I’ve not followed the mormon corporation for a few years, I just didn’t want to know. But I have renewed interest thanks to my TBM family members (see my other post)causing me issues. Funny that I thought I could just move on, seeing as they live in another country. Ha ha.

Anyway, I heard that church on sundays is now an hour shorter. Is that true? How did they justify that, but what was the real reason behind it? I thought they wanted to take up everyone’s time, so I’m guessing there’s a replacement activity? Is it to encourage less actives to go to church perhaps?
The stance on homosexuality is no different, but it’s now a bigger issue due to the rest of the world standing up for real equality? This one is as nauseating as ever.
Scouting programme is gone (why?) and there’s a new youth programme coming out with no info on it whatsoever. What’s going on here?
They’re deleting more recent church history but not changing the actual doctrines. No surprises I suppose.
They’re trying to get rid of the term Mormon, which is stupid and pointless, so why bother trying?
Are HT, VT, FHE and missionary programmes still the same?
Can men have beards? I thought this was out, but my brother has one and he was on the bishopric, so I guess it’s ok now?

Anything really stand out to you that is especially cult-like in changes made?

Any changes I’ve missed? I’m interested to know their justifications/official reasons for making changes, and what you think the real reasons are behind those changes?

There have been changes in mormon docterine over the past decade.

When you go to the celestial kingdom now, you no longer get your own universe to be the god of. You don't even get your own planet. You only get to become more like God. The church keeps that issue vague to avoid having to answer questions about it (implying that you get to have a pure spirit like god without all of the superpowers or sexual procreation of your own spirit children after your exaltation).

The church changed their beliefs that the entire black race is cursed by God. They claim now that they don't know why God made them withold the priesthood from black men until 1978. So it's not they that are the racists. The recism was God's fault.

The scouting program ended in the mormon church because the Boy Scout organization refused to discriminate against its gay members and leaders who are law abiding citizens and who adhere to all of the rules of the Boy Scouts organization. In essence 'if you're going to accept those kinds of people in to your organization, we're leaving'.

The brand name of 'Mormon' has been so badly tarnished by church leaders and members that the church lo longer wants to be associated with it. They want to start over, and to pretend it wasn't them who did and taught terrible things.

For only a few years, the church had a policy of denying baptism to the children who have a gay parent couple in the same household. You would have to become an adult and condemn that gay relationship before you could get baptized. Too many people screamed bloody murder and this policy was dropped. Apparently, someone convinced god that he was wrong. So he changed his mind. Either that or Mormon church leaders are idiots.

Home Teaching and Visiting Teaching are gone. Now they just 'Minister'. Interestingly enough, a few years after I got home from my mission, my former Home Teaching companion was convicted of molesting several young children in the ward and sent to prison. I was his home teaching companion between ages sixteen and eighteen and he never tried anything on me. He knew I liked the girls and it wouldn't have gone well for him.



Edited 12 time(s). Last edit at 07/19/2019 09:34AM by azsteve.

WOW, WOW, and double WOW.

Thank you for that. You saved me hours of research on the internet. The consequence of being gone for a decade is that I’m now both entertained and horrified at the same time.

I recall very vividly how the men become gods doctrine was a major thing when I as a member. People discussed it all the time. And of course some people loved it even more than others and fantasised on what they were gonna do once thy were gods or goddesses. LOL. It really does make me wonder how they coped with that change.

I cannot comprehend how a basic doctrine like that has been changed without it raising a huge glaring red flag of more people. Surely deep down mormons know their religion is full of shit now? Yes, God really does change his mind and it’s all fine. Surely the cognitive dissonance created by a change like this creates mental illness throughout the TBMs (?). Well, it would explain a lot of weird behaviour in my family to me anyway.

And I didn’t know about the scout programme and gay discrimination. This makes me livid. Well, at least the scouting programme is better off. Huge cheer for them.

Fuck this cult. Not only does god change his mind, they are a bunch of immoral idiots.

‘Ministering’ eh? I will look that up. I’m guessing it’s the same thing with a different name. OR it means people can drop by without an appointment. Two years ago my brother and SIL were still using the terms HT and VT so I imagine it’s a recent change, or they were hiding the change from me.
Makes me wonder how much overt abuse went on in my ward, if any. There were some weirdos there but they didn’t hold much authority. Apart from the Holy Priesthood that is. One old dude who no doubt would have loved to be my HT, took a liking to me and used to call round at my house to offer me fruit. I was like, ‘no, I don’t want your bananas. I might be poor, but bananas are like the cheapest food to buy. Goodbye’. Didn’t stop him though, it went on for years. I think I didn’t complain as I found it funny- a bit wrong of me. And the RS president gave me a bottle of tomato ketchup and acted like she’d just saved me from living on the streets. I was like, no thanks, that’s cheap to buy and I don’t use it anyway’. The mormon way of thinking is so warped a lot of people’s behaviour becomes obviously abnormal, even in the little things.
Completely NUTS.

Much of this can be found in the "Stickey" at the top of this forum board under "LDS Org Essays". These are links right to the church's own website. Few members know about these essays because they are buried deep on the church's website and the church doesn't promote them.

The church needed to inoculate themselves legally by publishing this stuff. But people have been released from callings for teaching these things in church and referring other church members to these essays. So maybe they church is just lieing again and you still get your own planet, spirit children, and superpowers after all.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 07/19/2019 09:50AM by azsteve.

Of course, the temple death/suicide blood-oath threats were removed from the endowment ceremony in 1990. The current ceremony contains no threats "penalties" against you. Previously, you had to agree to your own murder/suicide (by acting it out yourself), rather than to reveal their secret handshakes. That motion of drawing my own thumb from just beneath my left ear, down across my throat, and back up to me just beneath my right ear while saying I would "suffer my life to be taken" never settled well with me.

I heard that you no longer are more or less naked except for wearing a sideless poncho during the initiatory ceremony. Now the poncho has sides, making that ceremony pretty much just weird now. I don't know if they still touch your genitals in that ceremony any more or not.

Hang on, wait. When was there genital touching, and exactly what do you mean? I ‘received my endowment’ in 1998 and I don’t remember any touching. I re,beer wearing some kind of shift very vaguely. What was it before exactly?

lj12 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hang on, wait. When was there genital touching,
> and exactly what do you mean? I ‘received my
> endowment’ in 1998 and I don’t remember any
> touching. I re,beer wearing some kind of shift
> very vaguely. What was it before exactly?

I went through in 1990, just after the penalties were removed (not by revelation mind you, but by church member survey). I just had a loose sheet covering me, that was open at the sides. My genitals were not specifically touched, but they were referenced and the touching got very dang close.

They removed the one year wait after a civil marriage to get sealed in the temple.

And I've read that in the temple marriage sealing women no longer have to veil themselves nor covenant to obey the husband, but join him in promising to obey Donny & Marie, or ghawd, whoever asks first.

I have been told that carrying a toilet brush while bearing your testimony can score some real righteous points with the bishop.

Excellent thread, lj12.

There are a few rules about which I have absolutely NO IDEA. Yet, as an ex-Mormon living in Utah, with Mormon family members, I'm still obligated to follow:

Can women wear pants to Mormon church meetings? To funerals? I'm a business woman and have only a few dressy dresses and skirts for evening, and short casual skirts for summer, but nothing appropriate for "church." When I ask my Mormon family members, they tell me to wear a skirt. I have read that Mormon missionaries can wear pants. Some Mormons say women should always a skirt in the chapel, but can wear pants to activities outside the sanctuary. I did wear pants to a funeral viewing, which was not in the chapel, but the RS room. I went on my way home from the office, and was wearing nice pants. I got stares.
So--?

Only skirts for women in Mormon church buildings--yes or no?
Anyone? Bueller?


I've talked to a few Mormon men, recently, and they all still believe that they will have their kingdoms and multiple wives in the hereafter. That's a Mormon male's ideal of heaven, and they're not going to let that go. I'm sure Nelson and Oakes believe this, too, as they each have at least two wives lined up.

Are Caffeinated drinks OK now? My Mormon family members guzzle Diet Coke and Pepsi all day long--about 4 giant big-gulps a day! They want to keep it secret, though, and won't talk about it, but there's always that giant cup visible in their hand. No Mormons I know drink coffee (unless they hide that more carefully.) Still, I think no one is perfectly clear on that.

I know several bishopric guys with beards, but their beards come and go.

My TBM daughter has a double-piercing in one ear.

What about not shopping on Sundays? Is the City Creek Mall closed on Sundays? I know Mormons that go to Cosco on Sundays.

I guzzled Diet Coke throughout my membership (and still do now) and no bishop ever refused me a temple recommend over it. It was then I decided I wouldn’t bother keeping that a secret. We could wear trousers or jeans to anything not on a Sunday and not a conference. I can’t see they will ever change the skirt thing. Well, they probably will, but it will be in like, a hundred years.
I had two piercings already in my ears, I just never used the second one of course. That wasn’t allowed at all.
On a different note, I do wonder how long the corporation will survive. Not forever, I’m willing to bet. Or if it does, the relative population of members will dwindle. Hmmm.

My memory comes and goes. Ha ha ha (No I'm not demented, but maybe I am).

The genital touching was when they had the open sided poncho and then the women (I'm a woman) would bless different parts of your body by lightly touching you under the poncho. My genitals weren't touched, but many were--mostly guys I think. Now I believe they wear their garments under the poncho that is sewn up on the sides and no touching underneath.

What else??? There was something. This isn't it, but the policy on children of gays was changed just before the last conference in April--the week before. Quietly placed in the newspaper or something like that, no big announcement. It wasn't discussed in conference at all. This policy caused so much agony for many (me included and I was resigned as it was) and they never addressed it.

I remembered--look up Rusty and Wendy--search--on this site. They've been pretty insane since the "takeover." Rusty has a notepad by his bed or an iPad or something and he will wake up in the night and have revelations and he writes them down. Wendy leaves the room (supposedly). They give talks about it and how he gets so many revelations now that he is prophet. There was a talk Wendy gave about being told by God Rusty was the one for her. From the talks given, it would seem Wendy is God and Rusty writes down the revelations. It is all rather hilarious--if it wasn't. Their antics have been insane. Oh, and they take her girlfriend with them wherever they seem to go--I can't remember her name right now. Their trips cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. They are redoing temple square and tearing down the visitors centers and some of the fence around it by the temple.

Wendy has been busy--so lots of "little" changes going on. Oh,missionaries can face time with their parents on P day and call them.

Interesting, thanks. I take it Rusty and Wendy are the prophet and his wife, plus she has a maid or something? As if they hadn’t spent enough money in SLC, that was on my list of reasons for leaving - the $1billion shopping mall.
I’m trying to remember if I was naked under that poncho thing. I thought I was wearing underwear, because if not I’m pretty sure I would have freaked out, as brainwashed as I was back then. But maybe I blocked that out. If that happened now, I’m pretty sure I’d punch someone in the face.
I do remember going to Utah (and SLC) twice as a member. I’m from the UK. I absolutely hated it. Im surprised I stayed in as long as I did given how much I hated the whole mormon thing. I hope that doesn’t offend anyone here. That’s brainwashing for you though.
It will be interesting to see what other changes they will make. It’s like watching a horror show unfold.

She and Wendy were "best friends" for a long time and own many properties together until Wendy married Rusty after his first wife died. Sherri Dew is over Deseret Book, but for some odd reason, she was taken on the last trip that Rusty and Wendy went on. Someone tagged a picture of her on that trip. There have long been rumors that they are a couple, but it may all be platonic, but it seems rather odd to me at least that Sherri was on that trip. WHY?

Wendy has made herself much more prominent as a prophet's wife than any other wife I've seen in my lifetime. It is all pretty bizarre. There are statements Rusty has made about those who have become apostates. I find him the most irritating prophet in my lifetime.

I wasn't big into temple square and all that either. I've never liked all the pageants they put on and dance festivals. I attended one pageant about Martin Harris the first year they put it on. It was beyond BORING. I was very devout, but I found a lot of these things ridiculous. And I'm from Utah. I don't find visiting mormon historic sites fun in the least.

As for the washing and anointing and the naked touching, I had heard about it several years before I got married and went through the temple. I forced my older sister to tell me what happened or I would leave the church. I was warned. Otherwise, I don't know how it would have impacted me.

Richard Packham has a site where he talks about many things and one of those is how they used to do washing and anointings. Pretty shocking. When he had his W&A is when my mother went through and I'm shocked she didn't run far from the church.

Wow her girlfriend is Sheri Dew?! The ex RS president (who never married)? Oh, that’s beyond weird she’s hanging around with her, they’re SO obviously a gay couple in the closet. She just married him to become the prophet’s wife if she’s behaves as you say.
Oh the blatant hypocrisy.
I think everything about mormonism bored me to tears. Like everything else I was too brainwashed to admit it to myself. It was a lifeless existence, and I felt like a robot.
I will definitely take a look at Packham’s site, thanks; it’s been years since I’ve looked at this stuff. Pandora’s box is open.

Jesus wept.

My Mom (and another sister) used to do all the heavy work setting up the cultural hall for a scouting fundraiser. While other scouts were supposed to show up to help, it was just easier and quicker to do it ourselves. My Mom and the other sister would always wear pants. The overbearing stake president walked in on them and tried to make a deal about not being dressed appropriately even though they never entered the chapel. There was no way my Mom was going to wear a dress or skirt to be climbing step ladders to hang decorations and set up tables and chairs.

Now my Mom did get kicked out of the church's genealogical library in SLC for eating and wearing shorts back in the 80s. We were on vacation at the time and she wasn't a TR member back then. Of course, she complied and had to pick up some Sunday clothing and shoes to return.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/19/2019 03:58PM by messygoop.

Is it true that they don't allow musical numbers during sacrament meeting any more?

They have always had a crummy music problem. Their strings and piano rules about what could be played. My problem was that unless you were paying attention in sacrament meeting when the church's policy regarding worship music then you never would have known. The policy most certainly was never discussed from the pulpit nor reinforced in church lessons. This is a classic example of where you were expected to know all the silly rules that guide your Mormon existence to the celestial kingdom.

I had been taking lessons to play the trombone and my Mom naturally wanted to show off like the other gifted and talented youth in the ward. I think that I was going to play Come come ye saints. The only question that was asked by a member of the bishopric was to reassure that I would be playing a church hymn.

So I was all set to perform. The ward program had my name in it: Special Music arrangement by Messy Goop. So I was sitting in the back row behind the bishop and everything was hunky dory. Only the chorister saw my instrument case and asked what kind of violin because the shape of the case was odd to her. When I revealed that it was a trombone, her eyes bulged. A quick whisper led to a discussion about how my instrument of choice was inappropriate for worship.

So I took my instrument out to the car and returned to my family's pew. They skipped over my part in the program, but all eyes were upon me as if I had committed some grievous sin that made me unworthy to perform. A bunch of the snotty sisters that my Mom tried forever to impress walked over to her after the meeting was finished. They uttered their pittance that Messy had been too nervous to perform (stage fright) when it was an unseen policy that caused me grief and embarrassment.

I haven't been to Church meetings other than funerals for 30 years so I don't know what is current. I play the piano and organ so can speak to what used to be.

I found some variance in local policies in different places. One ward the bishop would only allow hymns in sacrament meeting but it could be voice, piano, organ or strings.

Other wards allowed the ward choir and soloists to sing "anthems" which were basically religious music other than in the hymn book.

One Stake President, who I believe was tone deaf, decided that all singing by choirs was to be seated since the Tabernacle Choir sang seated. (The reason the Tabernacle Choir sat was better acoustics in that building)

I have always pushed the envelope a bit so I used to play music like "Ave Maria" for prelude music. No one ever said anything, probably didn't know the difference. I once played a Bach Toccata and Fugue as a "special music number" I was new in the ward which actually had a pipe organ and I wanted to show off what the instrument could do. No one ever complained, in fact I got a lot of positive feedback.

The female missionaries may now wear pants....PANTS while doing mishie work.

They still must wear a skirt on Sundays, but during the weekday proselytizing time, they may wear pants.

I never thought I'd see that day.

Does anyone know if the Mormon church is telling its members to not use social media? Last year the women (why just women?) were told in GC to have a ten day fast from social media. I ask because since then my brother and SIL have not posted a thing on Facebook. This is weird because they like Fb. So I think it’s either a new Morg thing or they’ve restricted me on Fb....

lj12 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Does anyone know if the Mormon church is telling
> its members to not use social media? Last year the
> women (why just women?) were told in GC to have a
> ten day fast from social media. I ask because
> since then my brother and SIL have not posted a
> thing on Facebook. This is weird because they like
> Fb. So I think it’s either a new Morg thing or
> they’ve restricted me on Fb....

It was discussed/speculated here at RFM. I thought it was a test to test members' obedience to the profit. Others suggested that there was a pending scandal involving certain relatives of an apostle and they wanted no gossipping.

The members LOVE that extra hour.

They QUIT the Boy [Scouts BSA] (Scouts)
The Man will quit them back

...

You haven't missed much.
No need in returning.