All intelligence is independent in that sphere in which God has placed it, and intelligences were not created or made, The Lord rules over all the intelligences, Abr. 3:21..D&C 93:29.D&C 93:30.
The Intelligences honor God and do what God commands because God never breaks his word and obeys all the eternal laws.
Because they honor God, God was able to combine intelligence with matter - hence everything has a spirit. This way God can command the elements. The intelliences always honor God and never "sin" and can remain in his presence.
This creates a problems for man as God only maintains his power because the intelligences honor him. If the intelligences did not honor God, he would have no power. If God lets sinful man into his presence he would not be obeying his own laws. So, to allow man back into his presence we needed the atonement.
Jesus was perfect and could be in the presence of God, but because Jesus took our sins on him, the intelligences allow man back in the presence of God even though man broke the laws of God.
This is the reason for the atonement and why the atonement works. Its all about God keeping his power by making sure the intelligences continue to obey his word. Jesus also keeps his power this way too.
{{{All intelligence is independent in that sphere in which God has placed it, and intelligences were not created or made, The Lord rules over all the intelligences, Abr. 3:21..D&C 93:29.D&C 93:30.}}}
If the intelligences are independent, it is not ruled over by God. This first stated concept is not even coherent. Plus it raises more questions than it attempts to answer. Why would the intelligences need to be ruled over by God? Why were the intelligences placed in a sphere by God? What is an "intelligence" exactly? Is God himself an "intelligence"? The concept is so ambiguous and lacking in any meaningful detail that you could substitute the word "Teletubby" for "intelligence" and nothing would be lost.
{{{The Intelligences honor God and do what God commands because God never breaks his word and obeys all the eternal laws.}}}
This really doesn't make any sense. Why would the intelligences care whether God never breaks his word and obeys all eternal laws? Are the intelligences incapable themselves of keeping their promises and obeying "all the eternal laws" (whatever that means)? At best, it sounds like God would be recognized as an honest dealer, so the intelligences would be inclined to enter into business deals with God. Other than that, it's a big "so what??" Why would they want to be subject to God's commands in all things? If they already know "all the eternal laws" and God only commands things that are required under "all the eternal laws," isn't God redundant?
{{{Because they honor God, God was able to combine intelligence with matter - hence everything has a spirit. This way God can command the elements. The intelligences always honor God and never "sin" and can remain in his presence.}}}
Like everything else in this whole line of thought, this is just a series of bald assertions that explain nothing. Because of X, Y was possible. They "honor" God. They "obey" God. They have no free will. They are "intelligences" who combine with matter for some reason because that's what God wants them to do and they never sin. This is all gibberish. What is matter? Why does God need matter? What's the matter with no matter? Why does matter matter? Again...nothing is really explained.
{{{This creates a problems for man as God only maintains his power because the intelligences honor him. If the intelligences did not honor God, he would have no power. If God lets sinful man into his presence he would not be obeying his own laws. So, to allow man back into his presence we needed the atonement.}}}
What is man? Isn't man just one more category of "intelligence" combined with "matter" as stated previously? Why would anything that "man" does be a sin? Isn't God ultimately responsible for combining "intelligence" with matter in a way that makes "sin" possible? How could lowly little people possibly break the eternal laws? How could God make a creature that breaks eternal laws and still be honored by intelligences who only obey God because God supposedly NEVER breaks the eternal laws? Where did the "eternal laws" come from? It's all gibberish.
{{{Jesus was perfect and could be in the presence of God, but because Jesus took our sins on him, the intelligences allow man back in the presence of God even though man broke the laws of God.}}}
How did Jesus take our sins on him? If Jesus took our sins on him, doesn't that mean that HE cannot be in the presence of God? We're supposedly clean because he absorbed all of our sins and became a big cosmic bag of sins. Or did he make all of the sins disappear? Again, nothing is really explained. Jesus had a bad 3-day weekend and then came back better than ever. He has all of his superpowers. He is in the presence of God. The world is still full of sin...lots and lots of sin. Sins piled on top of sins. What did Jesus really do? None of it makes any sense. Plus why would the "intelligences" want any of us to be in the presence of God just because some nice guy suffered the consequences of our sins instead of us. Would you welcome a serial murderer and rapist into your home because some boy scout down the street hanged himself to take upon himself the sins of the serial murderer and rapist?
{{{This is the reason for the atonement and why the atonement works. Its all about God keeping his power by making sure the intelligences continue to obey his word. Jesus also keeps his power this way too.}}}
It's all about God "keeping his power"??? All about Jesus keeping his power??? Power over whom? Over us and everyone else. Sounds pretty selfish.
The real reason for the Atonement is control. Convincing someone they are broken is the first step in convincing them that only you can fix them. And then convincing them that they can only be fixed by doing exactly as you say.
Without Atonement, Christianity has nothing. You gotta have a gimmick.
"Wanna go to heaven? Listen carefully and do exactly as I say. And don't forget the 'donation'."
You can always try to sell something of no real value by convincing people that it's a solution to a problem that they were previously unaware of but now are aware of...thanks to you creating the problem and then telling them about it.
"Hey, whoa! I just ran a wuzzamuhgig scan on your house and you have a really bad skizzamafrazz infestation. It's not too bad now, but if you don't clear it out, everyone in the house will get really sick and die at some point in the next two years. When it happens, it happens suddenly and it's too late to do anything about it. Fortunately for you, I just happen to have the only device known to completely clear out skizzamafrazz infestations...."
It's the same scam that Mormonism runs with the "eternal family separation" doctrine. First they convince everyone that God separates loved ones from each other in the hereafter as the strictly enforced default policy. But, fortunately for people who love their families, the LSD Church just happens to have the "Sealing Power" and "yes you too can get the benefit of the patented LSD Sealing Power for as little as 10% of your gross income for life. Hurry and buy the Sealing Power before it's too late!"
delbertlstapley Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Its all about God keeping his > power by making sure the intelligences continue to > obey his word.
I absolutely LOVE being an insignificant cog in a universal perpetual motion machine!
Yeah, I remember this came out in the mid-80's in my mission (London). It was such a sweeping discourse to explain the "deep doctrine" of the atonement. I remember it was a someone, perhaps a GA, that was promoting this. Anyway, the intelligences have emotion, and would not allow man to return to God, except that they cried out in sorrow seeing Jesus on the cross, until the point that they all felt collectively - that his suffering was sufficient - not to appease God the father, but to appease the intelligences. Silly now that I think about it, but back then - hey man - it was the cutting edge of Mormondumb. I thought I was "all that" for knowing this earth shaking news. Intelligence could feel - who knew?
So basically, if I have this straight, the intelligences, who are independent, like being with God because...something...but they don't like humans, even though God made humans (who at the core are also "intelligences") because the humans sin. But humans only sin because God made them incapable of not sinning (on top of giving them total amnesia, limited perceptions and biological impulses that overwhelm their limited higher brain functions).
The intelligences (who sound like a bunch of jerks) don't want humans (or human souls or whatever) to live with them in the presence of God for some reason (mainly because the humans "sinned" when they were stuck in meat suits that were incapable of not sinning). But the intelligences really like Jesus. So when Jesus was tortured, they felt so bad for Jesus that they were willing to do anything to make Jesus happy and what made Jesus happy was to get the intelligences' permission for humans to live with them all in the presence of God.
And that's how Jesus made it possible for everyone to live with God and do whatever it is that they do when they all live with God forever. Kumbayah!
That has to be one of the most idiotic things ever.
Won't it just be wonderful to live in a place where your presence is constantly resented and detested by an infinite number of "intelligences" who only tolerate you because Jesus twisted their arms into letting you be there, even though everyone knows that you don't deserve to be there? How delightful!
Yay! Whoopee! Sounds like a plan...a really stupid plan.
delbertlstapley Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Anybody ever heard of this: > > All intelligence is independent in that sphere in > which God has placed it, and intelligences were > not created or made, The Lord rules over all the > intelligences, Abr. 3:21..D&C 93:29.D&C 93:30.
Splendid !!! Especially since there really is not any REAL explanation or sense or detail of what an "intelligence" really is .....but that "works" so well for the following excuse of an "explanation" on how phantom /fantasy MORmON items supposedly operate/ function .....in a MORmON realm.
> The Intelligences honor God and do what God > commands because God never breaks his word and > obeys all the eternal laws. > > Because they honor God, God was able to combine > intelligence with matter - hence everything has a > spirit.
Blambatsa was combined with blambootsa which caused blammo!!! , Hense Blamblasta!!!!
This "explanation" can be applied to every subsequent paragraph !!!!
> Hence This way God can command the elements. > The intelligences always honor God and never "sin" > and can remain in his presence. > > This creates a problems for man as God only > maintains his power because the intelligences > honor him. If the intelligences did not honor > God, he would have no power. If God lets sinful > man into his presence he would not be obeying his > own laws. So, to allow man back into his presence > we needed the atonement. > > Jesus was perfect and could be in the presence of > God, but because Jesus took our sins on him, the > intelligences allow man back in the presence of > God even though man broke the laws of God. > > This is the reason for the atonement and why the > atonement works.
Especially since the atonement really does NOTHING, just like the MORmON priestDUD!!! it's all just as effective as vicarious nutrition or dental care!!
> Its all about God keeping his > power by making sure the intelligences continue to > obey his word. Jesus also keeps his power this > way too.
Its all about THE (MORmON) church creating supposed reasons to take MOReMONey from MORmON members dumb enough to put any stock in MORmON doctUrines !!!
I think the real reason for the atonement — the reason it was invented – is humanity's burning desire to not suffer the consequences of their actions. "Some other guy is gonna get me out of jail free and all I have to do is kiss his ass? Sign me up!"
"I've always been a screw-up, and probably always will be. It sure would be nice if I could fool myself into believing that I still got a chance without putting in the effort of reevaluating my decision-making paradigm."