A week ago I heard that the inspired Brethren were going to replace the wall around Temple Square with a see-through fence.

I was surprised that there was no discussion about this with Utahns. Just a top-down decision that would be done.

There was no idea to sell the granite chunks to raise funds for the latest victim group.

No, instead, the detritus that served for so long and so well would provide no usefulness whatsoever.

Such is the bane of uninspired leadership. Those highly respected men who esteem the flock as a thoughtless herd that will tolerate endless idiocy, Corporate wastes and venerated social shame.

https://greenmormonarchitect.blogspot.com/2008/09/wall-at-temple-square.html

Ya it's bad, the whole project wasn't planned with members input at all. Nelson must think he owns the whole thing and can do whatever he wants (which according to the corp. of the president) he kinda does.

We should stop referring to cojcolds as cojcolds and instead refer to it as it's real legal entity, corp. of the president church.

many refer to it as LDS Corp.

Nelson must think he owns the whole thing and can do wh

According to the articles of incorporation HE DOES OWN THE WHOLE THING.

Weren't we all inspired by that great "President Nelson, tear down this wall!" speech?

to them. Like we've talked about before--the old church houses around. The one on main in Logan has been sold off a few times and then the mormons have a fit when any changes are made to the building.

They are really having a good time tearing down all the old stuff. I wonder what my mother would think. She loved going to TS on Sundays when she and my father would argue about him not going to church. The arguments that could have been avoided had we not been mormons. But she loved the visitor's center. What a mess!

Even if I don't believe in mormonism, I hope they never tear down the Brigham City tabernacle. I just find that building really interesting. They were doing some kind of project on it last summer and I was concerned.

Isn’t it kinda like the Winchester House in CA, where Mrs. Winchester had to continually build ridiculous staircases to nowhere and every other money-wasting oddity, thinking that would keep away the ghosts of dead Indians who were shot with Winchester rifles?

Hmmmm—-the ghosts of dead Indians. Yes, Brigham Young should have worried about that himself.

Speaking of this place, has anyone been there? Is it as cool as it sounds?

Matthew 7:9, The Mormon church will give chunks of it to anyone who asks for bread.

Really? That's not a joke? That would be sad...and good maybe. I liked the feeling of walking around in the gardens, kind of separated from the rest of the busy, messy city. On the other hand, it will make walking past Temple Square a lot more enjoyable if you can see in. It will definitely change the flowers... lots more wind coming through.

As I believe it was for much of its history. How many years has it been now that they put a fence across the front so it would be visible to passers by? It used to be that the only way you could see the temple while on the square was by looking up, way up since it was quite a high wall.

I believe the wall is stuccoed concrete block - very utilitarian. Who’d want to buy a used concrete block? It will be no great loss

According to the cited article, Adobe brick, plastered over to protect the bricks from the elements.

When I read "adobe" I got all misty eyed.

Some of it is the original adobe construction covered with a type of stucco. I did a story on this for the CN when it was being repaired in the early 70s.

Is the wall original to temple square? If so then it has historical value.

Apparently it had to be rebuilt at one point due to age, but the rebuild was a replica of the original. The rebuild itself is old enough to be historically significant.

The old tabernacle in my home town (that's what they called a "stake house" back then) is an architectural oddity, a semi-circular building of which only two were built, in Blackfoot, Idaho (my home town) and Montpelier, Idaho.

It was sold to a private party and is now a mortuary.
(image: https://www.bing.com/th?id=OIP.0uUq3TXf3ANehTgvJRzagQHaFj&w=202&h=160&c=7&o=5&pid=1.7 )

That's where I was baptized. When they remodeled it, they gave pieces of the tile from the baptismal font to anyone that wanted them as a memento. I think I still have a piece somewhere. I went to school with the owners, they are nice people but very TBM.

>> "A week ago I heard that the inspired Brethren were going to replace the wall around Temple Square with a see-through fence."

A see through fence? Topped with razor wire? Prisons have see through fences too.

My husband and I went to Temple Square last week to take pictures of the strange symbols on the outside walls of the Salt Lake Temple, in case they get removed with the renovation. The prettiest thing there is the tremendous amount of beautiful flowers; especially the tulips and hyacinth. While we were there, we were approached by a guide who looked to be a little older than us. We let her give her spiel about the different buildings and she told us that the visitors' center was going to be torn down and also the wall was getting torn down so that the temple would be a lot more visible from the streets. I had a feeling that security was listening to our conversation, so my husband told her that TSCC was going to be spending $ 1 billion to renovate. She was shocked, and said that she had no idea that they were going to be spending that amount! All of a sudden, another "guide" came over to relieve her. We decided it was time to exit stage left, and grab some lunch!

I forget the site, but there's a good one where missionaries' stories are neither vetted nor censored for telling the true perspective of where they serve. (I think one elder in Tucson wrote about hitting cacti while riding his bike).

Ok so why is the the "square" mission so bad?

-small area (they don't go far beyond a 4 block square)
-sisters serve a shift on the grounds, then another at the call centers
-live in a church owned apartments for 4-6 persons
-no eating out, must cook their own meals
-no tracting or walking around beyond the square
-no member visits or meals
-being shadowed/escorted by church security while on the square, grocery shopping and exercising at a private gym
-unlike other missions that allow sisters to wear trousers, must wear skirts-dresses in rain and snow
-they are "on-stage" through live cameras and open mics, their performances as missionaries are readily critiqued

Sucks


to be a Mormon/LDS


More to be a Mormon Missionary


Double-More to be a Mormon SL Temple missionary, actually x 1,000

If they tear down the wall, will that signify a softening of their us/them defensive/persecution mentality?

Really?

They're going to replace the wailing wall ?

Mr. Nelson , tear down this wall !

Dammit ! I just read it. You beat me fair and square.

I need to be quicker on the wisecracks.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/06/2019 01:38AM by Dave the Atheist.

It occurred to me after-the-fact that neither of us pulled the "Easter is cancelled" gag this year. Shared senior moment?

I shared the Big Boy links with my adult son; he found them fantastic.

I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

I think they're going to miss the wall when it's gone.

The linked article by the "Green Mormon Architect" is full of nonsense and sounds like nothing more than a sales pitch for an unneeded project.

At one point the article states that there was never an intent to "create a monastic enclave".

But that is to some extent what the wall has accomplished. Aesthetically, you do feel like you're entering some quieter, special place that is disconnected from the distractions of the busy streets and noisy commerce going on outside the walls.

Not only will the historical wall be lost, but that feeling of seclusion and apartness will be lost. If that's what they want, go for it. Their loss. But it seems the next logical step would be to give the temple the same treatment. Tear down those thick granite walls and replace them with bulletproof plexiglass, so that everyone on the outside can see the freakshow taking place on the inside and the freakshow participants can watch the outside people watching them back.

So much inspiration that it boggles the mind. That light pen is out of control. (Or maybe some friends of the GAs need a big construction project to launder some money.)

Exactly what do you mean by "see-through"?

The new wall would have to be as high and impenetrable as the old one. I used to have nightmares about the SLC Temple Square Wall, and I will be happy to see it destroyed.

Iron bars are see-through, right?

PBC plastic with clear plexi-glass panels? Mormons love plastic fences and plastic steeples. Clear glass would keep a lot of members busy, every day, scrubbing off the finger marks and chewing gum.

Chain link is see-through. So is barbed wire.

I imagine it will be something cheap or fake. I'm picturing that fake stone stuff, that's along some of the streets and condo developments in Sandy and Draper. I'm sure a Mormon GA's relative owns that company.

Most likely wrought iron railing like around the White House and around many of the existing temples, just Google up pictures of them.

It's about bringing the Salt Lake Temple up to earthquake code. The state of Utah did the same for the state capitol building. They are going to have to dig under the footings of the temple and pour concrete and then put several hundred rubber pads under the concrete slab that sit on another concrete slab. They also are going to put reinforcement steel in the temple walls and roof.

What would happen to the Salt Lake Temple in a large quake is what happened to the large stone cathedral in Christchurch, New Zealand. It would just come apart.

So if you have to dig up the basement and around the foundation and open up the ceiling and put structural steel in the walls you might as well upgrade the mechanical equipment and do some remodeling.

You might as well tear up the maze of an annex and build something that flows better and hey, why not tear down the big wall to show off the temple better to people who drive by?

By the way Russ was sounding. It sounds like the other three pioneer era temples will get the same treatment.