My sister in law is a relief society president and both her and the elders quorum president decided have the people in their organizations write down what they needed and wanted.

A very large percentage responded they wanted friends and fun.

This is where the church is lacking. Nobody wants more religion, they want friendship and they want to have fun with their friends.

Simple as that.

My sister in law says there is no money in the budget for fun so they are going to have game nights and potlucks. All I can say is that is something but the reality is either the chemistry is there or it's not. Sometimes people just don't want to be friends. It's like dating. It's either there or it's not.

For myself. I make my own friends and have done quite well without the help of a church. Maybe my suggestion is go spend Sunday doing something you like with people you have more in common with.

I recall the emphasis on making converts, then not retaining them after baptism. TSCC "loves" people into its cult, then slowly freezes them out. The fellowshipping does seem to be lacking.

The so called "friends" nowhere around when life comes calling. Like fair weather friends. When my temple married parents divorced, their LDS "friends" scurried away like frightened mice.

TSCC does seem to have lost its heart and soul, if indeed there was one to be found.

Potlucks are a great idea, At work yesterday our company was actually generous for one day and fed us all a decent meal. And it was actually very enjoyable with the co-workers!

Baptist Churches in the South actually use to feed everyone after services, and I remember the Mormons doing it as well. And some Black churches would even serve breakfast before meetings, with plenty of Grits! Everyone is different and enjoy different activities, so a church ought to try different things, to engage everyone. This is what a good teacher does. Even if it is time consuming and ineffective a quality classroom will have various learning activities for all kinds of learners.

But in Mormonism they want to cut all that out because the top brass thinks it's a waste of time (maybe it is for the affluent that are well endowed with many perks) but for others not as special, it can make a whole lot of difference.

anono this week Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Potlucks are a great idea, At work yesterday our
> company was actually generous for one day and fed
> us all a decent meal. And it was actually very
> enjoyable with the co-workers!
>
> Baptist Churches in the South actually use to feed
> everyone after services, and I remember the
> Mormons doing it as well. And some Black churches
> would even serve breakfast before meetings, with
> plenty of Grits! Everyone is different and enjoy
> different activities, so a church ought to try
> different things, to engage everyone. This is what
> a good teacher does. Even if it is time consuming
> and ineffective a quality classroom will have
> various learning activities for all kinds of
> learners.
>
> But in Mormonism they want to cut all that out
> because the top brass thinks it's a waste of time
> (maybe it is for the affluent that are well
> endowed with many perks) but for others not as
> special, it can make a whole lot of difference.


The church runs like a life insurance company selling policies. Give us names. Go share this information to those people. Then all sorts of training is done to make the presentation as good as it can be. Usually who people sell a policy to is their friends and family. Usually the people who bought the policy let's it expire and the insurance company doesn't have to pay out anything.

In the church the policy sell is a baptism. Then of course like the life insurance policy holder they just stop paying on the policy. In the case of the church this model doesn't work but it's what they run on. Unless the members in individual wards and branches really get along with each other and the new converts and there is something there, it falls apart.

What the leaders say and do at the top is no different than what a corporation does. They hold all sorts of conferences and spew all sorts of stuff but it really has no affect at the individual level and in reality, it's the little people who are really running things and how good they are at making people feel welcome and having a good experience is what determines the quality of the church.

If people want friendship and fun, why do they look for it in religion?

Religion is dogma and superstition and irrational guilt. Friendship and fun is the opposite.

People don't want doctrine. They want a social club.

And, they want to be part of the "in crowd." It's sad when the Mormon church is your idea of that.

In crowds are overrated.

crowds are overrated.

Overrating is overrated.

****

Spot on! The average member could care less about doctrine. They do want a social club and this is what the church leaders don't get. What keeps members in the church at this point is it's harder to leave than to stay in. They don't want to upset their family or be shunned by their peers in the Mormon community. Are they having fun? Probably not.

My happiest time in the church was when the ward missionaries and I would get together with some like-minded members to play board games and eat junk food. If the church encouraged more informal social events like game nights, I'm guessing Mormons would be a lot happier.

At the rate they are out to make members miserable, I am guessing the Mormon Church is heavily invested in Xanax and making a killing off Utah alone.

Simple stuff but the church leadership don't get it. They want to run things from the top with programs and policies. Even the brilliant Russ Nelson doesn't see it. I doubt he will ever write "we need more fun in the church" in his notebook while he's waiting for the Viagra to wear off and Wendy fell asleep before the pill took affect.

Friendship and fun? Good luck. My heavily LDS neighborhood was built 32 years ago. Many of the original homeowners are still here and still in the same ward. They rarely speak to each other, much less have fun together. My old next door neighbor (left to become MP in Russia) was a bishop and stake Prez. Half his adult kids left the church. I'm friendly with a couple of the sons. When they came over on Sundays for family dinner with their parents, they'd pop over for a cold beer. I learned a lot about mormonism from them. I told them that our neighborhood was strange. When I lived in Texas, CA and CO, all the neighbors knew each other and usually had a few neighborhood parties every year (BBQ's, 4th of July parties, block parties, etc). But our neighborhood didn't do anything. They said "It's not the neighborhood-it's Utah". They explained that many of the neighbors had been going to church together for a long time. They spent so much time together at church stuff that they didn't wan't to spend any free time together. I asked if they thought they'd all come if we threw a BBQ or shrimp boil in the summer. They laughed and cynically told me that if had served beer, they'd probably leave. Plus, if they didn't think they had a possibility of converting us,(which they knew wasn't happening) they probably wouldn't come either. They said that their whole life they've had the missionary mentality that won't allow them to enjoy relaxing times with "Gentiles" unless they had a plan to get you to come to church. I've concluded that mormons having fun and friendship is not congruent with the purpose of their church.

StillAnon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Friendship and fun? Good luck. My heavily LDS
> neighborhood was built 32 years ago. Many of the
> original homeowners are still here and still in
> the same ward. They rarely speak to each other,
> much less have fun together. My old next door
> neighbor (left to become MP in Russia) was a
> bishop and stake Prez. Half his adult kids left
> the church. I'm friendly with a couple of the
> sons. When they came over on Sundays for family
> dinner with their parents, they'd pop over for a
> cold beer. I learned a lot about mormonism from
> them. I told them that our neighborhood was
> strange. When I lived in Texas, CA and CO, all the
> neighbors knew each other and usually had a few
> neighborhood parties every year (BBQ's, 4th of
> July parties, block parties, etc). But our
> neighborhood didn't do anything. They said "It's
> not the neighborhood-it's Utah". They explained
> that many of the neighbors had been going to
> church together for a long time. They spent so
> much time together at church stuff that they
> didn't wan't to spend any free time together. I
> asked if they thought they'd all come if we threw
> a BBQ or shrimp boil in the summer. They laughed
> and cynically told me that if had served beer,
> they'd probably leave. Plus, if they didn't think
> they had a possibility of converting us,(which
> they knew wasn't happening) they probably wouldn't
> come either. They said that their whole life
> they've had the missionary mentality that won't
> allow them to enjoy relaxing times with "Gentiles"
> unless they had a plan to get you to come to
> church. I've concluded that mormons having fun and
> friendship is not congruent with the purpose of
> their church.


You don't even socialize at church. Even when I was in the bishopric I was too damn busy to socialize and all of us including the bishop couldn't wait to get out of there. The church is work. It's not fun. The bishop was a golfer and his social life was at the country club. Not with the ward. I had my own group of friends. Most not in the ward. The ward was work and something that drew us away from our social lives. We were all ready to be released after being in three years. We were like trunks missionaries watching the calendar. It's true.

StillAnon, you describe every Utah neighborhood I've lived in. I grew up outside of Utah and remember block parties and friendliness between neighbors. When my husband and I purchased our first home in a heavily Mormon area of Utah, I was very surprised at how cold the neighbors and neighborhood seemed. It's part of the reason why we moved just three years later...to another Utah neighborhood that was exactly the same! We moved one more time several years later hoping to finally find a neighborhood where the kids played outside and neighbors chatted across the fence with each other. We haven't found that yet and we've given up.

I'll never understand it. You know how Mormons always think that those outside the church want to be like them? If only they knew. As a group, Mormons are so unimpressive.

Yep, that validates what my neighbors adult kids told me. That it's not a neighborhood thing-it's a Utah thing. Remember the quote "Familiarity breeds contempt"? Mormon spend so much time on forced church activities with each other, they don't want to do anything else, if not ordered to do so. Mormons can suck the fun out of anything.

There should be plenty of $ for doing fun things but the church sucks all the money out of the wards.

Same with the members.
If they pay tithes there goes the fun and investment money for most of them.

Only the church corp gets ahead. But the members are not stock holders and get nothing.

At a ward singles New Year's party one year when I was around 20 years old, a Catholic couple from South America showed up, and began talking to me out of the blue.

The wife said she'd never seen a more somber group of people at a New Year's Eve gathering in her entire life. They weren't there very long, and left early. It took an outsider from there to state the obvious.

For me it was an eye opener to my surroundings. Or at least a blink. It would be a few years before I actually left TSCC. It was a chink in the armor.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2018 01:54PM by Amyjo.

Look at the First Presidency Christmas devotional. It's like general conference. It's horrible. Ward Christmas parties are no better.

I went to my first Christmas devotional here in Utah, and sat in four different seats! Everyone was saving seats for someone. I was alone--my husband had left me for another woman. My children begged not to go, "Please, Mom, it's Christmas!" I was one quiet, unobtrusive, well-dressed small woman, and could have fitted on the end of any of those benches. I was told there were vacant seats up front, so I went to the front of the chapel, and everyone saw me ask, get rejected, ask again and sit down, only to have someone come and tell me the seats were being saved. I sat down again, by people having a conversation, and when they finally noticed me sitting there, they asked me to leave. By then, the meeting was starting, and I had to get up, in front of the whole congregation, and I walked up the aisle and out the door. I never went to another one of those alone. We unmarried women formed an entourage, as moral support to each other, in a world in which we did not belong.

Friendship and fun? We were happy to not be rejected or insulted!

All the Mormons would need to do is allow the members to visit in the halls and foyer, and to have a juice (instead of coffee) break, like Christian churches do. TSCC does NOT like people discussing things, asking questions, giving opinions to each other. That is the REAL reason socializing is discouraged. I can't tell you how many deep, sincere, quiet conversations have been interrupted by Mormon ushers, clerks, and other "officials", telling us we were disturbing others--when no one else was even within earshot. It's the same treatment temple-goers get if they linger in the celestial room. NO DISCUSSION ALLOWED. Move along, other people are coming to use the building. Shut up and obey.

Mormons have a name for being unfriendly and taciturn: they call it "being reverent."

As StillAnon says, "...having fun and friendship is not congruent with the purpose of their [Mormnons']church.

If the Mormon church is this unfriendly and un-fun, it has little chance of surviving long in the current anti-religious era. Other religions (particularly Catholics) have long understood that church works best as a social club with a few rituals.


Once people start saying no to doctrine and it becomes generally acceptable not to be religious, you won't see them for dust unless you can offer people a more pleasant reason to choose to be there.

We want friendship and fun and got judgement and scorn.

Friendship and fun. Ha!

<--Insert .gif of someone uncontrollably laughing here-->

Friendship was what I had hoped for when I joined the TSCC. Yeah, I met many people, but when you take a good, deep look many of them were never my friends.

I'll echo AmyJo and say that TSCC "loves" people into it's church. That's what happened to me. Getting lovebombed every Sunday and then asked if I would consider joining their church.
I was lovebombed after baptism but like many novelties, they fade.

I had an assigned friend from the moment I started attending services as an "investigator" but I wouldn't say we were true friends. We don't even speak now. Yeah, she gave me rides to church, but we never truly hang out or shared things like friends do. After she started dating the guy that is her husband, I became the third wheel. After she married, we didn't speak much. All I was was an "assignment."

There was another girl in the ward, who I had a rocky friendship with. We did hang out at times before she left for her mission. We kept in touch through letters, and I sent her a package with a sketchbook, writing utensils and art supplies for her birthday. When she returned, her aunt told me that she would like to get in touch with me. So I would give the girl that I had mentioned my number and email address on two occasions (I had moved at the time), but she would NEVER get in touch with me. Others, yes. But she did when she got engaged. I would get the wedding announcement and and an invite to the wedding shower. She called me (someone else in that ward - my old ward - gave her my number...after I had given her my info twice) and asked for my contact information. Congratulations on getting engaged, but where were you for the past six months?

When I moved to Columbia (a suburb of Baltimore), I was lovebombed as a "new attending member." Some took an interest in me, but I wouldn't say that I made any friends there. I was twenty-five (and turned twenty-six during that time), but I did not fit in with the ward's YSA focus group. I tried, but it wasn't working. I would look forward for it to be over, until I decided to go to the investigator's Sunday school (was it called Gospel Principles? I cannot remember). The people in that ward that I was closest to were the elder Sister Missionaries. They would visit me at home, and we got together for lunch and dinner a lot. We would spend time getting to know each other and talking about things deeper than TSCC.

At twenty-six I would have a cerebral hemorrhage. I would take a leave of absence from work, which would lead me to leaving the home that I had rented. I would get lovebombed with cards and flowers while I was recovering from surgery. I actually thought that I was loved. My former coworker (who is TBM) stated that that is one of the beautiful things about being in "the church."
After my experiences, I now strongly disagree.
I would return to the ward in Columbia after seven months. Just before services began, I would have a gran mal seizure that would take me out for twenty minutes right in the church's parking lot. I would officially return to church two weeks later and would get the "welcome back lovebomb" and told how wonderful it was for them to have me back.
But shit would get real afterwards. Since my brain was affected by the hemorrhage, by the radiation surgery, and by the seizure, I would have struggles mentally and emotionally (it's THE BRAIN after all). I would struggle with severe depression...and the anti-seizure medication that I was on didn't help me either.
Those same people that had "lovebombed" me with cards, flowers and hugs started backing away from me. Even as I had improved and gotten better, they still couldn't stand the sight of me. Even when I tried to smile and greet them at church, they would turn their heads and pretend that they didn't know me. Funny, because they would get up on the pulpit for a talk or front and center for a lesson and talk about how important charity is and how necessary it is to be kind and uplift people. Hypocrites. Their sermons are pure bullshit in my eyes.

I would love to know how friendship is defined in TSCC. Through my eyes and my experience, it just goes as far as the "Hi, how are ya!" or cards or Visiting Teaching (or Home Teaching in some cases), but in reality, all it is is them checking your name off of a required monthly box. The majority of it was shallow, short-term, and at times with ulterior motives.
That's all just based on my experience though. I'm sure that some people here have had different experiences, and may have people in the church that they may have a true friendship with.

Me? Out of the twelve years I spent in the church I feel that I only have one true friend, because we've been through so much together. She's seen me at my worst, and still loves me like a sister.

So yeah, good luck with TSCC on their possibly attempts of adding friendship and fun to their agendas.

Sorry for the long post, and the quasi-rant.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/31/2018 12:33PM by severedpuppetstrings.