MORmONs discriminate against
> blacks prior to 1978 by excluding them from their
> temples when you dont need Priesthood to enter a
> temple?"
>
> Answer: It would be a horrible lie to claim that
> God had them do it for some unknown reason. It has
> never been taught as "official doctrine" that it
> was some loving gesture meant to protect blacks
> from negative consequences. Its also a lie to
> suggest that it didn't matter. Of course it
> mattered, unless one suggests that the priesthood
> is all make-believe nonsense, that all these
> families of blacks didn't get to have the
> priesthood in their homes. Its also a lie for
> people to claim that skin color isn't a matter of
> importance in the Church now since 1978. If they
> doubt that then they need to read the "most
> correct book on earth" and see why the Book of
> Mormon was emphasized so much right after 1978 in
> the Church.

All of which is beside the point, that there could be no other possible reason besides blatant racism, to exclude blacks from the temple, when women enter the temple daily w/o the priesthood.

> I suppose that I could have my own personal views
> on racism and other matters. However I'm reminded
> how the Correlation program has completely geared
> me into the way of thinking I adopted because at
> the super wise mature age of 8 I made a big huge
> promise which I should be stuck to living by. The
> local holy leaders will guilt trip me into
> sticking to if I ever have any questions start to
> form or ever start to think any Doubts. So rather
> than have my own thoughts on racism or anything
> else I'm reminded that as long as I'm in the
> Church and doing anything to build it up that I've
> got to stand fast in support of these sacred
> racism teachings and everything else.
>
> When you read what I write and you think "Honest
> TBM is non-delusional" then its a good indicator
> that its all true. Maybe you too can have the
> wondrous blessing of having this super special
> Correlation program engineered way of thinking?

None of it makes any sense, until you allow yourself to admit Joseph's Myth is a fraud, engineered for one thing, to exploit his followers, financially, sexually, emotionally, intellectually and spiritually. And its been working great toward that end ever since.

Koriwhore said

> None of it makes any sense, until you
> allow yourself to admit Joseph's Myth
> is a fraud, engineered for one thing,
> to exploit his followers, financially,
> sexually, emotionally, intellectually
> and spiritually. And its been working
> great toward that end ever since.


No argument at all with the above!!! Especially the "...until you allow yourself to admit..."

However, I think a majority of us are of the opinion that your confrontational 'pitbull attack dog' style doesn't help mormons, and especially missionaries, to do the necessary 'admitting' to themselves that they're in a cult founded by a charlatan.

elderolddog Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> However, I think a majority of us are of the
> opinion that your confrontational 'pitbull attack
> dog' style doesn't help mormons, and especially
> missionaries, to do the necessary 'admitting' to
> themselves that they're in a cult founded by a
> charlatan.
Respectfully I think the majority of us think you are protecting the world's largest army of Doomsday CULT recruiters, who need a good dose of CogDis to wake up to the reality that they are perpetuating a massive fraud by lying by ommission.
I am just asking real questions and expect real answers, not the groupthink cliches that keep them from actually thinking about the nonsense they're selling.
If nit them, then those who read the questions and the blatant lies I get in response 100% of the time.

A majority of people here do not think you are hurting the church. That is obvious if you read your own threads.

You are nowhere near as effective as Jeremy Runnells or John Dehlin. A bit of introspection may be in order.

Lot's Wife Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A majority of people here do not think you are
> hurting the church. That is obvious if you read
> your own threads.
>
> You are nowhere near as effective as Jeremy
> Runnells or John Dehlin. A bit of introspection
> may be in order.

Many of us here think you're a busy body harpy control freak.

That may be true, but it is irrelevant to the topic under discussion.

Lot's Wife Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That may be true, but it is irrelevant to the
> topic under discussion.


I'm not trying to be Jeremy Runnells or John Dehlin, both of whom cling to their faith in the MORmON Crutch, despite knowing far more about all the problems of the Crutch than me.
When it quit making sense to to remain a member of an abusive doomsday CULT, I quit. I didn't fight to maintain my membership.

Watch out for that doomsday cult- scary stuff. Even for a tough guy like you.

The question isn't whether Dehlin and Runnels fought to save their membership. It is whether they have helped people leave the church.

The motive informing their efforts was not self-aggrandizement but to help others.

Their records on both scores is clear. So is yours.

It's like arguing with a rock, Lot's Wife, but thanks for doing it anyway.

KW, your misogyny is showing.

Thank you, Dorothy.

Last time Koriwhore called me a man-hating Relief Society President, so "busy body harpy control freak" may mark some slight progress.

It appears that Koriwhore gets a free pass on misogyny on this site. That may be because everyone assumes it would be expecting too much to ask him to use his words.

I would say that mormons who know about polygamy actually believe in it. Just get on youtube and google mormon polygamy. there are some pro-videos, and they aren't retarded, idiotic people doing them. These people have brains, done their research, and came to a different conclusion than everyone else who's studied it. They aren't deceived. They are choosing this.

And about the discrimination question there are many, many, many people in America who are conflicted and believe is some kind of boundaries, and are aware that there are major differences between different kinds of people.

(Just look at 1/2 the country that voted for Trump and his big beautiful wall?)

anono this week Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I would say that mormons who know about polygamy
> actually believe in it. Just get on youtube and
> google mormon polygamy. there are some pro-videos,
> and they aren't retarded, idiotic people doing
> them. These people have brains, done their
> research, and came to a different conclusion than
> everyone else who's studied it. They aren't
> deceived. They are choosing this.
>
> And about the discrimination question there are
> many, many, many people in America who are
> conflicted and believe is some kind of boundaries,
> and are aware that there are major differences
> between different kinds of people.
>
> (Just look at 1/2 the country that voted for Trump
> and his big beautiful wall?)
Well, slightly less than half the people who voted, which was only half of us. And its not like we had a choice other than pure fucking evil vs WW3/Civil War/destruction.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/14/2018 12:38PM by koriwhore.

All three - and way too many of them are "flippin" proud of it.

"Real Answers to Real Questions." It was this right here that got me out. They had no answers to my situation. They acted like they did, but it was obvious they didn't. They were just playing with peoples' lives.

My daughter is WILLFULLY IGNORANT. She chooses to be this way.
She isn't delusional. I wouldn't call her a liar either.

I once asked a friend who I had worked with for years and he and I were close friends. He was a leader in the lds church. I asked him why I should still go to church and he said that he had no answers for me except that he knew it was the right thing to do. He often talked about things to me (when I'd ask questions about my situation) and tell me that he didn't agree with the leaders on many issues.

cl2notloggedin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "Real Answers to Real Questions." It was this
> right here that got me out. They had no answers to
> my situation. They acted like they did, but it was
> obvious they didn't. They were just playing with
> peoples' lives.
>
> My daughter is WILLFULLY IGNORANT. She chooses to
> be this way.
> She isn't delusional. I wouldn't call her a liar
> either.
>
> I once asked a friend who I had worked with for
> years and he and I were close friends. He was a
> leader in the lds church. I asked him why I should
> still go to church and he said that he had no
> answers for me except that he knew it was the
> right thing to do. He often talked about things to
> me (when I'd ask questions about my situation) and
> tell me that he didn't agree with the leaders on
> many issues.
True. I have Mormon friends and family members who are good people I'd trust with my life. They are well aware of the issues of their faith and not what Id call delusional or liars. They just choose to ignore the issues that caused many of us here to leave it all behind.
So willfully ignorant, yeah.
Liars? No.
Delusional? Not really.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/14/2018 01:49PM by koriwhore.

Yes.

When I was TBM, I was none of the above. I was brain washed.

abby Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> When I was TBM, I was none of the above. I was
> brain washed.
I was MORmON in a different age, pre Google.

Again, it is facile to say that because Google exists, all people are responsible for knowing and understanding all information to which it leads.

The information existed when you were a TBM. Libraries existed. You should have known it. Apply the same standard to yourself that you do to others, or have the grace to acknowledge that moral responsibility is as particular as understanding.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/15/2018 11:50PM by Lot's Wife.

You do come across very all-knowing, uppity, and condescending. For instance, your use of the word "facile" is implying that he is a simpleton, and he is far from that. I bet he has a higher IQ than you do. Why do you even comment on his posts? You never have anything positive to say about his comments. Not everyone is like you, see's the world of exmo'ism the way you do, and agrees with you. I challenge you to say something positive to Koriwhore.

That's what I meant about how you remind me of previous Mormon RS presidents that that I encountered over a 40 year period in TSCC. You can take the RS president out of the cult, but you are showing that you can't take the RS President out of the RS president.

There may be handful of regular posters that don't agree w/ Koriwhore. I find his posts to be very entertaining. It's nice to see someone throw BS back at the cult. They deserve it.

Yeah, I can see where only a certain type of personality would find any fault with Kori. But it's not easy coming up with explanations as to why someone should agree with him, so he's lucky to have you on his side! I guess the rest of us are just not sufficiently facile.

So you are implying that I, Koriwhore, and anyone who agrees with him are sufficiently facile?

Everybody deserves to give their opinion. You don't need to ridicule, condescend, call names, imply inferiority, etc. You coming across like a bully and ganging up on the OP. It's weird, with your little forum click there. That is the way Mormons act. Perhaps you and Lot's wife can showcase your sufficient "facile" on other posts? I challenge you to not respond to the OP's posts from now on.

I'm impressed, Bill. I didn't think you were capable of irony.

Yet just after accusing me of being a "harpy" and a "relief society president," you proceed to complain that Elder Old Dog is wrong to "ridicule, condescend, call names, imply inferiority, etc." I guess your skin is not as thick as you think a woman's should be.

Likewise you gang up with Koriwhore to criticize me, then you complain that OED is "coming across like a bully and ganging up on" people.

Thank you for that. I needed a good laugh.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/16/2018 04:58PM by Lot's Wife.

Thanks so much for your comments. I will sleep better now.

You see, Bill?

Elder O'Dawg is intelligent 'n stuff. He uses irony dexterously and employs words like "aver."

He also understands that She To Whose Character I aspire defied her husband and her God. She loved her family and her old home, her friends, the parks where her children played. So she looked back in love at those places, rejecting the cold and irrational leadership of bitter and vengeful men. Her courage was then immortalized in a pillar that the Arabs say still exists. She wears her name--which men like you disparage--as a badge of honor, an ironic symbol of the threat she represents to insecure and overbearing men everywhere.

When you insult Lot's Wife in misogynistic terms, she laughs because she has been condemned by far more consequential beings in the past. She hopes that you grow beyond your stunted form and eventually achieve something comparable to what the Dawg has in his relationship with Saucie or whatever would bring you happiness and peace.

Yes, there is still hope. Probably.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/16/2018 04:52PM by Lot's Wife.

I am really getting to you. Wow. You are more insecure than I thought.

What are those toys that one plays with? When you draw a face on a sock and then pretend that it a person, kind of like a puppet.

Oh well, I'll probably remember the name when I'm driving home.

Oh that was a good one Jacob. You got me there...right between my sock puppet eyes. Well done. I am no match for you.

Yes, Bill.

Your disapproval really breaks my heart.

Oh sorry...

So are you going to "document" your "1000's" of liberated Mormons via the CES letter? Still waiting. I bet you have been feverishly searching for links all this time.

Abby

All religions are brain washing in one form or another.

To what degree?

It depends on what was pounded into your head at an early age.