Apparently god can be anything, which means that god is probably everything. I can't in good conscious disbelieve something that vague and undefined. So given my new found faith can someone please answer me one question? Just one question.

How the hell did you find out about this god? I'm convinced that this god is possible, I'm just not convinced that you're the appropriate fountain of knowledge when it comes to this god. So tell me how you found out because that will be a great help in understanding my new god.

Why ask us? He’s your imaginary friend.

No, no. All of the evangelical pantheists out there have me convinced. Is it too much to ask for one more piece of information?

Comment of the day! Excellent.

That's the whole point of finding a quote from a smart scientist!

I just wish that smart people were consistent. But I guess I'm going to have to believe in one of the smart people's god. Which one do you suggest?

Just find one who agrees with what you already think. Same process for scriptures!

Be sure and pick ones that give "clout" because they are super, super smart!

jacob Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> How the hell did you find out about this god? I'm
> convinced that this god is possible, I'm just not
> convinced that you're the appropriate fountain of
> knowledge when it comes to this god. So tell me
> how you found out because that will be a great
> help in understanding my new god.

Although I definitely do not believe in God in a Christian sense, I have [going back as far as I have any real memory, which would be about age three or so] always conceptualized the concept of "God" as "What IS."

I do believe that we exist as we are, right now....that this planet exists....that the universe (which contains all other potential "universes") does exist--and that all of this has intelligence behind it, and that humans (according to the limits of their human brain capabilities) frequently conceptualize this as deity (regardless of the particulars of their conceptualizations).

There is a "place" (not geographical; rather, it is a "place" at least mostly conceptual) where Hinduism, Judaism, pantheism, perhaps panentheism (which I do not sufficiently understand), perhaps Buddhism (a religion I know very little about), much of animism, and our unfolding human understanding of physics and mathematics and cosmology and factual science of all kinds, all converge.

At this "place," the various "sectarian" discussions are all discussing and 'understanding' what amounts to the "same" thing, using their own vernaculars, and springing from their own cultural perspectives.

Outside of Christianity (which has a completely different concept of God), and my limited understanding of most of Islam [although Sufi thought is likely an exception to this exception], I think this "place" (where these different conceptual perceptions intellectually converge) is what the word "God" most often refers to.

To me personally, "God" is "What IS."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/28/2019 11:38AM by Tevai.

That’s what I think. God is in everything, and everything is in God. That’s called Panentheism.

Everything that is, or could be, is because of God. Forming conceptual structures around that is a means of making it useful. JS and BY hijacked the old structures to take people for a ride. That’s a bad way to run a religion. Life is essentially holy, so there’s a place for religion done right.

I just discovered Lee Smolin’s lectures on YouTube. He’s a quantum physicist who talks about the nature of reality. He tries not to stray into theological territory but admits there are implications.

My belief is that in a timeless space, everything that can happen has already happened. We don’t remember what didn’t happen because it wasn’t in our experience. We can “remember” what is likely to happen in the future, in some cases. This is the allure of sports.

God is in everything means that god is everywhere therefore god is in satan therefore god IS satan.

That is the natural result of Aquinas's un-caused causer argument. Everything has a cause, everything that is must have been caused, including the beginning. So in the beginning there must have been and un-caused causer. To Aquinas god is the only explanation for existence.

The by product is that if god is the first cause than god is the cause of evil.

But pantheism doesn't claim that god is good, just that god is. So a pantheist wouldn't give many fucks about Satan.

And this soon leads to Panglossianism. This is the Best of All Possible Worlds simply because it is my world and I can't bear to think of it as anything less.

God comprises all good and all bad and everything is simply divine.

Lot's Wife Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And this soon leads to Panglossianism. This is
> the Best of All Possible Worlds simply because it
> is my world and I can't bear to think of it as
> anything less.
>
> God comprises all good and all bad and everything
> is simply divine.


I love that. It's perfect. .. it works for me and i don't believe in god either.

That’s basically the philosophy of Gottfried Liebniz as explained in his 1686 Discourse on Metaphysics. Everything happens for the best. The world only looks hosed.

By this time the Enlightenment was well underway. Cartesian dualism won out. Maybe for the best.

Tevai, that's more or less where I'm at. In our universe, there is intelligence, there is connectedness. Call it what you will. It could be that it is well beyond our ability to comprehend.

Each religion tries to talk about this within its own culture and language. There is no "correct" religion. There can't be.

You're asking about BELIEF, which has no other choice but to be based on FAITH...

You have to get input from outside sources, no doubt about it. And then you finally pick what your belief will be. At which point you pretty much shut down your inquiries.

I imagine that many 'non-believers' just never get around to choosing to believe something for which there is no proof. That's something of a thankless chore!

I like the analogy of trying to prove which is the best flavor of ice cream. Besides just your basic arguing, there are new flavors being introduced and you have lactose intolerant people who won't play the game.

When it comes to believing in ghawd, I think it's perfectly fine for a person to say, "Why bother?".

If you have to pick a ghawd to worship, I hope you pick one who is modest and unassuming.

God, assuming he exists, should not only be modest and unassuming, he should be ashamed.

+1

Wow, that was good!

In which god can you no longer disbelieve ? All gods are equally real.

The nebulous god. The one without definition, except that god is everything.

I don’t believe in regret. But for all that, I still feel it.

That is how God is for me. Disbelieve as I may, the feeling does not go away. With regret, I remember no time when it wasn’t so.

Human

That's far to poetic for me.

Poetic indeed. And thought-provoking.

I just watched Guardians of the Galaxy, Vol 2 last night. Hilarious.

Quill's broken Sony Walkman was replaced by a Zune, which was believed to be the New Thing is personal music devices.

Be careful what you believe.

Personally, as an atheist, I'm rather fond of Ganesha. I mean, an elephant head, four arms and a pot belly. What's not to love? And he's compassionate, because can you imagine the teasing he suffered at recess?

Brother Of Jerry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Personally, as an atheist, I'm rather fond of
> Ganesha. I mean, an elephant head, four arms and a
> pot belly. What's not to love? And he's
> compassionate, because can you imagine the teasing
> he suffered at recess?

I have always loved Ganesha, ever since my first Sunday School class at the Hollywood Vedanta Temple, when my classmates and I were learning how to do puja.

Ganesha is a wonderful god. All of his time is devoted to scurrying around this planet (he balances on the back of his beloved pet mouse/rat, who acts like a faster-than-an-airplane scooter), removing obstacles from people's lives and making their lives better overall.

I don't think any kids would have teased Ganesha, though--his parents are Shiva (one of the three most important Hindu gods), and the goddess Parvati.

I sure wouldn't have wanted to mess with Shiva, because when he gets angry, his anger can be formidable--this is why his son has a transplanted elephant's head now, instead of the human head he was born with....and I am sure most kids back then would not have wanted to deal with Shiva's anger either.

They would have been scared that THEIR head(s) might be in danger, too.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/28/2019 02:52PM by Tevai.

I've decided I can no longer disbelieve in omnipotent Blueberry Pancakes.

Mmmmmmm.... pancakes!!!

Even better than a Thunder God, I'd think!

Oh yes, the ghawd of fharwts!!!

You are on a roll today, Old Dawg. Did someone rub your belly?

I think we're all a bit giddy, being that we're not in church. Hurrahhhh !!!

There is indeed a certain giddiness in the air, which is all to the good.

I hope the sun shines where you are, Son!

God will not be mocked. Except in RfM. Although I’m usually too busy mocking GAs.

God is infinite and beyond our ability to comprehend. But whatever God represents he (or she, or it,) is real enough if he created us and all of this.

God to me is light and love and found in everything in existence kind of like how you see / perceive God to be. If God is a being then the being is far more expansive and majestic than my mind can take in.

And omnipotent.

Being mortal and flesh, we represent the potter's clay. We're just ashes to ashes, dust to dust, without a soul or eternal flame that transcends this life for other worlds. I believe in life after life. I don't understand it. But I believe there is something more there. Not just based on belief or faith, but because I've had experiences with (some) loved ones who've crossed over and sent me messages that they're safe and content on the other side.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/28/2019 09:12PM by Amyjo.

Spirituality has been for me a black hole where fools rush in.

I have been fooled as have most of you here, fooled more times than George W even.

I've also bet on Pascal once or twice.

If I have learned anything it's only that I have never forgotten those earliest feelings that Tevai described so well.

My inner certainty has never been augmented by persuading someone else to understand or agree with me.

Which is not to say I don't benefit from hearing the thoughts of my fellow fools.

That's why I still come here.

My (now retired rabbi) once gave a brilliant sermon on why he believed in God. It was because of how well the ear is engineered and highly structured to receive information and sound.

Only a master designer/creator could have come up with something so ingenuous as the ear for hearing for intelligent beings to process and filter sound with as one of the senses. By extension then he went onto include the rest of creation and how finely engineered and designed and planned the world and the cosmos is.

At synagogue there can be no recording of sermons, no writing them down. I wish there were so I could have gotten it on record to preserve his talks. He gave the most brilliant sermons of any rabbi or preacher I've heard speak. It was a tremendous loss to our congregation when he retired abruptly to move to Israel. Maybe he was ready to. But our loss was their gain.

“Edge of Tomorrow”, Tom Cruise. Maybe reincarnation can explain it. Critters keep coming back around growing better ears. No designer necessary.

Does that explain the soul though?

Or the intellect? Or the mind?

Or the afterlife? Hmm????

Amyjo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> My (now retired rabbi) once gave a brilliant
> sermon on why he believed in God. It was because
> of how well the ear is engineered and highly
> structured to receive information and sound.
>
> Only a master designer/creator could have come up
> with something so ingenuous as the ear for hearing
> for intelligent beings to process and filter sound
> with as one of the senses. By extension then he
> went onto include the rest of creation and how
> finely engineered and designed and planned the
> world and the cosmos is.
>


memikeyounot and I want to know what the ear hair is all about! What was the plan for that bit of ghawdly engineering?

To keep bugs from penetrating your eardrum and eating your brain.

To paraphrase a certain king, only fools rush in. But I can’t help falling in love with God.

This song'll make you weep ... "Only Heaven Knows" (I think Joanie wrote this for Bob Dylan,)

Seems we've been to heaven, darling
Ah, the sad wind blows
But I have lost my way, my darling
Tell me how it goes

While the mist is rising, darling
Ah, the sad wind blows
Tell me how we met, my darling
Tell me all you know

I am somewhat older, darling
Ah, the sad wind blows
You are so much younger, darling
That's the way it goes

And we looked so good together
Ah, the sad wind blows
Out of all the summer flowers
I had picked the rose

Take me in your arms, my darling
While the sad wind blows
Tell me that this pain will leave me
Tell me how it goes

If this pain should ever leave me
Only heaven knows

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtT5TBe2L7Q

Each of us has within our skin 100 trillion cells. God is within each cell of each of us. Wherever life is, God is.

Omnipresent.

This biophysicist has seen Him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyaBeHeRK6M

Very nice message.

"There's a lot of reality we don't know about," she ends with. And to send compassion to the world. Is something each of us can do as a healing measure.

A scientist who suffered a head injury, who went to the other side and back, and lived to tell about it.

Changed her perceptions on life and everything.

I heard that in college also, that the cells of the body completely regenerate themselves every five years - we are constantly renewing ourselves in growth cycles.

The loss of my Mormonism created a black hole in my consciousness that is filled with many other absurdities.

I have dived into the disciplines of microbiology, philosophy, futurism and inevitabilities.

Nothing actually exists.

That's what I learned last night, thanks to George Berkeley.


He got a university named after him, he was so bright.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0azrs_yPvg

Oh, Philosophy. That's another major for another day, lol.

Nothing exists. Everything exists. Doesn't it come down to perspective? :)

Quantum physics says every piece of matter is living. Every cell, every atom a moving object. Even a rock. Just floating through space and time. Life forms, everything.

I 'believe' in God (not of the bible or any specific human) and a lot of other things considered 'supernatural'. I am not sure I can go to 'know' even after 'numerous' experiences but that is not 'necessary' to benefit from those things.

I 'believe' in God because of the 'supernatural' things I have 'experienced' personally ----- I could care less what any scientist, religious leader, or star 'thinks'! I have not had any 'direct' interaction with 'God' as far as I am concerned but with 'soul, subconscious, spirits'.

Based on those interactions I asked and got affirmative replies about 'God'. But it is sort of a 'so what' as there is no 'completely true religion or book of scripture'. The God I recognize does not expect to be 'worshipped', and there is no 'hell'. The most significant 'beliefs' are in what is 'possible' and some of those maybe considered 'supernatural' because there are things/information/knowledge to be gained from those 'beliefs'.

To 'just' believe or disbelieve in 'God' seems meaningless unless it 'benefits' you in some way. Maybe for many religious and non religious the 'hope, fear, etc.' is benefit enough.

I'm Pagan. I don't believe in a god that is omnipotent nor omniscient. If He/She were, they would also have to be a sadist.

I believe that the entities/Spirits that we call Gods are simply more evolved spiritually than we are. They help when they can, but they can't always help. Sometimes, it is something they simply can't do. Or a question they don't know the answer to.

I came to my belief after years of experience.

I hope you can find a God that can help you through this journey.

Step right up and get yours now before they are gone!

The new Swiss Army Knife iPhone 2019. Open a can of beans or open your garage from the other side of the world. Uncork your wine or program your Ferrari online. You can whittle a toy from a twig with the knife while you make reservations at your favorite restaurant on line and be searching for your new love, rifling through photos and bios even as you fix the screw in the door of the nightstand with the handy dandy screwdriver.

The New Swiss Army Knife iPone 2019. Can do anything you want! Can be anything you want. Just like God!

Everybody wants a do-all-fix-all. But, Floods and plagues, and sacrifices, and lamb's blood and holy wars are so dated. Get an update. Get the god with all the new apps He comes with now. He can be plasma, consciousness, a black hole or a white whole. Big or little. Fluid or solid. He is knowledge and understanding and inspiration. He is a feelings. He is the one who does the special favors for only you. And, he can do nearly everything your phone does. So why wait? Get yours today.

He's only a belief away.

And, is easily customized to fit any life-style! Watcha got to lose?

How long before I can get the Android model?

No way I can disbelieve a sales pitch like that. It's so incredibly credible.

Well my gawdphone would have to have an app that delivers the sensory pleasures of erotic intoxication wirelessly into my brain bypassing the need for any porn or toxic substances.

If you are listening God, please Fed-ex me one asap.

You know where I live.

jacob Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Apparently god can be anything, which means that
> god is probably everything. I can't in good
> conscious disbelieve something that vague and
> undefined. So given my new found faith can someone
> please answer me one question? Just one question.
>
> How the hell did you find out about this god?

Research. Starting with Lao Tzu, Buddha. Epicurus, Marcus Aurelius, Spinoza, Einstein, Sagan, Hawking and Micio Kaku, whose god is the same, the immutable laws that govern nature.

Yeah, but if after doing all the reading, you don't get the same result that Kori got, you did it wrong and will have to do it over.

My only issue with this, that's a lie because I have multiple issues.

One of my issues with this is that there are no immutable laws that govern nature. Those things which you call laws are not laws but descriptions. Maybe that's a nuanced difference. Nuanced or not it there is a difference.

Well, you're in for it now!

I've thought about it and I've decided what god I believe in. The god of descriptions.

Good news. You can get the God of Descriptions App on your new Swiss Pocket Knife IPHone 2019. Actually, that description versus law thing is a zinger. I'm going with that, too.

Well, there is the god of German Chocolate cake though . . . tough call.

Could there be a ghawd of the ghawdless? He might be interesting!

Just looking at natural occurrences alters their reality as Herr Heisenberg warned us.