We've discussed pyramid schemes here before and their relationship to church membership.

In order for pyramid schemes to flourish, there must be levels of gullibility, social interconnection etc. We know this.

But what about the other aspect? No one except the suicidal or desperate jumps off a cliff. Unless they have something to help or protect them - a rope, parachute etc.

In the case of a very risky business proposition, you want to have a safety net - whether that's enough personal money to cover your losses, a loss leader, the prospect of profit or something to catch you when you fall. If you think you have that safety, then you are more likely to go for it.

In the case of LDS, you have -

* Friends and family.
* State welfare.
* Church welfare.

Due to the atomization and break up of society, the first option is out of the question for people without extended social networks and the last is only for church members.

The fewer safety nets, the less likely someone is to go off and do something stupid, financially or otherwise. Church welfare has even less rigor of government welfare, because dogooder members have not introduced any similar checks and balances.

Of course, hard working people, and even the unemployed, disabled and elderly, are all bilked as they pour fast offerings into this project, which ends up supporting poorly thought out money making schemes. An entrepreneur whose ideas repeatedly fail is given short shrift by the bank. Not so a church member, whose pyramid schemes keep leading them into debt. And if things get too hot, they go to another ward.

One of my sisters was selling the magic washing machine balls that replace soap with fraud. $70 each. The balls were tested at BYU and found to contain water and blue dye. That's all. This was a Mormon-driven MLM selling these hoaxes. I said right up front that the balls were bollocks, and my Mormon family members scoffed at my honest skepticism. That incident pretty much sums up my life with that lot.

donbagley Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> One of my sisters was selling the magic washing
> machine balls that replace soap with fraud. $70
> each. The balls were tested at BYU and found to
> contain water and blue dye. That's all. This was a
> Mormon-driven MLM selling these hoaxes. I said
> right up front that the balls were bollocks, and
> my Mormon family members scoffed at my honest
> skepticism. That incident pretty much sums up my
> life with that lot.

Wow! I haven't heard that one.

I once was involved marginally in an MLM against my better judgement. And yes, it was church members who told me about it. My involvement was for less than a month, and even though I had people pressing me to buy more stock and recruit others, I decided against doing anything like that until I showed a profit on what I was selling. I didn't and so I just left it.

My main safety net was that I had other income sources at the time, and was running a small business which was successful.

However, I think having the added safety net of church welfare, means a lot of people get involved in projects that would be considered too risky by many non-Mormons. They have grown up seeing vhurch members getting supported - some who genuinely deserve it and those who didn't.

There is no such thing as "church welfare".

The latest church leaders have repeatedly stated that members can't look to the church for help.

Members who fall on hard times find out to their dismay that the Mormon church treats them like lepers, what little they give is usually grudgingly given.

Stop paying the morg and put your tithing/fast offering money into your own account for a rainy day instead.

I had a friend who fell for the "laundry ball" fraud. They supposedly ionized the water and blah blah blah. In fact, most non-oily dirt can be removed with just water, and there is enough residual detergent in clothes to remove skin oils for several washings, no additional detergent needed. It was a total scam, and yet another example of some people's bottomless gullibility.

donbagley Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> One of my sisters was selling the magic washing
> machine balls that replace soap with fraud. $70
> each. The balls were tested at BYU and found to
> contain water and blue dye. That's all. This was a
> Mormon-driven MLM selling these hoaxes. I said
> right up front that the balls were bollocks, and
> my Mormon family members scoffed at my honest
> skepticism. That incident pretty much sums up my
> life with that lot.

it was a Mormon-driven MLM, but also a Mormon-owned school that exposed the fraud.

Hwint Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> donbagley Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
This was
> a
> > Mormon-driven MLM selling these hoaxes.
>
> it was a Mormon-driven MLM, but also a
> Mormon-owned school that exposed the fraud.

Was it Mormon-driven in the sense that it was driven by the COJCOLDS itself , or in the sense that it was driven by members of the COJCOLDS? I ask because I sincerely want to know rather than for the purpose of being argumentative.

Regardless, there's a lot of gall involved in creating and marketing such a product. Some people seem to get through life on little more than gall.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/18/2019 04:10PM by scmd1.

Don't forget the shoe magnets to keep you healthy.

My prior school used to host a food pantry for the community. Anyone could show up at designated times and take away several bags or boxes of food, no questions asked. And no bishop intervention nor tithing required, either.

People who have seen the insides of a ward enough to comprehend how unreliable LDS fast offerings can be *know* that they offer no security. Too much of the program depends on the competence or compassion of your ward bishop for another member to consider them as part of your financial resources. If you have a bishop without compassion or the competence to make those resources available, you will have made a huge miscalculation to rely on fast offerings.

Your Bishop may change at the next ward conference. Or a Stake President with a much closer eye on fast offerings may begin questioning bishops about their expenses.

A branch in our stake grew until they became a ward and then split when the bishop became known as very generous granting virtually any fast offering request. This bishop was called as the next Stake President because he obviously knew how to reactivate people! As Stake President he limited fast offerings. Those double wards quickly shrank to branch size.

I don't believe these MLM schemes thrive because fast offerings are available (when they really aren't reliable). These MLM schemes thrive because LDS families have diminished financial resources.

1. A mission sets the priesthood holder (and primary provider) 2 years behind his peers in education or career development. He rarely catches up either because that would likely interfere with Church callings or cause Sunday employment.

2. A stay at home mother likely isn't a good candidate for regular employment. If she can return to a career when their children are in school, she will likely be decades behind her peers. Her previous position may not even exist.

3. Tithing is a continual drain on family resources. Unless a family is willing to accept a living standard 10+% lower than comparable families in the ward or community at large, they will be yearning for finances they are missing.

The motivation for MLM is not misplaced confidence in fast offerings but a willingness to gamble when they perceive they haven't much to lose. If necessity is the mother of invention, what is desperation the mother of?

"A stay at home mother likely isn't a good candidate for regular employment. If she can return to a career when their children are in school, she will likely be decades behind her peers. Her previous position may not even exist"

Yes, this is a good example of genuinw sexism at play when a woman is condemned for having children.

However, given the future of work is pnline more than in offices, why can't they be?

No mention of corporate welfare ?