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Posted by: blindguy ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 07:56AM

The late W. Cleon Skousen believed that the U.S. Constitution was divinely inspired. Joseph Smith made what is now known as "The White Horse Prophecy," where, when the U.S. Constitution was "hanging by a thread,", a Mormon would come in (on a white horse?) and save the day. These weren't the first two people believing in a divine interpretation of the Constitution, and they won't be the last.

Talk show host Thom Hartmann has written an editorial denouncing this kind of thinking that is very much worth the read.

https://hartmannreport.com/p/is-scotus-about-to-put-religion-over

While Mr. Hartmann does not try to show where the U.S. founders (specifically Thomas Jefferson) came up with the ideas that were used in the Declaration of Independence and the U.S. Constitution, he does show, through quotations from letters written by these people, that the vast majority of them (including current religious fundamentalist favorite John Adams) were very skeptical about mixing religion and politics. All of them knew from history where that could (and often did) lead, and they really didn't want it. Enjoy!

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Posted by: Soft Machine ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 08:33AM

Great find, Blindguy, and one which pretty much destroys all their "originalist" approach. Thanks for the reference.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/02/2023 08:33AM by Soft Machine.

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 11:30AM

    "It is no small thing to realize
    that no set of inspired words is
    safe from someone who knows better."

    --Judic West, a believer in religion
                          with zero structure

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Posted by: Brother Of Jerry ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 01:58PM

I find the Groff v DeJoy case pretty alarming. The linked article above gives a thumbnail sketch of the case.

This from a NYT article by Linda Greenhouse, their long-time SCOTUS reporter:

An accommodation requiring an employer “to bear more than a de minimis cost” — meaning a small or trifling cost — need not be granted, the court said in Trans World Airlines v. Hardison. In that case, an airline maintenance worker claimed a legal right to avoid Saturday shifts so he could observe the tenets of the Worldwide Church of God, which he had recently joined. Ruling for the airline, the court noted that if one worker got Saturdays off for religion reasons, the burden would fall on other workers who might have nonreligious reasons for wanting to have the weekend off.

“We will not readily construe the statute to require an employer to discriminate against some employees in order to enable others to observe their Sabbath,” the court said.

-------------------
So TWA v Hardison is long-standing precedent that has survived multiple challenges, and more than a dozen attempts to legislate against it. This SCOTUS, however, is considered likely to overturn it.

More from Greenhouse:
The decision to hear his appeal brings the Supreme Court to a juncture both predictable and remarkable. It is predictable because Justices Samuel Alito, Clarence Thomas and Neil Gorsuch have all called for a case that would provide a vehicle for overturning a precedent that is clearly in tension with the current court’s privileging of religious claims above all others, whether in the context of public health measures during the Covid-19 pandemic or anti-discrimination claims brought by employees of religious organizations.
--------------------

Greenhouse then went on to note how the original provision in the Civil Rights Act was meant to protect minority religions, but SCOTUS has turned down several cases involving minority religions, but accepted this one from an Evangelical Christian. Hmmm.

---------------
The plaintiff in that case, Jason Small, was a Jehovah’s Witness. In two other cases the court has turned down in the past few years, the employees seeking religious accommodations were Seventh-day Adventists. The religious-accommodation provision of Title VII — a foundational civil rights law that prohibits employment discrimination on the basis of race and sex as well as religion — has long been understood to protect adherents of just such minority faiths. A friend of the court brief filed in the new case by scholars of religion and employment law on behalf of Mr. Groff argues that the provision, properly interpreted, furthers constitutional values by making sure that followers of underrepresented faiths may worship in their own way “without putting their job at risk, to the same extent as adherents of more familiar faiths that are less often burdened by employers.”

It may be just a coincidence, but the plaintiff who finally persuaded the justices to take his case is in fact, according to the joint statement of facts agreed to by the parties, “an evangelical Christian within the Protestant tradition.” When the court doubtless rules for him later this term, the decision will not stand for a vindication of minority rights. It will instead signify the court’s complete identification with the movement in the country’s politics to elevate religion over all other elements of civil society.
---------------------

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/30/opinion/religion-supreme-court.html

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 03:05PM

What is at least as striking about these cases--for cases, plural, they are--is the utter disregard for precedent. The Kangaroos are not a real court employing established legal methods but a supra-legal body that enacts its own political agenda.

It's stunning, frankly. No one thought that the SC of the Lochner Era, also a right-wing phenomenon, would be outdone. But that is what has happened. We have a court that feels bound not by law, nor precedent, nor originalism.

So much for the rule of law.

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Posted by: GNPE ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 07:07PM

We are running, not walking into an era of Rule by (religious - cultural, not racial) Minorities.

I consider this terrifying.

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Posted by: bradley ( )
Date: February 04, 2023 04:34PM

Tribalism. Mormons have a head start.

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Posted by: blindguy ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 03:12PM

...and, should the Court rule in the evangelical Protestant's favor, a good question to ask would be, in Utah, where Mormonism is the dominant religion, what accommodations for individual Mormons will employers, especially non-Mormon employers, be forced to make so they don't get sued for discrimination against the dominant religion.

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 03:48PM

For certain jobs, you will be working at least some Sabbath days -- police, fire, hospital and ambulance workers, transportation, hospitality, etc.

If SCOTUS is going to make religion a protected class for honoring a Sabbath, then in my opinion, *all* employees, including the non-relgious, should be able to specify one consistent day off per week.

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Posted by: Brother Of Jerry ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 03:16PM

What I find really stunning is the utter shamelessness of it all.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 03:21PM

It is astonishing, isn't it? Not even an attempt to function as a court or, frankly, to abide by established ethical standards.

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 03:52PM

They KNOW they are doing ghawd’s work!

And they are constantly being told this by people whose admiration they crave.

The rest of us don’t stand a chance.

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Posted by: blindguy ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 03:55PM

...a state legislature (Arizona) voting to exempt itself from state record-keeping requirements laws.

I need go no further.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 04:42PM

US government has descended into farce. Meanwhile the Sundance Film Festival recently screened the investigation into Brett Kavanaugh that the FBI was supposed to have conducted.

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/01/21/sundance-documentary-looks-into-the-brett-kavanaugh-investigation.html

A clown car is one thing, but having the clowns driving is another.

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Posted by: Nightingale ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 06:55PM

Lot's Wife Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A clown car is one thing, but having the clowns
> driving is another.

Thanks for the laugh.

But really, here's hoping the good guys get the Last laugh.

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Posted by: dagny ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 07:16PM

So, will people line up to join religions that get a lot of "get out of work free" perks?

SCOTUS is a complete sell out at this point. They are not even trying to hide their agenda.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 07:20PM

Ah yes, but doesn't the constitutional coup look respectable when illuminated by a Gorsuch smile?

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Posted by: dagny ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 07:42PM

As long as their wives get to have their hands in the pie too, they're just fine with coups apparently. How dare the public disrespect them!

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: February 02, 2023 07:51PM

I fear you have inadvertently doxxed yourself, Samuel.

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Posted by: donbagley ( )
Date: February 03, 2023 10:56PM

I never thought that I would see the court sink this low.

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Posted by: blindguy ( )
Date: February 04, 2023 09:49AM

I read yesterday (I can't remember where) that while SCOTUS has decided to hear the case, it hasn't given a date for when. It is therefore possible that the case will not be heard until sometime in the next term with a ruling in 2024.

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Posted by: anybody ( )
Date: February 04, 2023 03:08PM

I have never heard any rational explanation of the benefits of theocracy, and I suppose there aren't any.


They want a theocracy because they want a theocracy.

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: February 04, 2023 03:39PM

Theocracy, with a living prophet, is what mormonism is all about.

Ya just gotta believe!!

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Posted by: blindguy ( )
Date: February 04, 2023 04:24PM

anybody Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have never heard any rational explanation of the
> benefits of theocracy, and I suppose there aren't
> any.
>
>
> They want a theocracy because they want a
> theocracy.

The advantages of a theocracy are the same as the advantages of an authoritarian ruler: namely, you always know where you stand and where everybody else is supposed to stand. There are no 180-degree policy shifts when new information is learned, and new information is kept tightly under control to keep the population under control, and there are a lot of people who want that.

The only real difference between a theocracy and a garden-variety dictatorship is by whose authority one is claiming leadership--the theocracy claims a Divine or Provencial authority for its actions.

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Posted by: anybody ( )
Date: February 04, 2023 04:53PM


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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: February 04, 2023 07:28PM

Exactly right. An unprecedented number of Americans would today prefer a tyranny to democracy.

Putting God in the picture just makes the tyranny appear more legitimate although we all know that its not God but his self-appointed representatives that will wield the power.

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Posted by: bradley ( )
Date: February 05, 2023 08:25PM

There is a fine line between democracy and the tyranny of moral busybodies. I'm open to some change from my liberal ways. Sharia law looks mighty appealing.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: February 05, 2023 08:35PM

I'm confident you think that post makes sense.

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