My sister and her husband perform a hot potato game every week.

They alternate and draw in relatives in their emotional game. One is happy the other is sad or angry. Week after week, like a scheme.

Two of their kids moved out this past summer and it seems that they now lost two emotional dumpsters. Their kids moved a long way from them and the realtionship seem to be evolving into a professional relationship. The kids are very sparse with words interacting with them, sticking to yes- and no-answers, and show an assertive attitude to keep the fences up.

I hate this. It hurts. But it is not my business. The persons I once knew turns out more and more to be complete strangers.

Anyone else experienced something like this?

This could be related to Mormonism. But at first blush, I'd say it's a maturing couple who are not handling a "stage of life" issue--the empty, or emptying, nest. I know that once my children became pre-adult but much more autonomous, my wife and I had adjustments, including a temporary but intense estrangement from each other. Eventually, we worked through it, but it was more upsetting than I expected, or than it needed to be.

Do you think it is possible that they can not talk with each other about their emotions? So to keep the marriage together they project it outwards?

I think this is an excellent question. My wife and I are having a very hard time empty nesting. We are depressed and feeling alone together but we talk about it. I never thought this stage would be this bad. I thought it would be the opposite.


BUT and it is a big one, I know a few couples for whom the activities of children and going and doing with an active household "helps" them avoid talking about their relationship. I don't know if they realize their "come to Jesus" that will happen post child rearing...

My wife and I talked about it. It was a very short discussion.

Roy: So how are you feeling about the kids leaving the nest?

Ms. BIV: Can't wait!!!

Ms. Biv: And how are you feeling about it?

Roy: Me too!!!

Both of us: So what should we watch tonight?

Roy G Biv Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Both of us: So what should we watch tonight?

We have to talk about that.

I'm not sure when my son will be leaving again. That's okay. It is harder having a child return than having them gone, though, I can say that. There are usually reasons they return that aren't good ones.

Now, my daughter, was off to Alaska for 11 summers and then would be in college or living with friends out of state during the winter. When she got married last January, I thought I'd have her close by. Wrong. When she told me they were going back to Alaska to work as she had a manager job offer, then it really has bothered me. I always thought there was hope she'd live close by.

Wow! You are a bit older than I so I have yet to have the kids move back in. I hope I can do it with the fortitude you have!

With a sister and her daughter being narcissists, I feel your pain.

Oh good heavens yes. My TBM MIL is a relentless histrionic narcissist and she has been tearing holes in the family at a faster than usual rate for the last month, almost. I can't keep track of which sibling she's told what lies and which brother hates which sister this week and the husband and I are supposed to be on everyone else's side but our own.

All the stress is not helping my husband and now we two are at each other. Funny enough, it's about emptying the nest. One child is left at home. He's 21, currently unemployed and has dropped out of community college due to lack of direction. Husband says that means if he wants to stay here he is now our butler, but the kid has been going out during the day to look for work and isn't doing much around the house. Kid is also looking a bit depressed and I am working on getting him some help without trying to make him feel worse. It's not easy around here when he and his dad can't say two words without it devolving into a chest pounding contest. I've told the husband that the kid is not doing so well and he says he doesn't care, if he won't work or go to school, he either keeps the house spotless, or he's gone. There's nowhere to go, so the kid feels bad and gets more depressed, the husband gets angrier, and more and more stupid mean stuff is being said under my usually very harmonious roof. Naturally this doesn't sit well with me, all this projection of stress onto each other, so I've become snippy too. Throw in husband's narcissistic Morgbot mother throwing drama every five minutes and I feel like I'm watching my own private Jerry Springer episode.

My advice:

You said it yourself. This is not your business.

When TBMers do their weeping and wailing and gnashing of teeth schtick when an exMo leaves Mormonism, part of the standard advice here is "you are not responsible for their happiness. They are."

This also works in reverse. Your sister is not responsible for your happiness. You are not the cause of the dysfunction in their family, nor are you the solution. Easier said than done, but you need to not get sucked into the dysfunction. As they say on airplanes, put your own oxygen mask on first. If you can't function, you're not going to be any good to anyone, yourself included.

The kids are dealing with narcissists in the proper and healthy way. Narcissists can't be fixed, because they don't believe there's anything wrong. So you can only disengage with them.