"Pope Francis and Russell Nelson discuss global relief, families and religious freedom in first-ever meeting between a Latter-day Saint prophet and a Catholic pontiff"

https://www.sltrib.com/religion/2019/03/09/pope-francis-latter-day/

The church has always reminded me as being the obnoxious child who wants to sit with the big people at Thanksgiving dinner. I’m sure Francis patted Nelson on the head, gave him a cookie and sent him on his way.

Bamboozled, this is so true. I was reading the Deseret News online this morning. There is an opinion piece by Mormon lapdog Boyd Matheson calling it a "meeting of two world religious leaders." This just feeds into the taffy pull that Mormons feel like they are such a big deal. Someone needs to remind Boyd that there are over a billion Catholics worldwide and that Mormonism is a boutique cult.

Just so funny that Russ is beaming like "he finally made it", like just won American Idol or something, on meeting the Pope when I was taught all my youth that the Catholic church was the "great and abominable whore of the earth."

I've been around many years, and I just can't imagine the "prophets" of my younger years going to Rome and hugging the Pope and telling all the members what a great man the Pope is. Harold B. Lee? Never. Ezra Taft Benson? I don't think so. Bruce R. McConkie, who had to be told the change his book so it didn't call the catholics “church of the devil” and the “most abominable above all other churches.” Not likely.

I was in Brasil on a mission and many homes we visited, either investigators or members, had pictures of JFK and the Pope on opposite walls. I had a companion who became livid when we'd visit members who still had one of the pope, especially.

He thought nothing of asking them to remove the pictures, of the pope especially and JFK was nearly as bad for this elder.

And here we have Wendy's husband hugging him and presenting him with gifts.

BTW, where is Wendy in this photo opp?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/09/2019 11:14AM by memikeyounot.

I hear the Popes wife wasn't available to hang out with Wendy, so it would have been awkward without them being seen together...

El Oh El ~



LOLOLz ~

First time I've ever really, genuinely been disappointed that his "wife" didn't accompany him. I wanted to see her all decked out in a black veil.

I'm betting that Wendy declined to be told what to wear during a papal audience.

Did anybody kiss anybody else's ring?

maybe referring to the Holy Father as 'His Holiness' was sufficient for this visit, but time will tell;

I'd like to know if Russ invited His Holiness to the Rome Temple, what a great guided tour That would be!


If, OTOH, if Russ would spend a couple of days building houses alongside Jimmy Carter or serving in a soup kitchen, he might have gained more respect, at least in my opinion...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/09/2019 12:21PM by GNPE.

I kissed John Paul II's ring when I did a papal concert for him. When I tell Mormons about that experience, they have no idea what I am talking about.

I would feel degraded kissing a ring, be it pope or king.

Whenever I hear about someone kissing the pope's ring, it makes me chuckle when people claim the pope is humble.

At least Mormons haven't gone that far in their prophet groveling.

If this is how people show respect for a position, I guess I can understand. However, it feels like a custom that enforces a display of subjugation.

Mormons are amateurs.

I would love to have been a fly on the wall when the Pope's theologians explain LDS beliefs to him.

A pity the prophet's wife did not have tea with the Pope's spouse.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/09/2019 12:32PM by caffiend.

You remember when Holland visited Prime Minister May? They proclaimed it was a substantial meeting but didn't even have a photo of the people sitting down together? Only shaking hands while looking a chart and then waiting while May's elevator arrived?

This is the same. I am quite confident the Pope neither requested, nor received, any more than a couple sentences' briefing on the way down the hall to a reception that lasted a full five minutes.

Mormonism doesn't matter to anyone whose life hasn't already been distorted by it.

On the contrary it's been reported as follows

"The pope extended the invitation for a private audience to the Latter-day Saint leader in conjunction with President Nelson's trip this weekend to Italy, where he will dedicate the history-making new Rome Italy Temple.

The two men met for 30-35 minutes and also discussed their mutual concern for the youth in their churches, their concern about secularization and the desire for people to worship God, President Nelson said."

https://www.deseretnews.com/article/900059557/pope-francis-meets-with-president-nelson-in-the-vatican-catholic-mormon-rome.html

With pictures of the all of them sitting down. The Pope looked genuinely comfortable and welcoming

He visited the United Arab Emirates recently. The UAE has made significant steps towards permitting religious tolerance in the last decades.

caffiend Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> He visited the United Arab Emirates recently. The
> UAE has made significant steps towards permitting
> religious tolerance in the last decades.

If this ("....UAE has made significant steps towards permitting religious tolerance in the last decades") is true it would be wonderful--especially if the civil/legal treatment of females (ALL females: Emiratis, foreign visitors, workers, and slaves) became improved.

The last I heard (and I grant that this is not something I keep up-to-date on), women of ANY nationality or status in the Emirates are still subject to an extremely repressive legal system, even if they are the innocent victims of (for example) rape.

That it is reported does not make it true. The Pope does not care about Mormonism or the temple. He did not initiate the meeting. The LDS church would have requested an invitation from the Vatican.

As for comfortable sitting together, there is a single photo of a formal reception. Note also the heights of the chairs. The Mormons are below, in the supplicant’s position, with no equivalence.

The pope probably met three other dignitaries in that room within the same hour. People go there to kiss the ring, not to discuss global affairs in any meaningful way.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/09/2019 06:32PM by Lot's Wife.

“The Pope looked genuinely comfortable and welcoming”

It was one of his less abominable days.

Great, just great, on that day.

Well, I called that one--that's a first for me.

It reminds of something I have wondered for years: if other church leaders accepted mormons as a "real" church, then they would have to believe JS had the First Vision and the BoM was the real deal...AND THEY WOULD HAVE TO BECOME MORMONS.

The alternative is that other churches have to treat mormons as allies in the battle to keep people going to a church, any church.

The pope has met with leaders of other Christian sects (such as Orthodox Christians,) and Jewish, Muslim, Jain, etc. leaders as well. This does not mean that he shares each faith, simply that he is trying to maintain cordial relations with other sects and faiths.

I'm sure that the new Mormon temple has been in the news, and Francis thus extended an invitation to Mormon leaders to meet. As news articles are reporting, there are common interests and concerns that they can discuss with one another.

Pope GLAD to discuss ANYTHING other than Priest sex abuse...

Pope says:
Look punk. You are intruding in my gang's neighborhood.

Mormon says:
I can help you! We both want to keep women and gays in their place and keep our sheep showing up. I know I'm a small fry competitor, but we need to work together to keep religious privilege in laws everywhere.

Pope says:
True, but I have my own country.

Mormon says:
We have our own state in the USA and support your rights to access children in private!

Pope says:
Just know your place, you little gnat. I will let you know when it is OK to let women in our priesthood clubs.

Mormon says:
We always learn from what Catholics are trying.

Pope says:
Look. I agree we need to play nice together because we are losing our ability to control information. Just know your little lame building here is just a symbol to pretend we are both tolerant.

Mormon says:
You got it. Those temples are just for show to make it look like we are growing worldwide anyway.

Pope says:
You might want to get better costumes. And no, I'm not autographing your BoM.

silent chuckle

hidden mic?

listening by pointing some device at the windows?

However U did this, GOOD JOB!

(I did it using remote viewing.)

dagny Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> (I did it using remote viewing.)


(Is that anything like bilocation?)

(It's more like seeing it with my spiritual eyes from my couch.)

(LOL)

dagny Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> (It's more like seeing it with my spiritual eyes
> from my couch.)


I first read that as "...from my crotch." Sorry!

That would have been better. It sounds better than pulling it out my rear. :-)

Oh Danny.... I laughed from the center of my center of my self. So true, so true, the dance. “Gotta get better costumes”....LOL, I laugh from deep inside.

That was to Dagny. Damn Spelchek.

The pope DOES have his own country. It's called the United States (by way of the roman catholic supreme court).

Well, there's that!

LOL!

So...Nelson and Ballard lied to the Pope.

Of those 30 minutes, I guarantee that the Mormons did most of the talking! Explaining the temple would have taken most of the allotted time. Probably, a great deal of the time was spent on the photos, and the formal introductions of the Pope to Nelson, Ballard, their two tenders/escorts (or whatever the Mormons call the personal valets assigned to the GA's) and the Deseret News reporters and camera crew, etc.

Dagny, thank you for relaying the real conversation to us!

"The Vatican offered no details of Francis’ Saturday audience with the Latter-day Saint delegation, The Associated Press reported."

In other words, the visit didn't even make the news in Europe.

Har-har--the news report said, "Now the church is on the Pope's radar." That's all they can really hope for.

exminion Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> "The Vatican offered no details of Francis’
> Saturday audience with the Latter-day Saint
> delegation, The Associated Press reported."
>

This is the AP report

"VATICAN CITY - Pope Francis has met with the leadership of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, the first-such meeting of its kind, on the eve of the dedication of the church’s huge new temple in Rome.
The Vatican offered no details of Francis’s Saturday audience with the church’s president, Russell Nelson, and the 14 elders who make up the leadership of the church, widely known as the Mormon church. The Latter-day Saints said it was the first time their entire leadership had gathered outside the U.S.
The leaders are in town for the dedication Sunday of their new temple complex, which features an oval-shaped marble house of worship crowning a hilltop and a visitor center featuring a larger-than-life marble statue of Christ surrounded by smaller statues of the apostles."

What? No statues of Joseph Smith or Brigham Young? The LDS church is slipping!

Hey. Wait a minute here.

The pope was wearing his goofy old-timey form fitting vestments and very nifty skull cap to show his pontifical authority.

So, why wasn't Nelson wearing his special uniform as well to show his super Priesthood authority?

Nelson should have been wearing his official white suit, white shirt, white tie, white belt, white socks, white shoes and white underwear.

He missed the opportunity to upstage the pope by also wearing his green fig leaf apron and fashionable puffy baker's hat as well. He didn't make a very good appearance as the official okey, dokey Prophet.

I'm betting that most of the GAs have their own lockers in the SLC temple, no carrying those small suitcases in & out for THEM!!!

He packed his white jump suit instead.

It should be noted that beyond private audiences with world political and local/world religious leaders of various faiths, the pope also holds large weekly audiences that are open to anyone (not unlike seeing a speaker at a convention.) He also sometimes grants semi-private audiences to small groups of people who go through a procedure to get those audiences (i.e. a letter of introduction from a Catholic bishop or above, and the consent of the Vatican.) Apparently John Paul II and Francis often grant/granted those semi-private audiences, but Benedict seldom did.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/09/2019 07:33PM by summer.

I think it would be more accurate to say the pope humored some guy who pretends to be a prophet.

Hey, at least Nelson wasn't handing out photos of himself the way he did while on his Great African Tithing Tour.

"Brother Francis, I counsel you to hang this photograph of the First Presidency, even the prophet (cough cough) and his counselors, of The Church Etc. Etc. on your wall, to remind you of this special day when you met the true anointed successors of Peter, James and John in these latter days."

[Francis: Dafuq?]

Meh, I'm not all that impressed. I remember when Benny Hinn met Pope John Paul II.

I wonder if Nelson apologized for all the prophet/pope jokes I heard numerous Mormons tell back in the 1980’s

Jesus was offended when people talk about "Catholics" and the "Catholic Church" because His church and His followers should be known by His name?

Rumor has it that Nelson then told the Pope that he could help the Pope get rid of that whole problem with the "Catholic" nickname in the same way the Nelson has been so successful at getting rid of the "Mormon" nickname.

That's when, according to some sources, the Pope did such a violent eye-roll that one of his eyes got stuck and he had to be taken to the Vatican physician.

They can both be the Church of Jesus Christ.

For Francis, this was just another meeting for interfaith dialog.

For the Brethren, it will be touted as more "proof" that Mormonism isn't a ooky cooky cult whose only reason for existence is to provide tax-exempt status and a steady stream of investment income via coerced donations for LD$, Inc.

No doubt Nelson, and perhaps others, will talk about all of this in a few weeks at gc

It’s incredible that Nelson called the Pope “His Holiness”. What an a$$-kisser. He knows the Pope is NOT “Holy”. He should have simply referred to him as “Pope Francis”.

It's the conventional title for a pope. Other religious leaders often have similar titles, (i.e. the Archbishop of Canterbury is "Your Grace," The Dalai Lama is "Your Holiness.") The titles are normally used by people who are not members of the faith in the same manner that Queen Elizabeth would normally be called "Your Majesty" by one and all.

I am not a Brit, but if I met the Queen, I would call her'Your Majesty' because that is her title and it is good manners.

Did Big Nellie give the evil one a Book of Mormon?
Did he bare his testimony to him?

Bet he did niether of those - because he is one lousy missionary.

"How's-a the Mormon business going, is-a going good, no?"

"We're not called Mormons anymore, your Holiness!"

"You change-a you name? Mama mia! Some days I wish we could do that too!"

"I know exactly what you mean, Pope!"

*mutual laughter*

It's significant that Nelson went to the Pope, not the other way around.

outin76

this reminds me of the few things they have in common-

- Leadership is a guy's club, no wymens allowed

- They've both pretty much given up on the 'No Birth Control Allowed' thingee. In prior times, both parties represented this of sacred importance.

- Both have strong areas were they've predominant, many areas where they're hardly known, seldom mentioned. 'World-Wide'? Nope.

- Each has a 'strong' central focus of "wisdom" and is presented as God's conduit to earthlings; both are males with a supporting cast of underlings.

- Selection - ascension to both the supporting roles & top spot are assuredly non-democratic

- Financing decisions & reporting are represented as matters only responsible to God, rank-and-file must accept these as matters of faith.

- sexual abuse problems have recently surfaced, may have a largely undisclosed history.


- others/yours?



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 03/10/2019 01:49PM by GNPE.

Name one part of the world where the Catholic Church is " hardly known"