Please explain how shoulders are pornographic. Guess it's back to pants on table legs...

https://www.chicagotribune.com/columns/heidi-stevens/ct-heidi-stevens-thursday-glenbard-east-dress-code-0815-20190815-y7ashm656fbkjfxqqdfu6d5fdi-story.html


Female students wearing tank tops were publicly called out for violating the student handbook’s dress code and handed bright orange T-shirts to change into, according to parents, kicking off a volatile first week of school that saw TV news crews parked outside the school and administrators placed at the center of a social media firestorm.

“I can tell you outright the students were being shamed,” Deanna Breen, whose daughter is a sophomore at Glenbard East, said Thursday.

Breen’s daughter was not among the students asked to change clothes, but she came home Wednesday “shocked," Breen said, that her classmates were being made to swap their own clothing for bright orange school-issued attire.

Some administrators are obviously high on wielding the power given to them in the school handbook.

The mom has a valid point: giving them bright orange Tshirts to wear renders the argument of dress that "draws attention" to the wearer as ridiculous when that is the solution provided by the School.

Is there any part of the female body that is not considered pornographic by school administrators? When in doubt, make burkhas mandatory.

Wonder what the school board, the PTA and the parents involvement in the input and review of the dress code, student handbook etc.

Do they all sit back and not get involved until their sweet innocent little darling comes home totally humiliated because the principle and teachers enforce the policies.

Parents need to get involved especially if they don't like the rules.

Then all the Mormons complain about the rules regarding white shirts, one pair of earrings, "modest" dress, swim wear, garments...….

But there's no reason to get involved if the standards are clear. In this case the school district has been enforcing the rules a certain way for years and there was no notice of a change.

When the administrators abruptly altered their policy, the parents immediately got involved. That's how reporters learned of the problem and why we were informed of them.

This is how parental involvement is supposed to work.

Gestapo Tactics!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
totally in appropriate
If that were done to one of my children I would pull the dhild out of school and file a harassment suit against the school!!!!!!

thedesertrat1 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Gestapo Tactics!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
file a harassment suit against the school!!!!!!


as a protest, OK, but very little legal support:

You'd have to show that a very small number were arbitrarily singled out & shamed in front of others;

School District can easily establish that it's their responsibility to establish rules for the good of all, that some clothing (or lack) detracts from focus on Ed U Ma Cation.

Conservative parents would line up to support the S.D.

But then again, my daughter used to wear some pretty short shorts in high school. Most of the girls did. So maybe Chicago is behind Utah now. I can't remember if they wore tank tops.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/16/2019 05:49PM by cl2.

It's not about the shoulders - it's about the arm pits. It's really all about the bare naked arm pits.



ROFLMAO - seriously.

Especially, but Not Mentioned---- GASP! HAIRY ARMPITS!!

This is strangely on topic. Imagine the pits Joseph encountered.

I’d think that a lot of kids would feel proud to be seen wearing a orange t- shirt because it makes you look cool that you went against the dress code. I thought that the kids that never get called out were considered dorks or nerds.
If I got called out and had to wear a orange t - shirt, I’d be showing it off and bragging.
If all the kids got together and wore tank tops,they’d probably run out of t- shirts. That would be funny.
That’s just me though. This won’tlast though. I don’t think that they can enforce this . My high school in the late 70s still had a dress code and sent kids home.
The other kids would think it was cool if you got sent home to change. My cousins who lived in another state though,could practically wear what they wanted to school.

We couldn’t even chew gum back then

A lot of times it comes down to teachers to enforce the dress code. So if the dress code is not being enforced evenly, then teachers need a training session about it. I've always found it irritating when I am enforcing the dress code and other teachers are not.

From the article, students in violation of the dress code had the option of wearing either the orange t-shirts or "school spirit wear," which is generally in school colors (in this case it would be red and black, which sounds rather spiffy.)

It seems like a nice high school. I'm sure they will move past this quickly.

They'd better.

The parents, and children, deserve predictability. If kids abide by the established code as historically interpreted, they have every right to expect continuity. If the school penalizes them for doing what was acceptable before, without any forewarning, it is the administrators who are in the wrong.

you seem to be suggesting that the S.D. either can't change things or 'needs permission' to change this type of item.

the schools 'should be' governed by democratic rules/principles but they don't need to be a burden to the educational process / system.

I believe in reasonable rules, and unfortunately they sometimes coincide with religious guidance / goals.

No, I don’t think rules must be democratically decided. But changes in rules must be announced. People have a right to know what will be enforced.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/18/2019 12:04AM by Lot's Wife.

of course they will be announced, I thought the question / suggestion was process to have them approved.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/18/2019 12:45AM by GNPE.

The school has the power to enact and enforce rules it thinks appropriate. If those rules are prejudicial against certain groups of students or inconsistent with broader community norms, the parents will make their feelings known and an accommodation be reached. All of that seems to have happened in the past, since people were comfortable with the standards.

But then, without forewarning, the standards were changed. Kids have a right to be upset about that and the school is going to have to improve its communications and perhaps even apologize for the embarrassment and inconvenience. And there it ends--unless the school's standards are incompatible with the community's preferences, in which case the parents will make a stink and the school very possibly retreat.

That's how it will go; it is how it should go. The process is not democratic, but it is responsive and it is responsible.

and are arbitrary and subject to change without notice as they are subjective and based on perception.

No one is asking or expecting the boys to control themselves.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/18/2019 02:11AM by anybody.

Hopefully society’s standards are moving away from that.

We’ll see how the committee nity reacts in this case.

Well, if the schools I've worked at are any indication, the code is more to ensure that students are dressed in a minimally acceptable way for a work environment. Shorts should not be too short and tops should not be too bare. Generally that's interpreted as no spaghetti straps or tube tops on girls, no basketball tank tops on boys.

The idea is that clothing should not be a distraction from learning.

Art by Rosea Lake

https://roseaposey.tumblr.com/post/39795409283/judgments

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/rosea-lake-vancouver-judgments-skirt-length-photo_n_2504950

Behavior should be controlled, not shoulders or ankles or elbows or knees



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/18/2019 02:55AM by anybody.

Again, school is considered to be a work environment, and schools enforce minimum standards to ensure that productive work can take place. It's comparable in some ways to adults working in an office environment. Most adult women will not wear short shorts or a tube top to the office because it's a distraction and does not say, "I'm here to work."

Boys have dress standards, too. A basketball jersey will be in violation in any school that I've worked at. They are also subject to the rule about the length of their shorts.

Some people want to set themselves apart from their cohorts/peeps.

high school & jr. high kids know or easily learn what pushes buttons, many love to set themselves apart of above peers. girls sometimes do this with clothing, dyed hair or athletics, others; guys with dyed hair, athletics, etc.

unfortunately, smoking was common across genders.

New methods, same patterns.

Sometimes administrators want to set themselves apart, too. They may sport edgy clothing, die their hair bold colors, or even arbitrarily change rules without notice. What was perfectly acceptable last year is suddenly verboten because some fool views his own values as somehow superior to those of the rest of the community.

Such martinets get to pretend they are special at the expense of kids and their parents. They differ from the edgy teenager in two ways: they have authority to enforce their choices on others, and they are held not to a juvenile standard of accountability but to an adult standard.

Defending a moron who decided to impose a dress code that is violated by some of the school's own uniforms and to do so several days before even announcing the new policy is not a position I would want to be in.

Can't this be an issue for the PTA (parent-teacher association)? I think we could have some elements of a representational democracy here when it comes to the interests of the parents. The rules shouldn't change without some level of parental involvement and some kind of communication with the rest of the community. Older kids (old enough to skirt dress-code issues) that don't keep the dress-code rules can either be sent home or their parents called right away and then they're sent home. There shouldn't be any shaming, just objective consequences for their actions. If they miss a test because they went home to change their clothes, then they fail the test. Too many absences or tardiness and there are consequences. Any standard that applies to the girls should apply equally to the boys.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/18/2019 09:35AM by azsteve.

azsteve--

I've not been involved with PTA, but I don't think they're involved with district policies; aren't they more of a communication avenue?


there once was a movement to transition PTA to PTSA (parent teacher student association) to encourage student participation, but I think that fizzled.

The reason that schools started to distribute shirts and pants to students was in part to avoid having to send kids home or to pull parents out of work. The schools carry spare clothes for other reasons as well -- students might have accidents or spills that require a change of clothing. Some students choose to keep a spare set of clothes at school.

Some school also have clothes washers and driers to help students who are in need.

It's often the case that schools (and principals) are evaluated for attendance, test scores, etc. So it's in everyone's best interest not to send students home or otherwise have them miss class.

If the parent cares enough about their child, they won't mind so much being pulled out of work once or twice if needed, to discipline that child. And then the kid is in big trouble, the kind they don't want to repeat. Maybe it won't happen at all if the parent pays attention to what their kid is wearing to school in the first place. The point is, the parent needs to care and to be responsible and it's the school's job to hold that parent responsible. If neither the school nor the parent cares, then it's not fair to humiliate the kid by making them wear some embarrassing clothing. It's better to put everyone through the trouble of the kid missing half a day of school and the parent missing some work. That's an exercise that no one will want to repeat. And it's the school's job to not relent on that after everyone knows the rules. Otherwise the rule is just an ideal that no one really has to keep and the child is treated like they're not worth taking the time to raise them properly.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/18/2019 09:27PM by azsteve.

This again misses the point.

If you are walking down the street, a street you have walked down daily for years, and the police arrest you because they have decided without warning to change the way the governing that street is enforced, how would you feel? Would you be okay if, while sitting in jail, they informed you that two days hence they intend to announce the new law? Of course not.

And yet here you are siding with the school when it changes the dress code without any forewarning. Why is that? Is it your feeling that children, or parents, or students have no standing to demand prior information? Is there some reason why these people should quietly defer to the exercise of arbitrary power?

You say that "it's the school's job to hold that parent responsible." That is a curious statement given that the school, and not the parents, acted irresponsibly by effectively changing a dress code without notice. We live in a constitutional republic in which the school district reports to the community, not the other way around. Watch how this unfolds from here. The parents will receive either a reversion to the old dress code or a thorough explanation of the new one; and in both cases they will receive a full apology for the actions the administration took in the interim.

Thankfully, we do not yet live in a society in which individuals must always defer to authority. That redounds as much to your advantage as it benefits absentminded teenage girls.

I agree that there needs to be a proper roll-out of any changes to the dress code in this case. Your analogy correctly shows the injustice of a retro-active rule or a rule that has not been properly communicated and some time given for adjustments to be made. But after all of that has been taken care of correctly, then the burden falls on to the parents. I remember my parents saying a few times that I couldn't dress the way I thought I was going to go to school a few mornings when I was growing-up. My parents did the same with my sisters at one point. If the parent uses common sense and pays attention to what their kids are wearing, this issue probably won't come up any way.

We agree, then, on the process.

The subsequent question is whether the standards accord with the community's standards. If attitudes towards girls in particular have changed to disfavor standards based on boys' reactions, then that community will probably force more fundamental changes in either the interpretation or the rules themselves. That too should happen in an orderly fashion through school board meetings, elections, etc.