There have been some scientists, some Nobel laureates, but I think some of those have gone atheist. Like a lot of totalitarian countries, engineering and the sciences and medicine and dentistry are safe careers because they don't necessarily lead to conflicts with the authorities--at least not overtly, not immediately. People just lose their testimonies and interest.
The social sciences and humanities are different. Martha Beck's background was in sociology and psychology, and she wanted to apply her skills to Mormon women. Oops. Then there are the historians and theologians like Quinn and the September Six. Oops. The problem is that these disciplines put people square in the face of the Mormon authorities.
The arts are somewhat dangerous, too. People like Richard Dutcher spend their time thinking about deep questions and about Mormon identity. That often ends badly. Music is safer, but then you make friends with gay people like the (what was their name?) and get expelled from the Tabernacle and the church. Environmentalism and other forms of social activism? Unlikely. The politics are simply too complicated in a community that is politically conservative on the one hand and believes the world will soon end on the other.
The truth is that the church expects members to spend ALL of their discretionary time in church service. Careers that are socially prominent, remunerative, and conservative like corporate law or business are favored while those that require novel, even radical, thought seem self-indulgent. So I don't think you'll find a lot of significant writers (May Swenson, Orson Scott Card may be exceptions) or poets or philosophers or social scientists.
They have two factors in their defense - firstly they are few in number and secondly they have not been around for very long. Both of these reduce the pool of people available to produce geniuses.
Take atheism in contrast. There have been some great atheists. But the vast majority have never been anywhere near the top of the scientific or cultural scale. That is not necessarily because it is good or bad, but because most humans are mediocre and are led around by others. Ditto Roman Catholics - there have been some extremely great RC artists, writers etc but they have a much greater pool to draw on and most RCs are non-entities. The only religion which punches above its weight in terms of numbers is possibly Judaism, although again most Jews are no hopers.
There are some decent scientists and artists of Mormon origin. Farnsworth was significant in the development of the television for example (although I believe Baird invented it). There are decent visual artists out there of Mormon origin - even the guy who did the Book of Mormon plates is well known for paintings of Wsshington - both in traditional and "modern" media. As for writers, there are a number of very good ones. (We'll leave out the Nobel Prize for literature - a lot of questionable choices there... Bob Dylan is an inferior poet to Leonard Cohen and also a known plagiarist.)
Of course it goes without saying that a lot of them end up leaving, but the idea no people of Mormon origin go onto great things is plain nonsense. We're actually doing board members a disservice by claiming that.
"Other than 'leading the church', what are the shining moments of the GAs? missing talent & accomplishments, or Wasted efforts"
Most GAs are nobodies but... Ezra Taft Benson *did* go far in his career outside the church, and RMN seems to have had a very successful medical career. You can disagree with both these two on any number of theological issues, but their non-church career success is indisputable.
Thanks GNPE for bringing this topic up. We don't discuss this enough!
Here is what Joseph Fielding Smith said concerning the "superior" Mormon people in Doc of Sal 236:
"Saints are the best people. We are notwithstanding our weaknesses, the best people in the world, I do not say that boastingly, for I believe that this truth is evident to all who are willing to observe for themselves ways superior to any other people."
Yes they should lead in the arts, sciences, medicine, social activism. Mormons should be leading the progressivism, not kicking and screaming and trying to undermine it every time it's brought up at election time. There shouldn't be any poor or underemployed people in Utah.
Let's take for instance the author of the quote shown above. He was church historian for 60 freakin' years (recieving a salary for that, and had access to all the important hidden away materials), He was in a position of being able to stimulate the intellectual mormon community, and could have driven western research into into something revolutionary. But where is the great historical works by Smith? What books did he ever write?
Lest we forget, there's the Osmond family that entertained the masses for awhile; with the gummiest smiles on the planet. A few of the GA's are doctors, but most of them are attorneys or businessmen. One person that had some great qualities and contributed much in the area of health was Jon Huntsman Sr.
That's funny... I am a prolific reader... as I read only stuff that has proven the test of time or has such rave reviews that I would be silly to skip it.... I didn't recognize a single author in the list... nor do I intend to look them up after finding out how horrible and closed minded I am...
shylock Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > That's funny... I am a prolific reader... as I > read only stuff that has proven the test of time > or has such rave reviews that I would be silly to > skip it.... I didn't recognize a single author in > the list... nor do I intend to look them up after > finding out how horrible and closed minded I am...
Stephenie Meyer is a terrible writer, but a very successful one commercially. You're probably the wrong age group, but she is huge, thanks to having several blockbusters made out of her books. She also, unwittingly launched the Fifty Shades of Grey franchise - since that was originally fan fiction based on Meyer's work. Don't bother.
Orson Scott Card is very highly regarded within science fiction and has won some high level rewards. He is a much better writer than Meyer, and although there are problems with his work, he does explore some interesting ethical dilemmas through his books.
Anne Perry churns out murder mystery novels like her life depended on it. I think she has won some awards. She has the unusual distinction of being a mystery writer who was convicted of murder as a minor in New Zealand.
The best living LDS writer - or one of them - is Brady Udall in my opinion.
There's most likely some great ones in his/her respective fields of study, but they keep mormonism out of their achievements. Therefore, the church chooses to pan them because they're bad members for not tooting their mormon horn of greatness.
Conversely, we hear a lot about mediocre talent because they keep their dribble at front center with mormon propaganda. Do you really think Wendy Watson is truly an award winning children's book author?
That depends on how you think of sports... If you take the view they are insignificant, or of passing interest then no. If you think the opposite way, then yes. There are one or two of these sports stars who've been top of their game. Not just in stereotypically American sports either.
Lot's Wife Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Do any sports stars make a lasting difference in > the world through their sport? > > I thought not.
That is a matter of opinion. I thought you would be all up on Jesse Owens, apartheid sports bans and gender roles. Or how minority ethnic groups or gays can use it for progressing civil rights
Arguably the Springboks, who are the national rugby team of South Africa, played a role in healing the wounds of apartheid. (South Africa is rapidly going down the sewer just now, but there was one moment when Nelson Mandela harnessed good will of a mostly white team winning to try and unite the nation.)
Most politicians do not "make a lasting legacy" since they are often tools of other people - if only their party, but you would not be so hasty to dismiss them
> That is a matter of opinion. I thought you would > be all up on Jesse Owens, apartheid sports bans > and gender roles. Or how minority ethnic groups or > gays can use it for progressing civil rights
Perhaps you should reread my comment. You missed the key nuance.
------------ > Arguably the Springboks, who are the national > rugby team of South Africa, played a role in > healing the wounds of apartheid. (South Africa is > rapidly going down the sewer just now, but there > was one moment when Nelson Mandela harnessed good > will of a mostly white team winning to try and > unite the nation.)
Do you see the racism in what you just wrote? I mean, is the "mostly white" description relevant to the conclusion?
--------------- > Most politicians do not "make a lasting legacy" > since they are often tools of other people - if > only their party, but you would not be so hasty to > dismiss them
They make more difference in the world than curlers or football players.
"They make more difference in the world than curlers or football players."
Do they? Most politicians just do what they are told, and not very well. And when one party takes over from the next, they invariably enact similar policies. Most politicians are oxygen thieves and parasites who use unpaid staff, and charge the public large amounts of money.
Give me a curler anyday. They've sone less harm in this world, caused fewer wars and don't exploit the hard work of others.
Jackie Robinson, Babe Ruth, Yogi Berra come to mind; when I see other stars' stats, I'm impressed without any hint of lasting importance / impressions to society at large.
Robinson & Ruth & a few others' reputations will live on after I'm dead.
Orson Scott Card is well regarded in science fiction. There have been some political issues with him - LGBT etc issues - but he has won some silverware.
Brady Udall is probably one of the best LDS writers I've read. He's not as well known as he should be, IMHO. His writing reminds me of John Irving. (No, I don't care about whatever his politics are.) Udall is a bit estranged from the church I believe, possibly inactive. I was reading one of his novels years ago when it dawned on me that the writer had an LDS background. Just little things he mentioned. But hey, I was practically accused of making up my entire LDS background elsewhere so if I say "takes one to know one", I'll be accused of all kinds of nonsense.
LDS life is a good starting point for literature. A lot of decent writers have had difficult or strange childhoods, and I think the LDS culture is rich enough for something to be drawn from it in literary terms.