I wish this was fantasy or a plot from a novel.

It isn't.

############


https://www.npr.org/transcripts/1224382120

Moscow, Idaho, seems like a really unlikely place to be a center of Christian nationalism in the country. It's a kind of sleepy college town of about 26,000 people in North Central Idaho, kind of an idyllic area, like rolling wheat fields, a lot of agriculture around the town, real kind of cool, quaint downtown. Also a blue dot in a really red state. I live in Idaho. It's very conservative. I can tell you that firsthand. But Moscow is one of these kind of liberal strongholds, you know, as you'll find in a lot of college towns. So it's a little weird that it's become this kind of center for this unyielding, pretty far-right Christian nationalist Church called Christ Church. The pastor of Christ Church is Doug Wilson.

He leads a congregation of eight to 900 people. He's a Navy veteran in his early '70s and a prolific author of Christian-themed books. He spent most of his adult life evangelizing and developing a conservative Christian education model. And he's kind of built this network from Moscow, where he's had a lot of influence. He and his church members have been able to buy up some key real estate. Also working on a housing development on the edge of town. So a lot of their influence is through money in real estate right now, and that's been alarming a lot of people in town because the stated goal of Christ Church, locally, at least, is to make Moscow a Christian town.

More importantly, he's built up a Christian educational empire where he's got nearly 500 schools across the country, coast to coast, in nearly every state in the country. And as he told me, he sees his educational enterprises as munitions factories. He likes to use war terminology. So, you know, he sees his students as basically foot soldiers in the culture wars that he wants to win. And this school system has been really effective, as has his media empire. He's got popular streaming shows. He's got a publishing house called Canon Press that churns out dozens of titles. He himself has written dozens of books, and they've been pretty influential in these circles.

It's a little scary in N. Idaho and has been because of the supremist types brewing around Hayden, Idaho for years.

Idaho legislature actions are pushing out even regular conservatives at this point.

My kids went to school there years ago. I'm guessing U of I in Moscow is not going to attract a lot of balanced people in that environment. I personally know two doctors who left.

Christian Nationalism in education is taking hold. What could possibly go wrong.

Honestly I feel like I live in a zombie apocalypse and I'm not sure which ones are out to eat my brain.

dagny Wrote:
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> Christian Nationalism in education is taking hold.
> What could possibly go wrong.
>
> Honestly I feel like I live in a zombie apocalypse
> and I'm not sure which ones are out to eat my
> brain.

Me too.

Excerpt from article:

“This country was settled by people that weren’t moving to religion, they were moving away from state-mandated religion,” Rep. Jack Nelsen, R-Jerome, told the committee. “To me, this picks a particular religion’s Bible, and I am not for advancing this.”

"...a particular religion's Bible..."

Setting precedents can be a tricky business because at some point the shoe may be on the other foot - such that people of a different faith or belief become the majority and/or the ones in a position of power/authority and they may decide that the principle is reciprocal: When you were in the majority you chose to mandate readings from your Bible. Now they're in the majority they will choose to highlight their own holy book which may go against your own principles.

Be careful what you wish for may be a good maxim to consider at this moment in time.

I vote for inclusive initiatives. Or at least for attempts to be fair across the board.

The Christian Nationalists are going to keep pushing, pushing, pushing their agenda, and all I can say is that I hope the Supreme Court does the right thing.

It's not just Idaho. Others feel emboldened too.

N. Dakota is testing the waters too:

Controversial Christian nationalist legislation introduced in North Dakota House

https://heartlandsignal.com/2025/02/07/controversial-christian-nationalist-legislation-introduced-in-north-dakota-house/

“Whereas, the founding fathers of this great state begin the constitution with the words, ‘We’, the people of North Dakota, grateful to Almighty God … We desire there shall be a recognition of Almighty God as the source of authority; of the Lord Jesus Christ as the rightful ruler of nations…” the text for House Concurrent Resolution 3020 reads."

I don't think they care about things like the Constitution, democracy, laws or courts. They know the assignment and will push to see how far they can get. Like summer says, I hope the courts hold.
I'm guessing at some point this issue is going to get pushed to the SCOTUS where they will happily pick the case they want to explain away the Constitution. I don't have much confidence, but I hope I'm very wrong.

I think the picture painted is not a pleasing one even to me. However, if the Constitution has any power it would have to be totally ignored or destroyed for this to play out. In 2024 the number of Americans who identified as Christian was between 66 and 71 percent and the rate is declining. I have seen no numbers that indicate what percentage of that number actually support ideas of people like Wilson but I suspect it is small. In my particular circle, hardly a real indicator, it is nil. I have, however, lived in Idaho long enough to expect the unexpected, even the Spanish Inquisition.

kentish Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ... if the Constitution has
> any power it would have to be totally ignored or
> destroyed for this to play out.

It's not an impossible turn of events. Exceedingly rare though, I grant you.


> I have, however, lived in
> Idaho long enough to expect the unexpected, even
> the Spanish Inquisition.

Also not impossible. But hopefully very highly unlikely.

I attended the U of I waaaay back in 1967 for one year. To my very sheltered life of being raised in a small town in southern Idaho, this University experience was a BIG liberal shock to me! To hear about what is going on there really saddens me.

Religion = Emotions, all its purveyors know, understand, & apply this with varying degrees of effectiveness.

So is racism based on emotional ism as are politics

A new national task force was just announced to "eradicate anti Christian bias." This was a headline on a major media news site today.

Leave it to (many) Christians to claim they are victims as they force themselves everywhere and establish Christian Nationalism.

The "good" Christians got completely used and now everyone has to pay for it when the bad ones take over. Mormons are going to need to blend in. They have plenty of money to pay to play, so they will probably be fine.

Will it progress to the point Christianity can't be criticized anywhere? It feels like it might.

I'm trying to keep this about what is happening with religion and not specifically about politics.

dagny Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Will it progress to the point Christianity can't
> be criticized anywhere? It feels like it might.

Hopefully not because squelching free speech is not a hallmark of democracy - that form of govt we say we embrace here in North America. Too, there are many ways to worship and who has the right to say theirs is the only way, or worse - to enforce that notion.


> I'm trying to keep this about what is happening
> with religion and not specifically about politics.

Very tough when they often intersect. Especially if one or the other is the causative agent.

I thought the hallmark of democratic ideals is to enable free speech. It's OK, and inevitable, that we aren't all going to always agree on certain matters. Hopefully, we can always hang onto the basics and form some kind of universal alliance through that.

I have friends from church, friends who aren't religious and friends who have different faith beliefs from each other. It makes for a broader horizon and appeals to one of my favourite life values: Live and Let Live. The 3 L's that work well for me.

I don't take it for granted though. In some ways general civility only runs skin deep. That is very disappointing and can lead to grave injustice and upheaval.

The history of religion hasn't been peaceful - vast understatement I realize. It's disappointing though. I thought the main idea was to seek and maintain peace. My country embraced multiculturalism as an ideal a good long while ago. Unfortunately, humans seem to find a way to disagree and to fight the same battles over and over and over.

My sister is helping to organize various multicultural religious events currently for UN World Interfaith Harmony Week. I enjoy the spirit of it (no pun intended). I wish the goals were easy to implement in a wider way but that is still a challenge.

And yes, the local Mormon Church is represented during the week of events. I'll give that part a miss. There is a limit even for me. I'm not anxious to hear even one more Mormon presentation in my lifetime.

So yeah, I'm not 100% all in on the love and light part of interfaith harmony on a personal level but I embrace the ideals of it.

As for the Christian nationalism faction, yeah - I hope that doesn't become more entrenched. It is contrary, imho, to the spirit of peace. Not to mention the live and let live part of my own personal philosophy.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/07/2025 03:46PM by Nightingale.

The Reverend Mr Wilson of Moscow, ID, generated a pretty active thread here 3 years ago. Interesting to compare how he was then to how he is now. He appears to be more successful in his Christian Nationalism than I would have thought possible in a college town. Brrr.

https://www.exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,2401782,2401782#msg-2401782

There’s also another thread from 2 years ago. Looks like he is going to be a regular topic here.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/07/2025 03:57PM by Brother Of Jerry.

I can't remember three years back.

Thanks for finding those - interesting.

On the local news tonight, the Idaho legislature just proposed required Bible reading in public schools. The details are alarming. The whole Bible has to be read over 10 years.

https://www.kivitv.com/news/political/inside-the-statehouse/legislation-aims-to-reinstate-bible-readings-in-idaho-classrooms

This tells me Christians here aren't capable of teaching their children at church and home. They have to make a production of it by forcing everyone else to brainwash their kids.
It also tells me they are doing their best to force their religion everywhere. They are fine banning books other people think are important.
I think they are ultimately working to only have religious schools. I wonder if girls will be allowed.

Maybe if they allowed all religious texts to be used, the teacher to determine which one they want to read from.

Yeah. Didn't think so.

A parallel path here in Tennessee is to have school vouchers. Parents will receive $7000 per student they send to private schools. First-year cost is $450 million and is expected to grow annually. Tennessee is already ranked 3rd or 4th for the worst public education in the US. This will further decimate the local school budgets and discourage teachers. The phrase 'Thank God for Mississippi', is quietly spoken as there is always something worse there than in Tennessee. TN is catching up in the race to the bottom. These funds will go to religious schools.

Exactly.

Idaho is busy trying to undermine the public schools by giving more and more money to charter schools which mainly means religious schools and homeschools. To no one's surprise, sketchy religious schools have grown like mushrooms, and woefully unqualified people are now "homeschool" teachers. The public schools are attacked over everything and given fewer resources.

I'm not saying that there can't be some good results from private schools, but overall, Idaho's kids are falling in test scores and teachers are struggling.

I was watching the legislators discuss this topic of schools. Comically they were emphasizing how IMPORTANT it is for people to have a CHOICE. I just about choked laughing. They had just talked about making women criminals if they have an abortion before talking about schools.

Doug Wilson's statements and behaviors are why I'm now much more skeptical of the unchecked freedom of religion defined in the First Amendment of the U.S. Constitution. I suppose that people have the right to believe fantasies (such as the man in the moon theories promoted by early Mormons), but to allow such people to break our other laws because those laws are against their religious beliefs is really going too far, in my view. Democratic republics like ours can last only as long as all are willing to voluntarily live under some checks and balances to respect the rights of everyone. When the leader of some religious group (say, Joseph Smith in the 1830s) decides that the laws do not apply to him and he gets a big enough following, then poof! your democratic republic is blown away like dust in the wind.