So, how did JSJr really died?

Lead poisoning.

Is the timeless "No Man Knows My History" by Fawn M. Brodie. She was excommunicated from the church for writing this biography that has stood the test of time.

Dave's "Reader's Digest" version above is accurate; Smith ordered the destruction of the "Nauvoo Expositor," an exposé of the practice of his polygamy in Nauvoo, and his followers destroyed the press. The two Law brothers, William and Wilson, were involved in the production and distribution.

Smith fled Nauvoo in the wake of the backlash, but was persuaded to return and held in Carthage Jail. A mob stormed the jail and entered the area where JS and his brother Hyrum were being held. Hyrum was killed first, and Smith attempted to flee through a window but met a hail of gunfire.

You missed the point.
Who started the gun battle?

Joe wasn’t wearing his magic underwear, which would have protected him.

You are avoiding the issue.
WHO started the gun battle? Who took the first shot?

You mean who fired the first shots through the door? Probably the guys who went to trial for it. Pretty good shooting for aiming blind.

The Freemasons killed Joe Smith.

The mob, consisting of Freemasons, took the first shot.

The easiest way to debunk that one is to point out that JS gave a "Masonic signal of distress" and shouted out, "Is there no hope for the widow's son?"

There was none.

(Taylor: "Nightfall at Nauvoo," p. 282: Macmillan, 1971)

Here's another excellent account by William Law:

http://www.mrm.org/law-interview

First, JS was shot before he could call out the complete Masonic Grand Hailing Sign of Distress. He only called out the first part "Oh Lord, my God"... then was shot and fell out of the window. He did not complete the rest of the distress cry.."is there no hope for the widow's son" as you claim.

JS knew that there were Freemasons in the mob thus his only hope to avert death. However, Freemasons have blood oaths and penalties for revealing their sacred rituals, which is exactly what JS did in the Mormon temple. The Illinois Masonic leadership declared the LDS lodges to be clandestine, so that by the time of JS death the Mormons were not considered Masons by the other Illinois Masons, although the Mormons still considered themselves to be such. Thus any Masons in the murdering mob would not have felt compelled to respond to any distress call from Smith. In fact, they may have felt quite the opposite

The Riddler Wrote:
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> You missed the point.


No, your original question was unclear.

From sources I found, the mob did not fire first.
It was Joseph Smith that fired first.
He first 6 times with his gun.
3 misfired. The other three hit 3 different men.

Or actually recover from Mormonism?

Your sources, according to mine, are wrong (Samuel W. Taylor who wrote "Nightfall at Nauvoo" is pretty good in my book). One of the members of the mob fired through the door, killing Hyrum.

You're going to tell us JS fired first? Nonsense!

George Lucas revisionism.

I don't ever give JS a pass, but on this one, the mob was there to lynch him, one way or another. Even if he fired first, that doesn't bother me. I would probably have done the same, knowing my likely fate.

Also, why does it matter?

The Riddler Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> From sources I found, the mob did not fire first.
> It was Joseph Smith that fired first.
> He first 6 times with his gun.
> 3 misfired. The other three hit 3 different men.


The door is still there. You think JS fired multiple shots through it, hitting three men, through a door that has exactly one bullet hole in it? Or, what--the door was open, and then somehow the mob pulled it closed so they could fire one shot through it and then push it open again?

Stop reading conspiracy theory websites. There's enough BS in Mormonism without us making up s**t as well.

That’s my understanding. Hyrum went down and Joe was like, “it’s on”. He went straight to the door and started firing.

That’s when all restraint went out the window, shortly before Joe.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/23/2018 02:25AM by babyloncansuckit.

Seriously!!! Who gives a sh!t.....

Just like he born.
Like he lived-
He died crazy.

Let’s give credit where credit is due. At least he had the common decency to die.

Now sure how common but he wasn't young enough (NPI).

Don't have websites you can go to?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Joseph_Smith

“The mob first attempted to push the door open to fire into the room, though Joseph Smith and the other prisoners pushed back and prevented this. A member of the mob fired a shot through the door. Hyrum Smith was shot in the face, just to the left of his nose, which threw him to the floor. He cried out, "I am a dead man!" and collapsed. He died almost immediately.[24]

Joseph Smith, Taylor, and Richards attempted to defend themselves. Taylor and Richards used a long walking stick in order to deflect the guns as they were thrust inside the room, from behind the door. Smith used a small pepper-box pistol that Cyrus Wheelock had given him earlier that day.[25] Three of the six barrels misfired,[26] but the other three shots are believed to have injured three of the attackers.[27][28]”

Seems pretty obvious. Hyrum was shot first and then Joseph shot with his pepper box pistol. Jesus.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/25/2018 12:40AM by midwestanon.

A large armed mob were out to make sure Joseph Smith wasn't leaving alive. The pistols Joseph and Hyrum had are in the church museum. Hyrum had a single shot and Jospeh had a revolver known as a pepper box. Not much protection against many men with rifles and muskets. Joseph didn't have a chance of getting out of that jail alive unless the Nauvoo Legion showed up and dispersed the mob. That of course didn't happen.

This answers another thread. Yet more evidence of a loving God.

Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. Teacher, teacher, teacher, teacher. Pick me, pick me, pick me, pick me.

WHAT?

Timmy farted.


Anyway. Funny thread.

I can't tell you how he really died.

I can assure you that he's really dead.

The church teaches that JS was a martyr. Some said that he even predicted his own death. Between predicting his own death and being a martyr, that is supposed to make him a prophet. In my mind it's like if you tell someone that you can predict the future and then say that to prove your point, that you predict that you're going to get your ass kicked within less than five minutes by someone you've never met before, however unlikely that may seem to be at the time. Then you go over to the biggest, meanest guy in the room, kick him in the shins as hard as you can, then laugh and say "ha, what are you going to do about it?", as the guy werthes in pain. Then you get your ass kicked by someone you've never met before, just as you predicted. JS deserved what happened to him and he was no martyr nor a prophet.

If he had any idea there would have been violence, he wouldn’t have brought Hyrum and he would have worn garments.

The saddest thing about his death is that his crock religion continued to grow. His lies and his make-believe BoM should have died with him.

How may people who are in jail posess state-of-the-art weapons ?
It was a fucking gun battle !
Joe killed two people !

Sure seems like sleazy Joey died as a "mere man", not as a prophet of gawd. Oh, and don't forget that before he went to jail he tried to run away and it was Hyrum who talked him into returning to face the music.