If so, who?
Why?

Is there a person (alive or dead) who you think comes closest to the Übermensch?

“the ideal superior man of the future who could rise above conventional Christian morality to create and impose his own values, originally described by Nietzsche in Thus Spake Zarathustra (1883–85).”

Thank you,

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%9Cbermensch

Übermensch as a goal for humanity to set for itself. The Übermensch represents a shift from otherworldly Christian values and manifests the grounded human ideal.

This-worldliness
Nietzsche introduces the concept of the Übermensch in contrast to his understanding of the other-worldliness of Christianity: Zarathustra proclaims the will of the Übermensch to give meaning to life on earth, and admonishes his audience to ignore those who promise other-worldly fulfillment to draw them away from the earth. The turn away from the earth is prompted, he says, by a dissatisfaction with life that causes the sufferer to imagine another world which will fulfill his revenge. The Übermensch grasps the earthly world with relish and gratitude.

Zarathustra declares that the Christian escape from this world also required the invention of an immortal soul separate from the earthly body. This led to the abnegation and mortification of the body, or asceticism. Zarathustra further links the Übermensch to the body and to interpreting the soul as simply an aspect of the body."

Death of God and the creation of new values
Zarathustra ties the Übermensch to the death of God. While the concept of God was the ultimate expression of other-worldly values and their underlying instincts, belief in God nevertheless did give meaning to life for a time. "God is dead" means that the idea of God can no longer provide values. Nietzsche refers to this crucial paradigm shift as a reevaluation of values. According to Nietzsche, the moral doctrine of Catholicism had become outdated. With the sole source of values exhausted, the danger of nihilism looms.

Zarathustra presents the Übermensch as the creator of new values to banish nihilism. If the Übermensch acts to create new values within the moral vacuum of nihilism, there is nothing that this creative act would not justify. Alternatively, in the absence of this creation, there are no grounds upon which to criticize or justify any action, including the particular values created and the means by which they are promulgated.

In order to avoid a relapse into Platonic idealism or asceticism, the creation of these new values cannot be motivated by the same instincts that gave birth to those tables of values. Instead, they must be motivated by a love of this world and of life. Whereas Nietzsche diagnosed the Christian value system as a reaction against life and hence destructive in a sense, the new values which the Übermensch will be responsible for will be life-affirming and creative. Through realizing this new set of values, the Übermensch is perfect because they have mastered all human obstacles."

The Cat, using your own words, can you define the good ol' Ubermensch?

What are the qualities you've adopted into your skillset that have advanced you on your path to Ubermensch-hood?

Do you think you'll ever make it to full Ubermensch-hood?

I think the closest thing we have today is the Dude Jeffry Lebowski.
I’m a Dudeist Priest with my own religion
Buddyism, with me and My buddy, Buddy.
It’s a 501c3 Religion, so say you are my buddy, you send me a “tithe” of anywhere above 10% of your gross, not net, and you get to write it off as a ‘’charitable donation’ on your taxes and I don’t have to claim it as income because The Dude abides!

If I'm on the correct track, you're your own hero?

Is it okay for the rest of us to have different heros?

Yes, it's why I asked,
I am just curious about who people's heroes are, intellectually, who they learn the most from, IOW, who's closest to an example of an ubermensch, in your opinion, living or dead?

To me, living it'd be the list of my heroes above.

I am nobody.
I don't even exist,
unless you observe me.
Then I exist
temporarily

then i don't

schrodingerscat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> . . . intellectually, who they learn the most from, IOW,
> who's closest to an example of an ubermensch . . .

So your Ubermensch is whom you learn the most from?

That's interesting but--I guess this goes without saying--it's not at all what Nietzsche had in mind.

What if platonic ideals are baked into the fabric of reality, waiting to be discovered? These values are not manufactured, they are pre-existing. That would make Jesus an ubermensch.

Then Christianity or any religion based on revelation of an enlightened master is a means for average humans to also be ubermenchen.

Plato woulda loved Buckys truncated icosohedral Balls!

I can't believe how many people who believe they are "superior" also believe that because they are superior, it is okay for them to kill people who are inferior.

Lori Vallow and Chad Daybell come to mind.

But there was also a case recently in my neck of the woods, where an intelligent, handsome young VT student decided to kill a mentally retarded young lady who had a crush on him. He just wanted to see what it felt like to kill someone, and anyway, no one would miss this mentally retarded girl, who was so much his inferior.

I am happy to report that was not the case, and he was arrested THE NEXT DAY, and convicted and sent to prison shortly thereafter.

It seems that even though he thought of himself as being a criminal genius, he couldn't plan "the perfect crime" after all. GPS tracking, security cameras and all the rest of forensic science did him in.

I guess he was so busy studying, he didn't have a chance to watch the True Crime Channel, or who would know never to shop at Wal-Mart and buy bleach and garbage bags -- at least not the day before the crime.

Now here is my thinking. If you truly 100 percent believed that you were superior to everyone else, wouldn't that mean that you had a positive duty to help other people instead of a license to kill them?

And if EVERYONE in a society is "superior" who is going to do the manual labor that gets us all from one day to the next? Tedious, tiresome manual labor is VERY important, no matter what the IQ of the person doing it is.

As for who is a hero -- the problem is most true heroes don't broadcast their heroicness for all the world to praise.

They just go about their business, try to do good in the world, don't make a big deal about it, and don't let other people make a big deal of it. In their view, they are just being human. They are just being what everybody should strive to be.

I am 100 percent convinced there are true heroes out there, quietly trying to make the world a better place.

Ms. L. Lane,

I submit for your review the Sci/Fi novella "The Marching Morons", by Frederich Kornbluth. It first appeared in a 1951 (yes, 1951) Galaxy Magazine.

The premise is that Superior Beings recognize a duty to their inferiors (which possibly explains why The Cat labors so intensely here...) and that in the future the division between Superior and Inferior Beings will widen to such an extent that without the aid of the Superiors, the Inferiors would ... suffer.

But then the burden becomes excessive! The Inferiors breed lie mormons of old, and as the story opens, the Superiors are being stressed to their limits to sustain and support the Inferiors!!

Kornbluth's solution in the novella is suggested to the Superiors by a Real Estate agent from 'the old days'...

I shan't live to see what the Superiors of today's society will come up with, but I suspect that their solution(s) will involve turning this, that, and the other sub-set of Inferiors against each other.

It's just too easy to sell the notion that the Inferiors are fouling things up.

But then what's to stop each group from declaring itself a group of Superiors?

The more we have, the more people will want. Populations will grow and ALL the things enclosed in the term "population pressures" will be made manifest, including a lot of things we can't even imagine right now.


ETA this link to the novella: https://www.gutenberg.org/files/51233/51233-h/51233-h.htm



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/23/2021 07:31PM by elderolddog.

If the "superiors" of today are those idiots in Silicone Valley and the "inferiors" are the desperate souls at the boarder, I say let the so-called inferiors have it.

They will be better at surviving without computers and cellphones and all the latest tech toys somebody is trying to convince us we can't do without.

Mebbe that is what Jesus meant when he said "The meek will inherit the earth."

Although the awful truth is the world would be better off without the human race, no matter how they are ranked.

Anyway, who gets to decide who is an S and who is an "I"?

Why whoever has the power, of course!

When I was young I thought reading a lot of books would make me "superior."

I am happy to say that over the years I have overcome that notion, but I still read a lot.

As Holden Caulfield said, "I'm basically illiterate but I read a lot."

So who on earth is "the superior person," and is the "hero" a superior person?

I still say the true heroes in this world are people who no one has ever heard of.

Mebbe because it never occurs to any true hero to hire a good PR agent?



Lois

P.S. I'll check out your story.

Regarding the answers to your questions, hopefully, The Cat will answer them for you. It's part of his charm...

TLDR

My Pop.

Most definitely. Dr. Anthony Fauci, the voice of truth and sanity during the pandemic. And Greta Thunberg, the young, courageous warrior for Mother Earth. And English isn't even her first language, which boggles my mind even more.

No.

My daughter in law, who is an RN and has been working the Covid front line for 18 months.

This. Risking her own life for others. She has my blessing and mine are good ones.

Just my Dad. I miss him.

Nope. All gone!
Why?

No comparison.

You?

Lots of them:

Living

Jane Goodall
Greta Tunberg
My Mother
My Daughter
My Sisters
My wife

Almost died because of it,

Malala
Ayan Hirsi Ali
Hazard Stevens

Died because of it:

MLK
Gandhi
Socrates

Dead:
My Father
Epicurus

Because they all had the courage to speak truth to power under extraordinary opposition.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/23/2021 02:35PM by schrodingerscat.

Why didn't you say in the beginning?
Hope that's your short list. ;)
(It is a start) Hopefully you have more-

I don't hero anyone, but simply admire some various folks for their human or commUNITY achievements, tenacity, bravery, challenges, humanity, truths and/ or stories, experiences, information, vision(s) (not including anyone or anything Mormon, because they have PROVEN so untrustworthy, co-opted, and unbelievable)

Take Arundati Roy, for example... Oh India, America, and the world!

Ken Saro-wiwa - Kenule Beeson "Ken" Saro-Wiwa was a Nigerian writer, television producer, environmental activist. Saro-Wiwa was a member of the Ogoni people, an ethnic minority in Nigeria whose homeland, Ogoniland, in the Niger Delta has been targeted for crude oil extraction since the 1950s and which has suffered extreme environmental damage from decades of indiscriminate petroleum waste dumping. Initially as spokesperson, and then as president, of the Movement for the Survival of the Ogoni People, Saro-Wiwa led a nonviolent campaign against environmental degradation of the land and waters of Ogoniland by the operations of the multinational petroleum industry, especially the Royal Dutch Shell company. He is also known as a critic of the Nigerian government, for its allegedly reluctant behavior to enforce environmental regulations on the foreign petroleum companies operating in the area.

Wangari Maathai, 'The Woman Of Trees' (She mobilized Kenyans, particularly women, to plant more than 30 million trees, and inspired the United Nations to launch a campaign that has led to the planting of 11 billion trees worldwide ...)

Or Eddie snow den, who is snowed in
It was really a blizzard, he exposed
People weren't supposed to know.....
He's the star of the show, you know-

There's always ♡ Bob Marley ☆

What a man! A 》legend《 A realist~
I've seen the illustrious Wailers (sans dear Robert Nesta Marley) with the "I Threes", Sister Carol, Rita Marley, and Marcia Griffiths, as well as in solo performances, usually in SLC front in the eighties+ (along with many other reggae, ska, African, folk, rock and roll, world, edm and everything else music shows, from then to now)... the late [2021] great Lee "Scratch" Perry, who initially produced BMW (Bob Marley and the Wailers)...

PS- I could think of many more, but, according to time, I'm out of it.

Many you-others may not know. We all have 'heros' that speak to us but that are not that well known to others.

I like - and loved, though I never met him - a late, GREAT hero and regional champion in and of New Orlean's area communities' Immediate HELP and Recovery (and bullhorn) about widespread looting and the destruction, and response, after hurricane Katrina, in 2005... Malik Rahim, who founded the Common Ground Collective.

An American housing and prison activist, in 2005 Rahim gained national publicity as a community organizer in New Orleans- to combat the widespread destruction in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina.

I first learned of him/ the story on Democracy Now, where I've learned of a few more heros, like the lead reporter herself - and much more - and host, Amy Goodman. I met her when she spoke at Town Hall in Seattle some time ago.. I also like Jeremy Scahill (Great reporter and investigative journalist)... ART BELL (Coast To Coast), Orson Welles...

Some heros I've found on Story Corps https://storycorps.org/ - recording people's stories (forever), stored at The Library of Congress. "Our mission is to preserve and share humanity’s stories in order to build connections between people and create a more just and compassionate world." Some great, everyday heros I've discovered at Storycorps over the years. Worth listens

Rachel Carson
Mark Twain
Woody Guthrie

[America's - and the world's- heroes!]

There are thousands
This is an abrvtd list

List list goes on...
As well, I must~

M@t

Cool, yeah, that's what I was looking for, answers to the question, not criticism of people I have long considered heroes of mine, in some cases, my whole life, like Jane Goodall, who I learned about when I was 3 years old, while attending college lectures on anthropology with my Mom, who was still in college at the time with her kids in tow.
All of my Sisters remember the same lectures vividly.
She is still, 56 years later, advocating for our closest cousins in the animal world, the Chimpanzees and Bonobos. And she is still giving the world hope, in a time of deep divisions.

https://www.npr.org/2021/10/18/1046952409/jane-goodalls-the-book-of-hope-explains-how-hope-can-grow-with-action

"Well, let me back off a bit by saying that if we all lose hope, we're doomed. ... I've met so many people who don't have hope, who say they feel helpless and hopeless. And I say to them, "Well, that's because we're always being told think globally, act locally." But quite honestly, if you think globally you're just so depressed.
I mean, every day we're bombarded with bad news socially, politically, environmentally, but turn it the other way around, something that you feel, "I'd like to do something about this." And either you or, hopefully, you and some friends get together and start doing something and you find you make a difference. And then you realize that, well, in other parts of the world, people are feeling like you, are doing like you because they are being advised to take local action, and you've made a difference so you want to do more. And that's inspiring other people. So it's an upward spiral like this, of growing hope with action.

So for me, hope isn't just something where you sit back and say, "Oh, I hope everything will be OK." No, I don't look at the world through rose- colored spectacles. We've got to work to make what we hope for, happen."

Heroes, plenty..
Why wouldn't someone wish to maybe stand on the shoulders of giants to try and gain a somewhat better view?

Sorry, what is the stupid reason for saying, "now" because I don't change from day to day very much or did you think perhaps I do?

I don't think they think. I think they just wonder now.

Now that you no longer worship heroes, like Joseph’s Myth.

schrodingerscat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Now that you no longer worship SC's hero, even
> Joseph’s Myth.


Sounds like the devil himself told Joseph Smith to tell you to say that. What a fool. Why don't you stop?

Bullying hasn't a place here.
At least it shouldn't.

Kindness Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> schrodingerscat Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Now that you no longer worship SC's hero, even
> > Joseph’s Myth.
>

I didn't write that. Quit putting words in my mouth.

> Sounds like the devil himself told Joseph Smith to
> tell you to say that. What a fool. Why don't you
> stop?

I didn't say that. You did.

>
> Bullying hasn't a place here.

Oh, but making false accusations with no basis in reality does have a place here?

> At least it shouldn't.

I don't believe in 'shouldn't'.
There is no such thing as 'shouldn't'.

But you're the only one bullying.
I just asked if you had any heroes now that you no longer subscribe to Joseph's Myth.

Apparently that's a bad assumption, since you believe in Joseph's Myth? How sweet.

Keep sweet!

> schrodingerscat Wrote:
> > Now that we no longer worship Joseph’s Myth.
>

I wrote that. Quick, pull words out of my mouth.

... Joseph Smith wanted somebody to say that. What a fool. I didn't say that. I wish I did.

Bullying … changing what people say, putting words into others mouths, making false accusations with a basis in reality doesn't have a place here. At least it shouldn't.

I believe in 'shouldn't'.
There is such a thing as 'shouldn't'. There shouldn't be!

I just asked if you had any heroes now that I no longer subscribe to Joseph's Myth.

Apparently that's a bad assumption, since I believe in Joseph's Myth. Hog sweat. Keep sweep!

Blah Blah Blah - quoting Gretta Thunburg…

Greta Thunberg’s “Blah, Blah, Blah” Speech On Climate Crisis Hits a Nerve

https://greekreporter.com/2021/10/01/greta-thunberg-blah-blah-blah-speech-climate-crisis/

Sep 28, 2021

Build back better, blah, blah, blah. Green economy, blah, blah, blah," Thunberg said. "Net zero, blah, blah, blah. Climate neutral, blah, blah, blah. This is all we hear from our so-called leaders …

So, let's be nice, not call names, accuse, or belittle. Nobody likes Joseph Smith, but maybe mormons. We aren't LDS. Keep the facts straight.

Some are moving on
While others spin their wheels

They might change day-to-day and so figured you might too.

They also figure since they worship/ worshipped JS, Jr., (as a "hero" [he wrote that]) that you once did too.

Speculation, and assumptions.
Looking to criticize, argue, assume.

Simple as that

There are people whom I admire, but I don't regard them as heroes. I admire those people for their strength of character and their accomplishments. OTOH they are merely human like the rest of us, and likely have some all too human failings. This is why I don't like to put people up on a pedestal.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/23/2021 02:01PM by summer.

No. But if I happen on one, I'm sending him to Bonnie Tyler.

My kid. She just got her commercial pilots license and aviation degree, will be a Delta pilot next year!

*likes emoji*

Oh, wonderful! That was my childhood ambition, but back in those days your ambitions were toast if you didn't have good vision, so I moved on to other things. Congratulations to your daughter! (...and enjoy those family travel benefits!)

Thanks. I already have those bennies. Wife is a Delta F/A. That's what got my daughter into flying. She's been to 6 continents before she was 14. She stated that she will always travel. We told her you better be a millionaire, marry one, or get in the airline biz. Best part is that she had a full ride volleyball scholarship to a top notch Aviation college. You can tell that I'm proud of her!

Certainly Malala Yusufzai (Tribe-of-Joseph).

Martin Luther King, Jr.

Marie Curie

Tsakigawias (Okay, then, "Sacajawea." I live in the PNW, so she's a pretty solid hero here.)

Elanor Roosevelt

And way to many people to list, most of them women or people of color--the Harriet Tubmans and Sojourner Truths.

cludgie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Certainly Malala Yusufzai (Tribe-of-Joseph).
>
> Martin Luther King, Jr.
>
> Marie Curie
>
> Tsakigawias (Okay, then, "Sacajawea." I live in
> the PNW, so she's a pretty solid hero here.)
>
> Elanor Roosevelt
>
> And way to many people to list, most of them women
> or people of color--the Harriet Tubmans and
> Sojourner Truths.

And you live near Lake Sacajawea, right?

Place with the giant Squirrel?

Yes! Was it you who told me once that they knew the place?

Don't you be sayin nothing bad 'bout no squirrels. I, sir, am an avowed squirrel lover, which is part of the reason I stay in this smelly and failing mill town. It's a place where even the local red-necks like the tiny rodents. And besides, we're all lit up with beautiful colors right now, which compete with the Northeast.

cludgie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes! Was it you who told me once that they knew
> the place?
>
> Don't you be sayin nothing bad 'bout no squirrels.
> I, sir, am an avowed squirrel lover, which is part
> of the reason I stay in this smelly and failing
> mill town. It's a place where even the local
> red-necks like the tiny rodents. And besides,
> we're all lit up with beautiful colors right now,
> which compete with the Northeast.

Yes I worked there for a few years, on a school by Lake Sacajawea, a house for the old train near the giant squirrel and the squirrel bridge. I also worked on a history Museum for the Port of Kalama, that's pretty cool.

I still work with the Port of Kalama, only slightly different capacity, for our State on Covid response.

I'd love to meet you. Do you do beer? I know they got beer in Kalama somewhere. Could you contact admin for my e-mail address? They might give you my Italian address, which is still active.

"Not your ordinary small-town rabbi"

An example of what can happen to a Jewish kid who is too smart for his own good.

We met an elderly couple having a picnic, with wine, cheese and smoked salmon on the rim of the crater of Mt. Rainier. I laughed at the sight and said, "This looks like this is not your first time here."
He looked at her admiringly and said, "This is her 15th time."
She smiled back at him and said, "This is his 50th time."
I said, "You're my heroes!"
And they have been ever since.

My son who built an entire model railroad city for his younger autistic brother.

He’s truly “his brother’s keeper.”

Dave the Atheist.

The way he cares for handicapped people.

..so, "now" maybe meant to perhaps mean Joseph Smith once upon a time and a long long time ago must have been one of my heroes because he was said to be the 'best-est' most truthful book writer out there, by nonetheless only mormoism..?

But is now really now, now? What I mean is, is there any possible way for me to go back and feel any of those 'needs' or 'feelings' I may have felt back then?

Like Joseph Smith actually had my best interest in his heart?

I'll wait.

Maybe Jesus. Think he has stuck with me after leaving religion and family. Not completely sure but maybe.

There are many, dead and alive, whom I admire but my only hero was my mother.

You really don't realize what you've got until it is gone, but I did spend a lot of time with my parents all my life given we farmed.

When someone asked this question before on here, I was thinking my dad, but then I realized it is really my mother and he would agree. I've told about her before. She is the oldest child of 2 deaf parents. She learned to sign before she learned to speak. They moved in with her polygamist grandmother and that is when she learned to speak. She was their voice from a very young age. She told her younger brother and sister what her parents wanted them to do. They didn't learn to sign until 4 or 5 years old and so my mother interpreted for them. I didn't know this part until she died and her sister wrote about it.

My mother took care of both her parents until they died. My grandmother after her husband died lived 3 blocks away in our first house. We all took turns staying overnight with grandma. My mother would take her dinner every night and would stay and talk to her for an hour or so. They were best friends.

My mother had a son who had a stroke at birth and the doctor didn't tell them. It took a few years to find out what happened. That started a lifetime of care and accidents like he got hit by a pickup on his bike when he was 5 years old. Was in a coma for 2 weeks. He drank paint thinner at 18 months. My older brother was in scouts and poured milk down his throat while my dad was getting dressed to take him to the hospital. The doctor said my brother saved his life. She had one thing after another. I don't know how she did it. Then my older brother had a hemorrhagic stroke at age 42 and my parents took care of him. Now he watches out for the first disabled brother and they both do really well living separately.

My mother was not very social, but she a lot of friends. Anyone who had a disabled person in their family, mom was friends with that family. I've been to plenty of funerals. My mom wanted a graveside service, but it snowed, so we had it in the funeral home. I have never seen that many women show up for someone's funeral. The place was PACKED. Standing room only.

And my dad, strongest man I've ever known. You could feel the energy suck out of our lives when he died. He even learned to sign so he could talk to my mom's parents. None of the other in-laws did that.

I miss them every day. EVERY SINGLE DAY.

My hero is the sun. It comes up every morning. It warms things up. It gives us light. It helps make things grow. It’s dependable and loyal unlike human beings.

The sun will never cheat on or steal from you. You won’t have your fantasies shattered when you actually meet it and find it’s a complete asshole.

The star from Turkey has gone viral with his condemnation of China for his treatment of Tibet and the Uyghurs. He's also taken other Muslim (im)potentates to task for their failure to speak up: Pakistani prime minister Imram Khan, Saudi Arabia’s King Mohammed bin Salman, Abu Dhabi crown prince Mohamed bin Zayed bin Sultan Al Nahyan, and Iranian president Ebrahim Raisi.

In response, China blacked out the last Celtic game--a major revenue loss. China plays rough. Remember how fast the Rockets' Daryl Morey backpeddled after tweeting support for Hong Kong democrats? So far, Kanter has shown no signs of backing down. In his last game, he had "Free Tibet" on his shoes, followed by "No Modern Day Slaves." Brings to mind a sports has-been who cashed in big with Nike and their slave-labor shoe factories.

https://www.scmp.com/sport/china/article/3153670/nbas-enes-kanter-calls-out-nikes-silence-china-and-alleged-forced

https://i0.wp.com/politicallyincorrecthumor.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/army-soldier-vs-colin-kaepernick-who-is-real-hero-millions-glen-coffee.jpg?w=490&ssl=1

He's not only a hero, he's a seriously competitive professional. Kanter just might make me a basketball fan.

caffiend Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
In his last game, he had "Free
> Tibet" on his shoes, followed by "No Modern Day
> Slaves." Brings to mind a sports has-been who
> cashed in big with Nike and their slave-labor shoe
> factories.

> He's not only a hero, he's a seriously competitive
> professional. Kanter just might make me a
> basketball fan.

Yeah, he's outspoken and luckily hasn't forgotten where he came from and his loved ones. I think "hero" involves having the courage to speak truth to power.

All the people on my list of heroes had that courage and some lost their lives because of it and many still do have that spirit, like Jane Goodall, who's always been my greatest hero for speaking up for the voiceless.

I tried not to say this, but in the olden days, there had to be risk involved in order to qualify as a hero. I don't like the way the word is passed out now like trophies at a T-Ball tournament.
I know newly recruited firemen whose families immediately start calling them heroes before they've even aimed a hose.

One of my pet peeves is the exaggeration and semantic borrowing that destroys language. The word should really mean something. There are a lot of people who do wonderful things for each other. But is it heroic? Truly.

I have a co-worker. Her husband pulled some kids out of a raging sea where they would surely drown--some were hers- and then lost his own life as he was too weak to fight the tide.

I hold my heroes to higher standards. No Mormon ever met them. I don't need a hero anyway luckily. Maybe someday I will. Don't I want anyone to risk their life for me though.

You know who risked a lot? The drag queens and other gays that fought off the crooked police at Stonewall in 69. Barricades. Brick throwing, refusing to be arrested. They risked going to jail for a long time. Instead my life is rich because of them. All this while I was on my mission doing a lousy Mormon leader's bidding. What a contrast.

well said. Thank you.

I guess I should have included what I mean by 'hero'.
To me it's what you said, and also having the courage to speak truth to power. I think of people like the humanitarians on my list, Jane Goodall, Malala, Ayan Hirsi Ali, so many, the list goes on, all of whom took great risks. Or like the Capitol Police who fought like hell against the terrorist who attacked the Capitol on 1/6. The latest show about it on HBO called "4 hours at the Capitol"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HaItfI2XU9g
is raw and those guys who almost got killed, they're heroes in my book.

David Bowie said we can be hero's, even if it's just for one day. Works for me.

David Graeber.

https://davidgraeber.org/

+1