The Mormon Heavenly Father the same yesterday, today and forever? I think not.

In my weekly phone call with elderly mother she said she has ordered caffein pills on the advice of her doctor. The particular ones in question also have green tea tucked into the capsules. Hmmmnnn thinks me.

She is also ordering them for other family members who would lay down their life before a coffee mug could be pressed to their lips at gunpoint. And no iced herb tea either as it is a gateway and also must avoid even the appearance of evil. But pills. Why yes. Cuz if the doctor said it was good thing for Mom and they have similar issues, then the Amazon drug store it is!

Mom is very old at this point so I didn't point out that as children in the fifties she used to give us green tea when we were ill. Or that she kept coffee in the cupboard and served it to an atheist uncle* married to Dad's sister. Or that my father the Bishop used to give temple recommends to the old people of the town who still drank coffee like my great uncle, because, back then at least in our county, no one had their panties in a twist over coffee and tea like they do today.

My dad was raised dirt poor--as a kid even the floor of the house was dirt for a while. And some days all they had was coffee, so, he was down to earth about it all and understood why all the old timers still had a cup before heading off to church.

THEN ONE DAY. Dad became bishop and mom became Bishop's wife. And all changed. And our family became so TBM that even the other TBM's thought we were too much. But the rest of the church soon followed and though we were taught as kids that the spirit of the law was the most important, it wasn't long before the entire Mormon church changed that. Letter of the law now rules in the Land of Mormon







*Boy did my Bishop dad and Uncle Atheist have fun discussions and I loved listening in so sure my Dad was right. Looking back to the things uncle would say about the cosmos and life and such--- I share much of his exploratory mind set now. And then after aunt and uncle left, every time my Dad would say. "Poor uncle. He just doesn't realize that what he is searching for is right in front of him in the gospel."

What a difference a few decades make because for me, I never want to be the same as I was yesterday, and, I don't want to be the same as I am now, forever.

My motto has always been, "Never Level Off."

D&D, have you ever looked into your coffee cup and noticed that coffee seeks it’s own level ?

Very wise, Kathleen. Very wise.

Kathleen, you are fast becoming one of my favorite posters.

Kathleen is the bomb. Always has been.

You parents sound like they were lovely people. Too bad the church had such a hold on them. It's wonderful that your dad understood those old timers and their coffee tradition.

My mom fed us tea when we were sick, also. Those memories don't go away.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/08/2020 12:49PM by kathleen.

Yes, a very nice post. The church has morphed over time. It had a period of tolerance for some things. It is a joyless entity now.

and his parents drank coffee, and alcohol, and my dad and grandpa chewed tobacco. My grandfather served in WWI and picked up the habit.

I didn't realize this one. I knew they all drank at family parties. My uncle served it. He eventually became a bishop and all that drinking at our parties stopped. I was always a bit shocked by it all--not a bit shocked, really shocked. I was so worried my dad wouldn't be with us in the CK even as a little 5-year-old.

I love the smell of coffee. Reminds me of my grandparents' house.

Oh, the I didn't realize this one. My older sister just told me last week that our neighbors saw our grandfather walking out of the liquor store with a sack full of alcohol. My mom told my little sister to tell them it was medicinal. Well, my grandmother was quite ill all the years I knew her.

My grandfather was removed from the SS presidency because of his chewing tobacco, so he would take my dad to the pool hall while grandma played the organ at church. They had to drive in from the farm.

My sister said the Christensens (my maiden name) were heretics. We like them. We've always liked my dad's family better, except we adored our mother's mother. Didn't know our grandfather. My mother's parents couldn't afford to pay tithing and they were still allowed to go to the temple.

My youngest brother old me recently that my dad told him that the WofW is bullshit.

I guess we are heretics! Love it. My dad's family didn't practice polygamy either. He said they weren't that stupid.

I was the little good girl in the family. Everyone in my entire family on both sides was shocked when I left and all my friends. I was going to save us all. Now my dear little daughter has taken over that role (who used to drink coffee in high school).

I love the way you wrote that. Reminded me of our county paper and the columns some of the older ladies would write about the happenings in their town.


That doesn't sound like my family, though, but it does sound like our old pioneer town back in the olden days. Most people didn't worry about the WoW that much or at least turned a blind eye. People would forget you had a beer sometimes and still let you bless your baby. Wouldn't happen today.

My grandpa smoked but went to church every Sunday because he loved to sing in the choir his ward had. I heard later that he didn't believe and that had something to do with reading a book called "Midnight at Nauvoo." Maybe I'll read that some time.

Re Midnight at Nauvoo: I found "Nightfall at Nauvoo" about "the earliest days of polygamy", written by a grandson of John Taylor. Sounds interesting. ($28.93 on Amazon)

Yes. That's it. Thanks.

Midnight at Nauvoo is an intriguing title. Sounds like a mystery movie. :)

Haha. And Nightfall at Nauvoo sounds like when Joseph did his best work!

Yes, sinister. What a sleaze.

A friend of mine was a prospect of Mormon missionaries years ago. She spoke to them for quite a long while but didn't accept the doctrine (that which they chose to share with her). I can't recall what it was that finally put her off in the end and she told them to take a hike.

I recently told her about my visit to SLC when I went to the museum and saw the black and white photographs of JS and BY and all their wives. I had taken the bait - the story of how the Mormon prophets married all these poor widow women to look after them. I remember looking at their faces in the photos and thinking how nice it was that Mormon leaders had saved and cared for them in their need. {{gag}} I was beyond surprised to learn the truth about Mormon polygamy (and also shocked at my obvious stupid innocence in this regard).

I detailed years ago how I met a woman here in BC (Debbie Palmer) who had been a polygamous wife in Bountiful (a fundamentalist Mormon community) to its leader, Ray Blackmore. The life there is challenging and unfulfilling to many of those seemingly stuck in fundamentalist Mormonism with few choices, little education and being isolated from the wider world. The experience must have been at least equally as miserable for the women back in the time of Mormonism's founders.

My friend, who had said no to the missionaries pretty quickly, was shocked at my slowness to catch on to the true story about its establishment and current realities.

Me too.

A lot of my family settled in Spanish Fork, right by the south shore of UT Lake (Lakeshore?).

A Great Aunt of mine was ordered by her doctor to drink coffee due to a heart condition. This was in the late 1960's to early 1970's. Doctor said it was a lot cheaper for her to drink coffee than to get prescription Caffein tablets at the pharmacy. I remember that she got a major ration of crap from her Bishop, and a bunch of the busybody ladies in RS. She got her doctor (also TBM) to write her a prescription that she was to drink at least three cups of caffeinated coffee every day. She gave that to the Bishop and told him to shut up and leave her alone.

I love this. My mom even admits to loving the smell of coffee, but no. She's going for the pills that do exactly the same. I guess she doesn't want to incur the wrath of a loving heavenly father, haha.

The smell of freshly brewing coffee is one of life's pleasures. My mom and I lived together for the last ten years of her life. I would get up early in the morning and put the coffee on, and she told me that she loved waking up to that wonderful aroma.

Plus we all know that science has proved over and over that coffee is a healthful drink. The WoW is simply wrong about it being unhealthful. Dr. Rust-Bucket knows this quite well, but refuses to be enlightened to change the WoW for his own reasons.

Coffee can also be a lifesaver. It keeps people awake for long and difficult drives, particularly at night. It helps medical workers to stay alert on night shifts. The pilot flying your plane has probably had a cup or two before taking off, or even during the flight. Coffee shops often give first responders a free cup of coffee. It is far from an evil drink. It has been a blessing to humanity.

I can vouch for the pass that folks got years ago regarding coffee drinking etc. 50 years ago this summer I was getting ready to get all sealed up to my eternal mate and putting the pressure on my coffee drinking father to get himself a temple recommend. It was an open secret that he drank coffee, even to the bishop because he went to our local coffee shop in a very small town for his fix every morning. My mother would not hear of having a coffee pot in the house. He had joined the church when I was a young child, probably to keep the peace. Anyhow, he went to the Bishop to try to get a recommend. He got it! He came home and told us that Bishop R had told him that if coffee drinking was his worst offense, he could overlook that. I was thrilled and also somewhat put out that the bishop didn't at least scold him or tell him to stop the coffee. What a deluded mormon young woman I was.

After my stint at the Bee Why, I secured a job with the fire dept. in Provo. When there was a “working fire” one of the office guys would pick up an urn of coffee at Keith’s and bring it to the fire location.
That is where I learned to love hot, black coffee.

What's wrong with caffeine?

Didn't Mormonism (secretly) (re)legalise it in late 2012? It's OKAY now but most Mormons
- and non-mormons - don't know that.

That's what Mormon (mis)leaders are saying these days. They said it was ALWAYS fine - that perhaps some members and low-level leaders were just taking it (the WOW) too far. That it was always about "hot drinks".

ONLY in Mormonism is a HOT DRINK considered a "hot drink" when it is referring to (caffeinated or uncaffeinated) COFFEE & TEA.

This rule, and assumption, doesn't apply to LDS (approved, & recommended) HOT DRINKS, like Postum, Mormon Tea, herbal tea, Hot chocolate, Raja's Cup, peppermint, camomile tea, etc., etc., etc.

HOT FOOD is fine...
Just nothing hot to wash it down with-

That means the real hot drinks, like whiskey, are best had cold.

In MORMONworld CAFFEINE is Bad and everything else for the body is Good.

Okay Mormons, Drink Up!

https://archive.sltrib.com/story.php?ref=/sltrib/news/54797595-78/church-drinks-caffeine-lds.html.csp

OK, Mormons, drink up — Coke and Pepsi are OK - Health • Church posts statement clarifying — again — that caffeinated sodas are not off-limits.