I believe they have, I think the anti-divorce thing was a passing fad back to the times of Packer, Hunter, & a few others.

In my case (2001), ChurchCo knowing approved a vicious, deceitful divorce done bc I stopped going to church (after My shelf broke).

Have there been any strong anti-divorce GA speeches lately?

My scant info is that ChurchCo has mostly given up partly bc women have been indoctrinated not to accept any lesser than Peter Priesthood / Mr. Walking Wallet…

What are your thoughts- information on this?

btw, I also think they’ve eased up on the Must Marry Young as right after a mission emphasis once was.

The Bible is fairly clear that divorce is a no no. I always find it hilarious that certain Xtian types who have a string of divorces are loudly condemning things that the Bible doesn't condemn as much as divorce. Remember the Bible lady Kim Davis, the former clerk in Kentucky, who refused to sign marriage certificates for same-sex couples? She was divorced three times.

I have not heard any Mormon direction on this topic for a while. I think they realize they might be complicit when someone stays with an abusive spouse. I also think the church didn't want to be stuck with dependent women who they encouraged to stay home.

I think maybe they now realize that demonizing divorced folks is going to impact their numbers. Divorce is common and accepted in society now.

People deserve to be encouraged to be happy in their relationships. For many, that means divorce. New opportunities and interests happen in life. People change.

I usually cringe when someone uses the word/term ‘deserve’, What does that mean in practical, every-day life?

Is it a sort of universal ownership of certain gift - unearned privileges?

Fair point. I meant it more as hope or encouragement for a happy life.

dagny Wrote:
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> The Bible is fairly clear that divorce is a no no.

I don't understand this.

The Talmud REQUIRES that a husband divorce his wife in certain specific circumstances, as a measure of human justice, to set her free [she will then be able to marry again], so she is not "chained" to him in a circumstance where she needs to become free.

[The only specific example of this that I can recall without looking it up (I must leave very soon), is that if a husband has a specific kind of skin disease, he is required by Jewish law to set his wife legally free (give her a document of divorce) so she is then free to find and marry another man.]

Divorce may be prohibited by the New Testament (I have no idea if this is so or not), but divorce is a critically important part of the Biblical/justice teachings of the non-New Testament (the Talmud, which is based on the Bible/Old Testament).

Got to go now.

Bye!

can be found in the book of Genesis, and it is amplified by Jesus in the New Testament's Synoptic gospels. Interestingly, Jesus does acknowledge in New Testament passages that the Jewish divorce laws existed, but he argues (if memory serves) that those laws were written to keep Yahweh's people loyal and in line with obedience to God's other laws. (Hopefully, I remembered this all correctly--it's been a while since I looked up this information.)

The NT verse I was thinking of was:
...
1 Corinthians 7:10-13
New International Version
10 To the married I give this command (not I, but the Lord): A wife must not separate from her husband. 11 But if she does, she must remain unmarried or else be reconciled to her husband. And a husband must not divorce his wife.

12 To the rest I say this (I, not the Lord): If any brother has a wife who is not a believer and she is willing to live with him, he must not divorce her. 13 And if a woman has a husband who is not a believer and he is willing to live with her, she must not divorce him.
....

I will say there are other verses that allow it, usually condemning the woman as an adulteress or whore.

...

Here are a couple of gems.
(As you point out Tevai, Moses had a rule for divorce, but that was due to something like hardening of heart according to the NT:


Matthew 19:3–9
“And Pharisees came up to him and tested him by asking, ‘Is it lawful to divorce one’s wife for any cause?’ He answered, ‘Have you not read that he who created them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’? So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.’ They said to him, ‘Why then did Moses command one to give a certificate of divorce and to send her away?’ He said to them, ‘Because of your hardness of heart Moses allowed you to divorce your wives, but from the beginning it was not so. And I say to you: whoever divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another, commits adultery.’”
...

Mark 10:2–12

“And Pharisees came up and in order to test him asked, ‘Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife?’ He answered them, ‘What did Moses command you?’ They said, ‘Moses allowed a man to write a certificate of divorce and to send her away.’ And Jesus said to them, ‘Because of your hardness of heart he wrote you this commandment. But from the beginning of creation, ‘God made them male and female.’ ‘Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh.’ So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.’

And in the house the disciples asked him again about this matter. And he said to them, ‘Whoever divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery against her, and if she divorces her husband and marries another, she commits adultery.’”

...

Jeremiah 3:1
“If a man divorces his wife and she goes from him and becomes another man’s wife, will he return to her?
Would not that land be greatly polluted?
You have played the whore with many lovers; and would you return to me? declares the LORD.”

...

It doesn't appear the Bible is recommending divorce at the same level people claim it condemns homosexuality IMO.

Just reading these made me cringe at the misogamy at the time. Mormons didn't make up anything new with the used chewed gum and cupcake analogies. They got it from the Bible. There is nothing equivalent IMO about condemning gay people.

"People deserve to be encouraged to be happy in their relationships"

People should survive their relationships even if it means less dead people needing temple work.

The main reason I ended up in divorce was because of the church. From my early teens, to my mission, and after my mission I was constantly told to prepare for marriage. I was told to quickly marry when I got home, the general theme was get married and have kids, and have a wonderful LDS life.

That scenario turned into a nightmare. I was not ready for marriage and neither was she, the children kept us together for awhile, but in the end it was pure hell and hostility. Chastised constantly about not being a proper priesthood holder by not only her, but those #$%* bishops and stake presidents. Worked two jobs, paid tithing, busted my butt going to school, kept her in a fancy home, and none of it meant a thing unless I was a perfect priesthood holder.

I often advised my kids to not marry until they wanted to and ignore the advice of leadership. Those that listened are doing well in their relationship married or not, those that did not are now divorced.

If I had followed my own impulses instead of following the constant barrage of leadership telling me it was my duty to God to get married when I came home from my mission. I would have held off, married closer to\or in my thirties, be much more financially stable, and happy during those lost decades of hell trying to keep my head above water.

I believe there’s way too much dishonesty surrounding MoMism & ChurchCo, much of it is CULTural as Silence just noted.

In my case the Mo-Approved dishonesty was also written in my DWs divorce filings submitted to the court;

One TBM friend told me: “Divorce Court is Liar’s Court” as if that condition- situation excuses dishonesty…

Your correct on this. My divorce lawyer was a chain smoking dynamo, one of the best investments of my life.

I sat in her office one day, and she looked at me and said I was not in a good situation. I asked her why, she told me the judge was a man who figured he should be the next apostle. She then said, LDS men who are divorcing in his court have no rights in his eyes.

So I asked her if he was subject to the law, and she said yes. I asked if his decision could be challenged and changed if he did not follow the law. She gave a sly grin and said yes.

I won the battle, but you are correct. Divorce court is a liars court in Utah.

ChurchCo soft-pedaled their divorce teachings about the same time they diluted the TR requirement for Honesty…

also, Repentance & Forging were mixed in with advice regarding earrings…

But wait isn't a mother and a father ONE family?

Once they divorce they become TWO families. 2>1

So Tithing INCREASES when there are two families.

MONEY is the root of all things MORMON.

I believe (no data) that most mo families already have 2 incomes; also, one may become disenchanted with MoMism as a result of the divorce & discontinue activity & tithe-paying...

If one ex is ordered to pay alimony, who pays the tithing on the alimony, the one who earned it or the one who benefits from it?

I would suppose that there are those in the church who would say ALL the payor's income must be tithed, and then when the alimony is paid, it is income to the recipient, and tithing must be paid ... again.

Yup, if both spouses claim to be TBMs they will both pay regardless of where the money came from... so the church is actually double dipping members for Ensign Peak's "investment money".

My brothers insisted that my mom pay tithing on whatever was in her banking account after she died. This wasn't her idea. My brother probably paid it under his name so he could get the heavenly kudos.

Didn't Brigham have at least 5 divorces?

I'm at a loss as to why he would need to divorce when he felt no particular need to support his wives, or to even spend time with them.

One of his ex-wives sued him for alimony. Brigham successfully argued in court that they were never legally married since polygamous marriages were not legally recognized.

I recall that BY said a woman could divorce her husband simply bc / if hub didn't live the gospel to her expectations, this was purely BY being- preaching his own version.

Remember, he was such a great guy ChurchCo has named their university system after him (instead of naming it after Juanita Brooks who told the Truth).

BY was a first-class autocratic, now Mos say his style & methods were ' neceessary' to preserve & shape the future of ChurchCo.

"his style & methods were 'necessary'"

Kind of like how modern China looks at Mao.

Precisely

I've always found "Temple divorce" as the ridiculous Mormon ritual. Who makes up this BS...

At it’s core, Religion including ChurchCo is to teach by words & actions, the difference between Good & Bad, Right & Wrong…

To me, bad/ wrong are actions that harm others. No exceptions.

Divorces have actions & effects on both sides of the coin, thought to favor the person who initiates the divorce (Petitioner), often at the expense of the respondent.

Divorces can be done as agreements honestly and somewhat similar to a 50/50 agreement or otherwise.

Scriptures back to the Old Testament teach against divorce as does the New Testament & the BoM, I’m unaware of a GA teaching otherwise, But: as we casually say: Qui tacet consentire videtur…

Silence means approval.

When a ChurchCo leader knows of a (deceitful, hate-filled, vicious) divorce and says nothing and/or approves - excuses - condones the divorce, that’s a Failure of serious, often long-lasting consequence.

Bottom line, a serious Wrong.

No, it just has to be done long after eternity and just before the end of paternity.