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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: October 10, 2020 03:27PM

Shout out to my fellow Canucks here (all 3? of us). Hope you have someone to celebrate with this Thanksgiving weekend, and something to celebrate.

If nothing else, I'm enjoying the fall weather: drenching rain overnight, glorious afternoon sunshine, leaves donning autumn colours, squirrels dancing through puddles.


Here's a little info on the origins and meaning of Canadian Thanksgiving (riveting, I know):


Excerpts from The Canadian Encyclopedia:

https://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/thanksgiving-day


"Indigenous peoples in North America have a history of holding communal feasts in celebration of the fall harvest that predates the arrival of European settlers. The Smithsonian Institute has noted that some First Nations “sought to insure a good harvest with dances and rituals.” The European settlers brought with them a similar tradition of harvest celebrations (for which the symbol was the cornucopia, or horn of plenty), which dates back to European peasant societies.


"The first Thanksgiving by Europeans in North America was held by Sir Martin Frobisher and his crew in the Eastern Arctic in 1578. They ate a meal of salt beef, biscuits and mushy peas to celebrate and give thanks for their safe arrival in what is now Nunavut. They celebrated Communion and formally expressed their thanks through the ship’s Chaplain, Robert Wolfall, who, according to explorer Richard Collinson, “made unto them a godly sermon, exhorting them especially to be thankefull to God for theyr strange and miraculous deliverance in those so dangerous places [sic].”


"The celebration featuring the uniquely North American turkey, squash and pumpkin was introduced to Nova Scotia in the 1750s and became common across Canada by the 1870s. In 1957, Thanksgiving was proclaimed an annual event to occur on the second Monday of October.


"The first national Thanksgiving in Canada was celebrated in the Province of Canada in 1859. It was organized at the behest of leaders of the Protestant clergy, who appropriated the holiday of American Thanksgiving, which was first observed in 1777 and established as a national day of “public thanksgiving and prayer” in 1789. In Canada, the holiday was intended for the “public and solemn” recognition of God’s mercies. As historian Peter Stevens has noted, some citizens “objected to this government request, saying it blurred the distinction between church and state that was so important to many Canadians.”

"The first Thanksgiving after Confederation was observed on 5 April 1872. A national civic holiday rather than a religious one, it was held to celebrate the recovery of the Prince of Wales (later King Edward VII) from an illness.

"Some have argued that the ceremony of giving thanks celebrated by Sir Martin Frobisher was not a “real” Thanksgiving. The argument stems from the reason for giving thanks; that the holiday can only be associated with the celebration of the harvest. Europeans who brought the tradition to North America did mark the day by giving thanks for a successful harvest.

"However, the Canadian and American holidays are no longer restricted to harvest activities, and have become a day for gathering family to give thanks for their general well-being. In that sense, one might observe that the tradition has come full circle."

-----

Yeah, now it's mostly considered a family day. This year of COVID-19 though, restrictions are in place and we are "strongly encouraged" to keep gatherings small and within our usual circles. The tempter by our PM is that if we follow COVID safety guidelines now we may be able to have a more normal Christmas (not holding my breath for that, in view of forecasts so far re 2nd/3rd waves).

But hey. We'll take what we can get. I'll be able to separately see my brother on Sunday and then sister and niece. It could always be worse. And frequently is. :/

For what are you grateful this year (which has been beyond challenging so far)?



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 10/10/2020 03:29PM by Nightingale.

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Posted by: Dave the Atheist ( )
Date: October 10, 2020 03:30PM

Somehow I don't think Canada murdered as many natives as the USA did.

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: October 10, 2020 04:57PM

I don't know numbers. But. Canadians have a lot to face up to wrt Truth and Reconciliation.

Excerpts from:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/first-nations-canada-european-settlers-diseases-killed-almost-60-genetic-study-british-columbia-a7418441.html


“Nearly six out of 10 native people living in a 9,000-year-old community in Canada died when European settlers arrived, bringing diseases to which the local people had no immunity, according to a new genetic study.

“Scientists were able to show there had been a dramatic decline in population about 175 years ago, when European diseases swept through the local population. Their findings suggested there had been a “reduction in effective population size of 57 per cent”.

“Joycelynn Mitchell, a Metlakatla woman who co-authored a paper about the research in the journal Nature Communications, said:

“First Nations history mainly consists of oral stories passed from generation to generation. She stated “Our oral history tells of the deaths of a large percentage of our population by diseases from the European settlers”. “Smallpox, for our area, was particularly catastrophic. We are pleased to have scientific evidence that corroborates our oral history.”



Excerpts from “Facing History and Ourselves”:

https://www.facinghistory.org/stolen-lives-indigenous-peoples-canada-and-indian-residential-schools/historical-background/dispossession-destruction-and-reserves


“By the 1830s and 1840s, when the colonization or settlement of the Canadian region began to shift into high gear, the European settlers pursued laws and regulations to manage the populations with whom they came into contact. The reserve was a common colonial strategy for managing the local indigenous population. Reserves existed in Africa, in the British American colonies, and in Canada, where the colonizers had to address the people they dispossessed— people who seemingly stood in the way of the political and economic plans of European settlers.

“By the nineteenth century, Indigenous Peoples in North America found themselves in a deepening crisis. They faced imminent destruction. At the arrival of Christopher Columbus, there may have lived more than 100 million indigenous people in the Americas.

“By the end of the nineteenth century, 90 to 99% of them were gone.

“Recent studies show that, contrary to the belief that Canadian expansion into the West was much less violent than that of the United States,” Canadian colonialism was quite deadly.

“In fact, many thinkers at the time noted the combined effects of European colonialism and feared that the Indigenous Peoples in Canada were marching toward extinction.

“The Indigenous Peoples in Canada were killed in the largest numbers by European diseases such as measles, smallpox, and influenza for which they had no immunity. But they also were killed by European blades and guns and factors directly connected to colonialism—land theft on a gigantic scale, forced removals, and exhaustion of natural resources. Indeed, from the 1830s onward, the indigenous groups were encouraged—at times forced—to give up their old migratory habits, settle on reserves, learn farming and trading, and receive religious instruction.

“The Crown became the trustee of indigenous lands for protection against illegal sales, poaching, and encroachment (this arrangement, however, took away the rights of Indigenous Peoples to their land; legally, it was not theirs anymore). Other laws forbade the sale of alcohol and protected reserve members from legal actions, taxes, and property seizure. By the middle of the nineteenth century, European settlers began to arrive in North America in droves. They came for gold, for the land, and for the minerals, wood, and fisheries; they no longer sought local partners or needed them.

“Nor did they have much use for the bison. James Daschuk of the University of Regina and other scholars suggest that the catastrophic destruction of Indigenous Peoples in North America reached its peak with the decision by the US and Canadian governments to clear the bison herds in the Prairies for the construction of the Canadian Pacific Railway (which was to serve as the main commercial artery to the West). By 1869, the destruction of the bison herds that the Indigenous Peoples relied on for food and other resources was almost complete.
Prime Minister Sir John A. Macdonald decided to clear the areas of the Indigenous Peoples whose land European settlers coveted.


“Moreover, “once European settlement began in earnest,” Alan McMillan and Eldon Yellowhorn write, “treaties shifted from ‘peace and friendship’ to land surrender.”

“The new treaties, signed between 1871 and 1921 and known as the Numbered Treaties, were therefore drastically different from what had come before. Europeans viewed the land as a vast empty space (in legal terms, terra nullius), ready for their taking.”

-----

And the national shame of the residential schools remains with us. Many aboriginal families are *still* searching for their missing (killed) children (who were taken by force by govt officials and deprived of their families and societies and languages, handed over to religious schools, many never to return). Mothers still search for their children's graves. It's appalling and beyond heartbreaking. One of those many things where we have to slap our foreheads and cry What the HELL were they thinking?

To know it was for (1) systemic greed and (2) warped religious beliefs is too much to bear.

So, yeah. Numbers between our two countries I don't know. But they're unbearable, either way.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/10/2020 05:01PM by Nightingale.

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: October 10, 2020 04:58PM

I just depressed the HELL out of myself. :(

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Posted by: Tevai ( )
Date: October 10, 2020 04:15PM

Happy Thanksgiving to all Canadian RfMers!!

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: October 10, 2020 04:58PM


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Posted by: Lethbridge Reprobate ( )
Date: October 12, 2020 09:35PM

thanks!

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Posted by: Lethbridge Reprobate ( )
Date: October 12, 2020 09:37PM

it occurred to me today that other than my year at Ricks this is my first Thanksgiving without my family. But got to video chat with my grandchildren so that made up for it kinda.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: October 12, 2020 11:45PM

You are at a tough age. I'm glad at least that your grands are available.

Not physically close to you, I take it.

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Posted by: Lethbridge Reprobate ( )
Date: October 13, 2020 01:18AM

270 miles away.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: October 13, 2020 04:05AM

Man, that must be tough.

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Posted by: Shinehah ( )
Date: October 10, 2020 06:54PM

I read somewhere that if studying history doesn't make you uncomfortable, you are probably only reading a sanitized version.
That is surely true for Mormon history and also the history of the Americas.

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Posted by: iceman9090 ( )
Date: October 11, 2020 01:09AM

+Shinehah:
"I read somewhere that if studying history doesn't make you uncomfortable, you are probably only reading a sanitized version.
That is surely true for Mormon history and also the history of the Americas."

==The proper way to study history is to read and LOOK at photographs and videos and then, you will vomit.
Unfortunately, photography was only invented in 1822, more or less.

~~~~iceman9090

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Posted by: Brother Of Jerry ( )
Date: October 10, 2020 09:30PM

This is the first time in 20-some years I have not gone to Winnipeg for Canadian Thanksgiving. Thanks to all the people exercising their right to stand up to public health tyranny, basically nobody in the US is allowed to travel to much of the rest of the world. A US passport is not worth a plugged nickel these days.

Gee, thanks, mask-free people.

I am going to check the local grocery to see if they have fresh cranberries yet. Symbolic gestures will be made. :)

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: October 10, 2020 09:39PM

Go for it BoJ.

You could always go to Peace Arch Park if you get desperate for your Canadian fix. Apparently there's a bit of a loophole there.

Sorry about Winnie though. Quel disappointing mais oui?

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Posted by: Brother Of Jerry ( )
Date: October 10, 2020 10:28PM

Oui. But life will go on.

I heard about the Peace Arch loophole, though you still can't technically cross the border, just get right up next to it.

And the Americans living on Point Roberts can't get to the mainland (easily), and Canadians with summer cottages there can't get on. They too are collateral damage.

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Posted by: looking in ( )
Date: October 10, 2020 10:53PM

The 63 or so people in Hyder Alaska, on the border with BC, are also in a bad way. It’s pretty much isolated from the rest of Alaska, and aside from the local pub the village has very little in terms of basic services - no gas station, grocery store, etc. It’s 3 kilometres from Stewart BC, and normally the residents freely travelled between the two communities. Now Stewart residents can’t go to Hyder, and Hyder residents are allowed only an hour or two a week to go into Stewart to shop for necessities. The few kids that live in Hyder have to do distance learning, even though the elementary school in Stewart would welcome them. The mayors of both communities are petitioning the US and Canadian governments to let them become a “bubble”until Covid is under control - a sort of international free zone.

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Posted by: looking in ( )
Date: October 10, 2020 10:33PM

Happy Thanksgiving to my fellow Canadians! For the first time in my life, we are having ham instead of turkey for our meal. Feels weird, but I guess turkey is a tradition, not a law.

It also feels really strange because of Covid. We are spending the day with our kids and grandkids. There will be 14 of us, which is under our chief medical officer’s recommendation of a cap of 15 people. And we’ll try to be outside as much as possible too, so thank goodness we have been having a nice Fall! So much more complicated this year!

I’ll close with my favourite Thanksgiving line from that wonderful show “WKRP In Cincinnati”:

“As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly!”

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: October 11, 2020 12:40AM

Sounds like fun, looking in. Enjoy!

> “As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly!”

My dad nearly strangled himself he laughed so hard at that line. Thanks for the good memory.

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Posted by: moremany ( )
Date: October 11, 2020 01:24AM

looking in Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> “As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly!”
>

Well, they can, sort of... okay, they probably flap their wings.

I grew up in the southern United States and a strange tradition they had in this little town was to throw (LIVE) turkeys off the roof of grocery store and people would shoot at them. I suppose if you shot one you got to keep it. Chances are, most people probably shot up.

Now I think they just give them away or sell them. They probably can't buy anything though. They're dead!

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Posted by: Dave the Atheist ( )
Date: October 11, 2020 01:36AM

Where I live I have wild turkeys and they can fly.

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Posted by: moremany ( )
Date: October 11, 2020 04:40AM

Wild Turkey eh?
That's wild!

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: October 11, 2020 03:36PM

In the TV episode mentioned above, they threw the turkeys out of an airplane. They didn't mean them harm (hence: "I thought turkeys could fly"). Yes, they can, but not far that height apparently!

It's a case of you had to be there, I guess. It was funny at the time.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: October 11, 2020 04:46AM

looking in Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Happy Thanksgiving to my fellow Canadians! For the
> first time in my life, we are having ham instead
> of turkey for our meal.

Turkey? For holiday meals ham is the superior bird.

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Posted by: moremany ( )
Date: October 11, 2020 01:15AM

Happy Thanksgiving Canadians... and

Happy Halloween Americans... (every day now)

Happy singing... and
Happy feasting everyone

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: October 11, 2020 08:13AM

Happy Thanksgiving to our Canadian friends! I see that you have a Monday holiday this year.

If my school district sends me back to school before the U.S. Thanksgiving, I will likely be spending the holiday on my own. It would be too chancy in terms of possibly bringing the virus home to my loved ones. At least for Christmas, there is some hope that I could be tested in time for the holiday.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/11/2020 08:13AM by summer.

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Posted by: Human ( )
Date: October 11, 2020 11:05AM

EXPLAINING "CANADIAN" THANKSGIVING TO AMERICANS

https://twitter.com/brittlestar/status/1314930318797942787?s=20

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Posted by: Lethbridge Reprobate ( )
Date: October 11, 2020 12:14PM

Thank you and back at you Nightingale. My family has always celebrated Thanksgiving as an end of harvest day of thanks...and hoping our harvest is actually completed.

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: October 11, 2020 03:39PM

I was thinking of you, LR - meant to mention your name.

Sounds like you're with the original spirit.

I agree the history and origins are murky. But we weren't there and weren't personally responsible. All we can do is strive to make changes for the better while acknowledging past harms. At least, I don't see any other way to proceed.

Meanwhile, it's a family day, for those fortunate enough to be able to get together (carefully and sparingly in the Year of COVID). And that is cause for celebration.

Hope you all have a good one, as far as able.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/11/2020 03:40PM by Nightingale.

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Posted by: Lethbridge Reprobate ( )
Date: October 11, 2020 04:43PM

I am alone this weekend...the world and hockey practice got in the way..but we do lots of webcam sessions so I'm good.

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: October 11, 2020 05:26PM

Oh, I just mentioned you on another thread re trusting you are with family/friends.

My plans just got scuppered too. I was supposed to meet my sister and niece for mid-afternoon turkey dinner but with short notice they've cancelled. It's pouring with rain (no surprise in this neck of the woods in October) and sis doesn't feel like venturing out. I'm disappointed but I understand. She's in a wheelchair so every adventure is exponentially more difficult for her.

Now I have to rustle up something else to save the day. But still, with all the losses in life weighing heavier on holidays, as always, there are plenty of things to be grateful for, I find.

Yeah, the computer age helps compensate for a lot.

Happy, happy, anyway, no matter what...

I have found that once the worst happens, nothing else can be the worst. So that's comforting in a teeny tiny way, sometimes.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/11/2020 05:27PM by Nightingale.

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: October 11, 2020 05:39PM

Hi Tom.

I saw your (now expunged) question about Canadian Thanksgiving on Richard's thread. I was going to respond here anyway because, as you indicated, I didn't want to take up Richard's thread with a totally different topic.

In my opening post on this thread and in subsequent responses, some features of Cdn Thanksgiving are outlined.

Here are some more excerpts from a couple of articles for you:

For a brief overview:

https://www.timeanddate.com/holidays/canada/thanksgiving-day

Excerpt:

“Thanksgiving Day in Canada is linked to the European tradition of harvest festivals. A common image seen at this time of year is a cornucopia, or horn, filled with seasonal fruit and vegetables. The cornucopia, which means "Horn of Plenty" in Latin, was a symbol of bounty and plenty in ancient Greece. Turkeys, pumpkins, ears of corn and large displays of food are also used to symbolize Thanksgiving Day.”


A second article (no offence meant to Americans with one of the comments - kind of tongue in cheek):

https://time.com/4971309/canadian-thanksgiving-2017-history/

Excerpt:

“Between turkey dinners and family reunions, Canadian Thanksgiving — which falls on Monday — can look pretty similar to its U.S. counterpart. But in fact, part of the reason Canadians first petitioned for the holiday was to celebrate their luck at not being American.

“Though Canada does have a first Thanksgiving story analogous to the U.S. story of the feast at Plymouth in 1621 — it involves the pirate/explorer Martin Frobisher giving thanks in 1578 for a safe journey, and is likewise highly mythologized — the official holiday got its start in the 19th century.

“In the wake of a crisis of faith catalyzed by Charles Darwin’s On the Origin of Species, Canada’s Protestant ministers began in 1859 to petition the colonial government for an official day to thank God, pointing to the bountiful harvests as proof that God exists, says historian Peter A. Stevens. But over the next decade, they found a reason to be even more grateful: they were spared the bloodshed of the U.S. Civil War. The thanksgiving days that the government proclaimed during that era were highly religious, with newspapers printing the Thanksgiving sermons the following day.

“[Thanksgiving] was a solemn, holy day in the middle of the week when people would go to church,” he says, “and thank God for how fortunate they are to be Canadian.”

“But Canadians were still hashing out what it even meant to be Canadian. “Canada was about to become a separate country from Great Britain,” he explains. Therefore, so making the holiday into a “Protestant nationalist celebration” was the ministers’ way of creating something to help Canada craft a national identity. (Another holiday, Canada Day on July 1, celebrates the creation of Dominion of Canada, when the British North America Act united the British provinces of New Brunswick, Nova Scotia, Quebec and Ontario.)

“But the “Protestant” part of the national celebration soon started to lose its dominance. … Soon, celebrants looked for a way to turn the time after church into more of a party. They found a blueprint, ironically, in the very place that had caused them to celebrate not being there: as the idea of a national Thanksgiving spread in the U.S. too, Canadian families got the idea for hosting a harvest feast after reading how Americans celebrated the holiday in readily-accessible U.S. newspapers and magazines. …

“In the years since, the early-autumn timing has been a boon. With the holiday now detached from its religious beginnings, most Canadians think of it as a time to savor the last mild weather before the northern winter starts.”

-----

So it's been distilled down to family, food and fun in the sun (ha! today it's drenching rain and dark skies already at only 2:33 p.m.).

Still, it's the thought that counts, as they say. My thanksgiving day just abruptly changed. I have to go and scrounge dinner somewhere now, unexpectedly, as my plans fell through at the last minute. Still, with the emphasis on thanks, it's hard to get grumpy. I might manage it though, haha.

A bonus is day off work tomorrow. We sure love our abundant long weekends around here. And we deserve them. :)

If I can't be having fun in Paris, Tom, I have to look for it elsewhere. But one of these fine days I'm due another visit. Everybody should get to go to Paris twice in a lifetime.

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Posted by: kerri ( )
Date: October 12, 2020 07:14PM

I made a pumpkin pie to celebrate Canadian Thanksgiving. This was not easy as canned pumpkin does not exist here (NZ), and not being autumn here, fresh pumpkin is not in season. But it looks very yummy and will be a special dessert for our household of dual citizenship. :-)

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: October 12, 2020 07:17PM

Oh, now you've got me craving a piece. That's missing from our table this year. Enjoy!

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Posted by: Brother Of Jerry ( )
Date: October 12, 2020 09:49PM

I have a killer cranberry sauce recipe and the local grocery has fresh berries on the shelves, so that was my bit of Thanksgiving for the day.

The recipe calls for a half bottle of Zinfandel, so I double it and freeze it. There is enough alcohol and sugar, that it doesn't freeze, it goes to firm mush. Yummy.

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: October 12, 2020 11:05PM

Firm mush does sound distinctly yummy. :p

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Posted by: Greyfort ( )
Date: October 12, 2020 11:43PM

Happy Thanksgiving! :o)

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Posted by: GNPE ( )
Date: October 13, 2020 04:03AM

Do Canadian use a metric Calendar?

How about a metric clock?

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Posted by: iceman9090 ( )
Date: October 13, 2020 11:27PM

+GNPE:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metric_system

Canadians typically use the SI/MKS system.

"Do Canadian use a metric Calendar?"

==No.
I've never heard of it. Is that a calendar with 10 months and something like 36 days per month?

"How about a metric clock?"

==No.
I've seen a photo of such a watch. It was a analog watch.

Canadians use the Celsius for temperature, unless if you are an oldy from the 60s and before that.
Food stores sometimes write both pound and kg. Sometimes one or the other.
Liquids are always in mL or L. For example, they sell paint as 3.98 L. I'm guessing the manufacturer can't make 4 L buckets. They can only make 1 gallon buckets and they stamp 3.98 L on the sticker.
For a long while, I wondered why cola cans were 355 mL and why acetone cans were 946 mL.

As for the construction industry, they use the english system. They even sell muriatic acid instead of labeling it hydrochloric acid.

Some people still call graphite pencils ==> lead pencils.
Some call road reflectors ==> phosphors.

I think we should respect each other's customs, even if your customs are stupid ridiculous garbage.

~~~~iceman9090

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