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Posted by: Levi ( )
Date: August 06, 2019 02:19PM

According to

https://churchofjesuschristtemples.org/hong-kong-china-temple/

The remodel will include the following items:


some of the rooms and windows will be reconfigured

meetinghouse level will be re-purposed for temple use

Better protection against moisture and will be refaced with new exterior stone

New art glass, artwork, and furniture

The steeple, complete with the statue of Angel Moroni, will be removed and THIS is what I find most interesting.


Lately, moroni has been skipping the some new ones. Haiti, Kinshasa, Guam, Cabo Verde, Puerto Rico, Paris and Lima Peru Los Olivos Temple - all of them - no Moroni and now they're snatching it off the cap of the Hong Kong building. That's almost interesting to me.

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Posted by: Ted ( )
Date: August 06, 2019 02:52PM

Well, I mean, I could understand if the "angel" with the trumpet was "Mormon", right? Jesus doesn't like the name Mormon anymore, and that's okay because is a fickle God, or son of God, or whatever - and He can do that (via Russy and Wendy and the pen light method). That's fine. But come on now, taking "Moroni" off his perch...that's taking to far now. It's not Mormon it's Moroni - completely different men.

I am going to have to complain about this to Jesus because they're disrupting the core of what it means to be a temple going Mormon (I'm sorry)..Latter Day Saint.

Is Jesus okay with this? Is Eloheim, for God's sake, okay with this? Is Brigham Young Okay with this? Most of all is Joesph Smith okay with this?

I don't think so. Don't be embarrassed of the Angel Moroni my dear LDS leadership...he's cool, with the trumpet and all. Please keep it.

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Posted by: subeamnotlogedin ( )
Date: August 06, 2019 08:35PM

It was Lehi anyway.

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Posted by: Normea ( )
Date: August 15, 2019 05:32PM

Hong Kong is in a lot of hot water just now. The airport was shut and PLA troops are massing along the border. Makes running a temple difficult.

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Posted by: babyloncansuckit ( )
Date: August 06, 2019 03:31PM

I think TSCC has turned the corner on believing in the historicity of the BoM.

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Posted by: caffiend ( )
Date: August 09, 2019 07:06PM

If you could only turn that into profit.

Seriously--interesting pint. This kind of doctrine is like the proverbial reversing the aircraft carrier's direction, accomplished only with so much time and space.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: August 15, 2019 03:36AM

Meanwhile the torpedoes keep coming.

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Posted by: Dodgy ( )
Date: August 06, 2019 05:29PM

Why does a temple need a Moroni anyway?

Crosses when Rusty has his say.

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Posted by: CrispingPin ( )
Date: August 06, 2019 05:56PM

Mormons don’t like the cross, but they need a symbol, and that symbol is often Moroni. Check out the symbols allowed on grave markers in US Veteran cemeteries:

https://www.cem.va.gov/cem/hmm/emblems.asp

The Mormon symbol is Moroni blowing his horn, but it looks like he’s chugging a bottle of something. When I visit my brother’s grave, a solemn moment always includes me chuckling at the thought of Moroni chugging a beer.

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Posted by: numbersRus ( )
Date: August 07, 2019 07:16PM


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Posted by: Honest TB[long] ( )
Date: August 13, 2019 12:26AM

The symbol of our Church with this belovedly super long name is our Big Brother. He's the one we are trying to make the center symbol of everything - BIG BROTHER is watching over us. That's Jesus.

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Posted by: MaryBlackRose ( )
Date: August 13, 2019 10:05AM

I never saw the Moroni as a dude chugging alcohol but OMG it really does look like that! Thank you... Thank you so much for that laugh. I have such bitterness towards this church for the way it f***** me over and stole years of my life that when I hear little jibes like this, it makes me so happy!

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Posted by: CrispingPin ( )
Date: August 13, 2019 12:13PM

Yeah, there is so much to laugh about when it comes to the (FKA) Mormon church. That’s good, because (as you said) there’s a lot to be bitter about.

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Posted by: nli ( )
Date: August 06, 2019 07:11PM

No big deal:

The Kirtland temple had no Moroni, and neither did the first three non-utah temples, from almost a hundred years ago: Hawaii, Cardston, Mesa.

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Posted by: 3X ( )
Date: August 06, 2019 07:27PM

It's a least a small deal when an existing Moroni is removed.


Is there a special deconsecration ceremony, or is he just tossed on the scrap heap (where he belonged all along)?

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Posted by: GNPE ( )
Date: August 06, 2019 07:53PM

they'll either MELT IT DOWN,


OR,

Sell it (on craigslist); it's much too sacred for DI!


oh Wait, maybe it will be installed in Russ' back yard where only a select few will be invited...


just sayin'

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Posted by: Ted ( )
Date: August 07, 2019 07:15AM

Bingo..and we will see Wendy out there polishing the trumpet daily.

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Posted by: Shummy ( )
Date: August 06, 2019 08:04PM

Well the Mesa makeover is halfway complete.

So far they have turned the whole north 40 into a spiffy new amphitheater for their bi-annual pageantry and wisely re-oriented it away from the setting sun that used to blind audiences.

Since the Mesa temple was never festooned with a golden Moroni I wouldn't put it past them to finally come up with a place for one.

I'm thinking maybe placing him atop a huge obelisk in front to beckon passersby would work.

Stay tuned.

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Posted by: Rusty's Third Wife ( )
Date: August 06, 2019 09:31PM

The leaders of the Communist Party of China are cracking down on religion all over China. They have put most Muslims in Xingjan province in concentration camps (comfortable ones) and are "deprogramming" them to make them atheists. They are forcing many Christian churches to close and others to remove all crosses and other religious emblems. Are they going back to Socialist economics? Heck no! At least no sign of that! However, they are cracking down on all religions. Church is wise to get rid of Moroni. They were either told to do that, or something said "Awww..yeah, you may want to get rid of that and keep a LOW profile". Hong Kong will be occupied by lots of mainland troops soon (who don't speak Cantonese). They will be from the northern and mid-China provinces, so they won't speak Cantonese and have little sympathy for the Hong Kongers.

The Church would do better to put a gold statue of Mao on top of the Temple, but, failing that, best to get rid of the Golden Moroni.


Shummy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Well the Mesa makeover is halfway complete.
>
> So far they have turned the whole north 40 into a
> spiffy new amphitheater for their bi-annual
> pageantry and wisely re-oriented it away from the
> setting sun that used to blind audiences.
>
> Since the Mesa temple was never festooned with a
> golden Moroni I wouldn't put it past them to
> finally come up with a place for one.
>
> I'm thinking maybe placing him atop a huge obelisk
> in front to beckon passersby would work.
>
> Stay tuned.

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: August 07, 2019 05:20PM

I think in the case of the Hong Kong temple, that's the most reasonable explanation. The Mormon church is trying to fly under the radar with respect to the government.

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Posted by: Rubicon ( )
Date: August 15, 2019 03:00AM

It’s getting nasty. If China makes Hong Kong part of the PRC and puts it under Beijing’s laws, the US isn’t going to intervene. The line is drawn at Taiwan. The church will get booted from Hong Kong and that temple will get confiscated by the state.

But yeah. I think they are flying under the radar and maybe they have gutted the building of anything religious hoping to at least to hang onto the property and hoping to make it a functioning temple again.

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Posted by: babyloncansuckit ( )
Date: August 06, 2019 11:20PM

Things haven’t been the same since Moroni came out as gay.

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Posted by: Wally Prince ( )
Date: August 07, 2019 03:53AM

Sometime within the next couple of decades, they're going to have to sell all of their temple properties to my new company, Hornblower Spas & Resorts.

I don't want to have to pay them any more than I have to. I really want to invest more in upgrading the interiors, converting the baptismal fonts into hot tubs, installing quality massage booths in the Celestial Rooms, etc.

And I wanted to acquire the Moroni symbol as the new trademark for Hornblower Spas & Resorts. If they gradually downgrade the Moroni statues and symbols, I'll be able to get a cheaper valuation on that aspect of the deal.

You're gonna love going to the temple when Hornblower Spas & Resorts gets through with them.

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Posted by: Rubicon ( )
Date: August 15, 2019 03:03AM

Are any extra services like getting your horn blowed available?

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Posted by: dagny ( )
Date: August 07, 2019 10:44AM

I wonder if the church has encountered a lot of issues about height and steeples and gave up trying to fight the local complaints or code laws.

I remember neighborhoods that complained about having steeples higher than everything else. Not everyone thinks having a golden arch, er, I mean angel hovering over their neighborhood is desirable.

I suspect what was said above too: they want to move away from having a BoM cartoon character on their roof that people mispronounce.

I look forward to visiting the Hornblower Spas and Resorts!

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Posted by: Chicken N. Backpacks ( )
Date: August 07, 2019 05:22PM

Have you ever, EVER hear heard a missionary, GA, F&T testifier, or ANYONE in the Mo' church ever mention Moroni blowing his horn and what it means?

Not me?

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Posted by: jay ( )
Date: August 08, 2019 02:07AM

No, but I’ve seen them actually blow them at football games.

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Posted by: Topper ( )
Date: August 09, 2019 04:03PM

Maybe they are phasing out the Moroni statues to avoid more being struck by lightening.

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: August 09, 2019 07:17PM

Rusty is doing it to spite me, because Moroni is MY super-secret name/password into The House of You Can’t Have too many Wives!

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Posted by: Rubicon ( )
Date: August 15, 2019 03:07AM

elderolddog Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Rusty is doing it to spite me, because Moroni is
> MY super-secret name/password into The House of
> You Can’t Have too many Wives!

Dammit! They told me that Moroni was my special name/password to get to Kolob with.

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Posted by: Rubicon ( )
Date: August 12, 2019 06:08PM

Right now Hong Kong is a common wealth of the People’s Republic of China. As you know from the news the PRC is putting the pressure on Hong Kong to become just like the rest of China.

Removing any religious symbolism from the temple might be an attempt to make the temple less of a government target. Also that steeple and statue just looked out of place. President Hinckley wanted to put a steeple on it to show it’s a religious building. I have also noticed they have had a lot of problems with various temples with moisture.

Oh well. We will see what happens to that temple. The church could lose it by the Chinese confiscating it. With the world changing quick the church could end up losing a few temples and finding itself not welcome where it used to be.

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Posted by: messygoop ( )
Date: August 13, 2019 12:57AM

Speaking of moisture-

This is exclusively a mormon problem. They are always praying for it and they get it! Albeit within the walls of their temples. :D

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Posted by: Rubicon ( )
Date: August 14, 2019 05:54AM

Hong Kong is a humid and rainy place. Apparently they are going to have to tear off the facing stone and replace it with new stone because moisture is getting in behind the stone.

They have had problems with other temples. Then the 20 year membrane roof on the Rexburg temple split and water got in and the stain glass windows started collapsing from their own weight when the sun heated them up softening the lead. The windows had to be replaced.

I'm sure the church has all sorts of problems with these temples. They really goofed when they built the Boise temple and had to close it down and remodel it. I notice the stone on that has been replaced and maybe that's due to a problem.

As you can see, the lord's work is inspired.

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: August 14, 2019 10:31AM

They failed to conduct the proper surveys! Woe be unto them!

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Posted by: cl2 ( )
Date: August 14, 2019 10:58AM

bother some of the mormons.

I never heard about the problems at the Rexburg temple. Wow! My boyfriend pointed out to me a place on the top of the Brigham City temple that looks really cheap, but it is hard to see. He thought that was interesting. So I guess we'll see if something happens at the Brigham temple.

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Posted by: Rubicon ( )
Date: August 14, 2019 07:30PM

Not all temples are created equal. For the larger temples they build they go with a steel frame and a hanging curtain. They are built much like an office building.

The smaller temples are wood or steel framed and built like a nice home.

Some of these wood framed temples had to be completely gutted and rebuilt due to moisture getting into the outside walls. The Memphis temple had this problem and another temple somewhere else in the humid south.

It's just all silly. I don't know how much longer temple mania will continue. I guess as long as they have the cash to do it. The problem is the members are going to become burned out on the temple. Those places were special when you had to ride a bus and go on a once a year trip to one. When there are too many and you go too much it just becomes an assembly line.

I know one person who is a coordinator and ordinance worker in the temple and he's ready to hand it over to someone else. He's burned out on the temple.

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Posted by: Levi ( )
Date: August 14, 2019 07:37PM

You're correct, the temple is losing it's "specialness".

The old school "moronis" were hammered copper with gold leaf - an actual statue, now they are fiberglass and spray painted basically a mannequin. The oxen used to be stone or metal, now, they are fiberglass as well. Everything used to be custom for the temples, now you can order any of the exact chandeliers from the maker, Schonbek. They just use their designs.

Then they dumbed the endowment down so much it's barely there at all. I just listened to the pre-1990 version. It's a WHOLE lot different, so much so that if I hadn't personally experienced it, I would call it an "anti-mormon lie", but I experienced it.

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Posted by: Rubicon ( )
Date: August 15, 2019 02:19AM

Levi Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You're correct, the temple is losing it's
> "specialness".
>
> The old school "moronis" were hammered copper with
> gold leaf - an actual statue, now they are
> fiberglass and spray painted basically a
> mannequin. The oxen used to be stone or metal,
> now, they are fiberglass as well. Everything used
> to be custom for the temples, now you can order
> any of the exact chandeliers from the maker,
> Schonbek. They just use their designs.
>
> Then they dumbed the endowment down so much it's
> barely there at all. I just listened to the
> pre-1990 version. It's a WHOLE lot different, so
> much so that if I hadn't personally experienced
> it, I would call it an "anti-mormon lie", but I
> experienced it.

Yup. Moroni is now a fast food plastic sign. It’s laughable. It’s like McDonald’s. Like McDonald’s they try to personalize each location with some decoration of the local area but it’s the same canned, corporate vibe.

I’m going to sit back and watch where all this silliness goes. I do like the temples at night. They make great VFR landmarks when I’m flying my airplane. You can really see the Rexberg temple a long ways away.

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Posted by: Levi ( )
Date: August 15, 2019 03:12AM

Really? The windows were made to such a craptacular spec so as to melt and puddle?

That chandelier is a pain in the ass is what that is right there.

That particular one is called "Trilliane" and this is about as large as they make them. This one looks about the same size as Atlanta's. I own the SMALLEST one that is made. 6 lights, mine. These monsters look like they have 200 lights.

I look at them like a really sparkly 3-D Puzzle, and have an obsession, but I'd only want to start taking it apart, then I'd lose interest. The scale of this fixture astounds me.

They replaced the roof already? Jesus sucked at carpentry too!

This wasn't the one that had the moroni with the blasted off face was it? No, that was Oquirrh Mountain. Blew it right off. Looked like blackface.

Total tear down and rebuilding at least 5 of those McDumpy Temples. Disposable temples, my god, they just invented Disposable Temples.

When they were doing the initial build out of them all, back in 1999, I didn't know it yet, but I was just about to head out the door of Mormonism, but I was still in it to win it. My aunt gushes about a meeting that she overheard in the temple with the man from the temple department talking to the group and he said "these new temples are being built in haste". She thought that meant jebus was on his way, look busy. She was wrong so far. They're falling apart before he can get back.

I'm one of the few ex-mo's that actually liked temples. I was kind of obsessed. Now that I'm fully out, I'm still obsessed but for completely different reasons.

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