So, I know about the whole "fence sitting" thing and winding up with the curse of cain if you weren't "valiant" in the preexistence.
But does the impact of your behavior and "valiancy" in the preexistence extend beyond that? I vaguely remember people talking about it also affecting whether you're BiC, for example, and otherwise impacting the sort of family one is born into.
For example, my poor TBM brother is stuck trying to influence a family of wretched gentile siblings. Our oldest brother is Catholic. I'm not religious. Our half-sister has all sorts of problems, including a lengthy rap sheet, etc.
I guess what I'm really wondering is if it's his own fault that he was born into such a horrible gentile family, and had to convert to TSCC rather than being born into it?
> But does the impact of your > behavior and "valiancy" in > the preexistence extend be- > yond that? I vaguely remem- > ber people talking about it > also affecting whether you > are BiC, for example, and > otherwise impacting the sort > of family one is born into.
Early morning Seminary, 1959-1962. We delved into the mysteries, cuz it broke up the monotony!
It made sense that being BIC was a reward and that being born in a third world poop-hole, like Idaho, was the result of not being as valiant as the BIC kids were.
Idaho is the only place I know where a massive budget surplus of over 200 million is a sign of terrific money management rather than a sign of over taxation.
In the 1960s this was common knowledge, exemplified most plainly by Alvin R. Dyer (https://www.mrm.org/for-what-purpose-dyer). Yes it was taught throughout the church that there was a ranking system in the pre-earth life and that that ranking was continued in mortality. It led directly to the Saturday's Warrior doctrine that we all chose our families before we were born.
But now of course the church never taught that and those who say they did are vile apostates.
These beliefs that called the whole black race "fence sitters" (and thus were cursed with a black skin by god) and that said that one person's start in life was better or worse than others because of what they did in the pre-existance were real Mormon beliefs up until just a few years ago when the church dis-avowed them in their published essays after being being publicly shamed about them for decades after the wide adoption of the internet. The mormon church now dis-avows these beliefs as the theories that were circulated by some members in the past.
From what I have read from materials published by church leaders in the past and having lived in the mormon culture of the past decades myself, I can tell you that the Mormon church really did practice institutionalized racism up until just recently. These beliefs were doctrines of the church. The Church benefitted from the promotion of these racist beliefs, and could have put an end to them, but instead embraced them as gospel. In the Mormon church of 1980 that I lived in, anyone who called Brigham Young a false prophet or who called Joseph Smith a child molester found their fast-track to excommunication. But if you said that God has cursed the whole black race with black skin so that others could identify them as sinners from the pre-existance, you were simply teaching church doctrine. We were taught to feel sorry for them the same way that Jesus had pity on the adulterous woman. But non the less, they were ostracised and prohibited from anything other than being baptized. All other (so-called) blessings of Mormonism were withheld from them. They couldn't go through the temple, serve on missions, nor hold the priesthood. Without these things in Mormonism, you're a nobody and can't even affiliate in ninety percent of the things that Mormons value the most. No one in their right mind would ever choose to affiliate with any organization that treated them that way. And that was just fine with the church and it's members because they didn't any black people in their congregations anyway.
No one is cursed before their birth and no child is responsible for any bad circumstances they end up in. Shame on the Mormon church for teaching otherwise. But different people handle bad circumstances differently. This doesn't make them more good or bad. Some people are just better at surviving than others are. Some people get a better start than others. I was raised under conditions that are probably worse than anyone else here has seen, based on what I have ever read here in this forum. Most people who go through what I went through as a child never live a normal life afterward. I haven't even discussed the worst of it here on this forum yet, but plan to eventually. I am currently stepping backward chronologically through my life as I work on recovery still in my late fifties. Last year, even my last therapist was visibly shocked when I told her the worst of it. She didn't seem shocked by what happened to me. I think she hears a fair amount of what I described to her since that is what she does for a living. She seemed shocked more by the fact that I appear to be having a normal life afterward. My younger brother wasn't so fortunate and died over twenty years ago of a drug overdose of illegal drugs, after decades of struggle as an adult and never thriving. So you have to just do the best you can with what you start from. But no one was cursed by god before their birth and then born in to a dis-advantaged situation as a result.
It is NOT THE PREEXISTENCE IT IS THE PRE MORTAL EXISTENCE this is a commonly mis-stated thing
Gordon B. Stinky Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > So, I know about the whole "fence sitting" thing > and winding up > with the curse of cain if you weren't "valiant" in > the preexistence. > > But does the impact of your behavior and > "valiancy" in the > preexistence extend beyond that? I vaguely > remember people > talking about it also affecting whether you're > BiC, for example, > and otherwise impacting the sort of family one is > born into. > > For example, my poor TBM brother is stuck trying > to influence a > family of wretched gentile siblings. Our oldest > brother is > Catholic. I'm not religious. Our half-sister has > all sorts of > problems, including a lengthy rap sheet, etc. > > I guess what I'm really wondering is if it's his > own fault that > he was born into such a horrible gentile family, > and had to > convert to TSCC rather than being born into it?
I've said this before, but Thomas Mann wrote that "life is a species of death."
What he meant is that atoms and molecules arrange themselves in all sorts of different ways. The vast majority of those are not "animate" in any way, but a small minority are what we call alive. Even in those cases, however, life is a transitory state that quickly returns to inanimate form.
If that is correct, then life is a transitory form of organization among dead elements. From ashes to ashes, from dust to dust.
Lot's Wife Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Proof is so 20th century. In the Brave New World > truth is whatever a large number of people want it > to be. >
Truth is whatever the tech titans want us to believe.
Without social media and their immunity to suit for defamation, QAnon and Trumpism would never have put down roots. Letting people like Mark Zuckerberg avoid responsibility for the proper functioning of their business models is absurd. Subject the tech giants to the same laws as other publishers, the same liability, and the lies would have gained far less currency.
Deep state this, deep state that. The jargon is just a way of evoking emotion as a substitute for reason.
My view is that a single rule should apply to all information: if it is true, no problem; if it is false, the publisher is liable for the consequences just like newspapers or book companies. So I say make Zuckerberg and the others liable and let the chips fall as they may.
You, however, appear to think that lies and their consequences are okay if the speaker is politically correct. You do just what you accuse others of doing.
It explains away inequities, and even better conveniently justifies the total abdication of humanitarianism.
I may walk past suffering shielded and justified in righteousness.
I am righteously justified in racism; in building malls instead of hospitals; in the greed of 100 billion.
For all the faults of Catholicism, I respect them for building non-profit hospitals serving poor communities (good training ones, too), educational institutions, and engaging in vast worldwide humanitarian efforts. By their fruits . . .
Not sure if the Catholics endorse a preexistance. But if so, it's not employed as a weapon justifying inhumanity
The Rambo film franchise has been sent back in time to be used as training films in the pre-existence. Yes, you too can come out of the mud to knife Lucifer’s followers provided you were born after the film career of Sylvester Stallone. Don’t want to get that dirty? Exploding arrowheads are also valiant. Also hit the Nautilus equipment hard, you’ll want to look Nephite buff as you take out fallen angels in creative and gruesome ways.
War in Heaven? Valiant? Pass the doobie, man. Or maybe that’s what happened so there you are in Idaho.
Or, maybe it’s the biggest crock of sh*t ever invented.