http://www.ldsmag.com/index.php?option=com_lyftenbloggie&view=entry&id=24&Itemid=8

What say ye, o atheist feminists of RFM?

HAHAHAHahahahahahaha

Dream on suckers!

Mormon mommies WANT to be envied but that's because they have no self esteem.

:)

Ummm, wow. More like they just can't believe that there are really Stepford Wives existing by choice in this modern world. They're probably subconsciously looking for the cracks in the shiny exterior. Yeesh.

This woman claims to be highly educated, and claims her two Mormon-mommy friends are highly educated, and yet they BELIEVE the picture these Mormon women paint on their blogs of attentive husbands and perfect children? REALLY?

I'm aghast at the products of our education system if that's the case. As I recall the abusive woman on the Dr. Phil show ALSO had a blog describing her picture perfect life as a Mormon mommy -- but the reality was far, far different wasn't it?

Not buying it. I call pseudo-atheist and pseudo-feminist.

Why?

One phrase from the article tells you all you want to know about he author, "overeducated."

Why would anyone, let alone an young woman making her way in the world, describe themselves as "overeducated" -- and how could a feminist fall into the trap of thinking a woman can be overeducated. Doesn't she value a finely-honed intellect?

That "overeducated" bit was still being used against women in the 1950s and 60s.

Take a look at this excerpt from S.T. Joshi's book, "In Her Place" (Joshi is a male author):

"One of the greatest evils of prejudice against women is the degree to which many women have internalized men's views of their inferiority. .... so relatively recent as Patricia Coffin's 'Memo to the American Woman' (Look magazine, January 11, 1966).

"'If you are determined to take on the responsibilities of an executive position, you must be just as willing to help your child with his homework and cook your husband's dinner, or you will be a failure as a woman and, therefore, as a human being...On the whole, women have less intellectual acumen than men. Your thinking is less analytic, less direct, more intuitive, more global. Generally speaking, you are not good at high (or even low) finance.'

"Many of the women' magazines of the day were actually run by men, who either anonymously or under female guises sought to restrain women's thirst for independence by emphasizing the difficulty of capturing a man while also competing for his job....

"It should not be assumed that the articles in this volume are merely historical curiosities that now merit only a scornful laugh. If it establishes nothing else, this book demonstrates that there has been not only a single women's rights movement but a succession of them -- and, more disturbingly, that opposition to women's striving for equality has been repeatedly expressed in much the same terms from generation to generation, and continues to be expressed in muted and covert ways today

"... the overcoming of prejudice against women is not a male or a female function; it is a human function." [end excerpt]

The article about envying the women of the mormon baby center may have had some merit if the author admitted to the lure of absolute certainly exuded by the mormon mothers. But it fails when it condemns "overeducated" women. And it's the author's fault, not education's fault, nor atheism's fault, if the author has failed to grow up into a fully-formed adult. WTF? She still wants to be married to a baby-daddy who takes care of her and absolves her of all that burdensome need to be educated? Garbage.

I suspect the author is an imposter, paid to pretend.

The article read false to me on soooo many levels.

Notice there was no comment function either.

All their propaganda goes un-contested and un-opposed. ummm how very Mormon.

"Overeducated" is a red flag.

from the perspective of the bloggers? By the way, what is linked above contains only excerpts of the original Salon article, which is far more critical in tone - it's really an article about the author's guilty pleasure (and ultimately dismissive of the lifestyle of the bloggers - which she can't quite come to terms with being anything other than, in reality, a "miserable, soul-destroying trap."). She also expressly acknowledges she's not getting the whole story from the blogs, and that the bloggers' lifestyle is likely monotonous. I suggest you actually read the article the author wrote before labeling her a shill.

http://www.salon.com/life/feature/2011/01/15/feminist_obsessed_with_mormon_blogs/index.html

Oh, and there's a comment section.

In fact, the "creative re-editing" that Emily Matchar's salon dot com work suffers at the hands of Maurine Proctor, butcher extraordinaire, is why you never see any of Marchar's more enlightened comments in the ldsmag dot com article.
Moral 1 to the story: ALWAYS GO TO THE SOURCE.
Moral 2 to the story: STOP READING CRAP MORMON MAGAZINES--if you're intelligent enough to read, you're intelligent enough to read something worth reading.

:-)

Now I gotta read the original. ;)

Well, JChan is right, there's more in the original article than in the deceptively-edited version in the mormon rag. More nuance is presented in the original.

If the author is trying to present herself as seen from the mormon mommy's point of view, that's not clear. Furthermore, the author brings up additional detail that reveals mormon brainwashing still sloshing around in her brain. By virtue of repetition, the author harps on the overeducated theme.

Take this paragraph, for example:
""It seems that a lot of popular culture wants to portray marriage and motherhood as demeaning, restrictive or simple, but in the LDS church, motherhood is a very important job, and it's treated with a lot of respect," says Natalie Holbrook, the New York-based author of the popular blog Nat the Fat Rat. "Most of my readers are non-LDS women in their late 20s and early 30s, college educated, many earning secondary degrees on the postgraduate level, and a comment I often get is, 'You are making me want kids, and I've never wanted kids!'"

Yes, the author is quoting Nat the Fat Rat, but she's doing so in a way that confirms her belief that, yes, motherhood is treated with respect in the LDS Church. And, yes, motherhood is demeaned outside of the LDS Church. Both are false.

Motherhood within the LDS Church is not so much respected as demanded. Young women are pressured into having babies. And all Church members are brainwashed into thinking of babies as one way to secure their place in the Celestial Kingdom. Babies (and wives) become a sort of currency which one uses to buy points in heaven. That's not respect.

The original article harps on the issue of "overeducated" by repeating it in several different contexts. In the paragraph above, those postgraduate degrees are conveniently dissed. They keep those poor women from their true purpose. Dissing advanced degrees for women is a cultural norm that damages all of us. Set those female scientists free! Don't make them get enough education to understand and succeed in their field!

Family life can be fulfilling, and wonderful ... and very difficult to pull off. But it's a false dichotomy to set up a choice between sacrificing oneself to family and not having a family at all. Family is one part of an adult woman's life, one piece among many.

Wow, so much negativity and derision on this site! Why is it so hard for atheist/liberal/intellectual or "highly educated" women to understand and accept the fact that not every woman wants to spend her life getting yet another degree, or working all night in her C-level corner office because she has no one at home waiting for her, who will actually MISS her if she's not there.

Boo hoo. Yes, I can see that you all lead much "happier, fulfilled lives" by not sacrificing to serve others, whether it be at home, in the community, the poor in Haiti, etc. Not everyone needs a VP title and 6 figure salary to find joy and fulfillment in life.

If you do, then that's terrific. But be happy for those who have different values and different perspectives on life. The world needs a diversity of thought, experiences, and talents.

As women, we need to support each other in whichever life path we choose to pursue, and not be suspect that someone can't possibly be genuine, real, or happy because she is living a life different than yours.

Your preconceptions are blinding you -- whoever you are.

The article was ludicrous. You kind of are as well.

a-quiver.

Maybe you need a Prozac and a long rest.

I notice that nyca did a little creative editing as well, changing "overeducated" to "highly educated."

That's a telling detail. Couldn't quite make your point without twisting the truth?

And this bit from nyca -- well, unholy crap on a stick!: "Yes, I can see that you all lead much 'happier, fulfilled lives' by not sacrificing to serve others, whether it be at home, in the community, the poor in Haiti, etc. Not everyone needs a VP title and 6 figure salary to find joy and fulfillment in life."

You do realize that putting it that way completely negates your point about needing diversity, and about everyone leading lives that make use of their best talents --you do realize that, right?

You put scare quotes around "happier, fulfilled lives" -- really? Insinuating that people who do not fit into your preconceptions cannot possibly be happy or fulfilled is, I don't know, just a wee bit arrogant.

And nobody but you mentioned a VP title and a 6 figure salary. WTH are you on about?

On the other hand, I do know people with 6 figure salaries who spend a good deal of time helping others. I think they'd fit even nyca's restrictive version of "sacrificing to serve others."

And in what universe does having fewer children, plus a good eduction and a career path, equal *not* sacrificing for one's children? One does not preclude the other.

For that matter, it doesn't preclude helping out in Haiti either.

From whence cometh this bogus idea that people who don't fit into the nyca-mold are selfish?

Got on your high horse there, didn't you nyca? Preaching to us about "sacrifice" and trying to shame everyone into staying home with hordes of kiddies. And then you couldn't even stick to your guns, but added that little paragraph at the end about diversity. The whole sermon came off as very mormon, very YW, and very stupid.

Yeah, I really envy having to spend 90% of my time at cult where I can't decide what I can drink, eat, watch, read or choose my own underwear, how many kids to have and paying 10% of my income for the privilege of cleaning the chapel.

Just like TSCC - she is not what she claims.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/17/2011 02:28PM by wine country girl.

It's an "inauthentic" life from my viewpoint, and it looks like a spiritual prison from here.

>“I'm a young, feminist atheist who can't bake a cupcake. Why am I addicted to the shiny, happy lives of these women?” writes Emily Matchar in Salon.

Same reason as people cannot resist looking at the scene of a recent car crash, or why videos of people having boils and cysts lanced, popped or drained are so popular on Youtube.

People like gooky, yucky stuff.

slo-Mo train wreck, Matt! Those are always a lot of fun to watch.

:-)

Nyca, I've been one of those mommies, running myself ragged trying to be all perfect and please everybody and live up to ridiculous rules. I literally made myself ill and shot my immune system all to hell.

But I defer to the poet Paul Laurence Dunbar (1872-1906):

We Wear the Mask

WE wear the mask that grins and lies,
It hides our cheeks and shades our eyes,—
This debt we pay to human guile;
With torn and bleeding hearts we smile,
And mouth with myriad subtleties.

Why should the world be over-wise,
In counting all our tears and sighs?
Nay, let them only see us, while
We wear the mask.

We smile, but, O great Christ, our cries
To thee from tortured souls arise.
We sing, but oh the clay is vile
Beneath our feet, and long the mile;
But let the world dream otherwise,
We wear the mask!

--------
Rip off the mask, honey, and look behind it.

What's there to be jealous of? Hordes of screaming kids running around and destroying everything? 'Magic' underwear? Being pregnant, again? Keeping up the facade of perfection? Giving up money to a cult when we need it to feed the newest mouth? Being stalked by people who barely know you but pretend to like you?
And then share my husband with all these other women that I don't get to play with either?

No thanks, I'll pass. I'm very happy with my "evil" small family and comfy underwear that boosts my self esteem.

...Hokay...I feel a little bit better.

The REASON those atheist women admire those blogs (if the whole story isn't COMPLETE bullshit, which I'm not saying it's not) is because....

wait for it...

THEY HAVE NEVER LIVED IT!!!

You just can't see that giant bottle of prozac on the mormon mommy's beautiful nightstand b/c she cropped it out w/ her nifty creative memories cropper she spent way too much on so her nosy church friends wouldn't know her dh just got laid off.

Everything looks great after the editing and photo-shopping,
Mor[m]on mommy blogs included.

They act like its hard to find a man that wants a doormat of a wife to impregnate- it isn't. Anyone can get in that kind of relationship with minimal effort. Don't people typically get jealous of difficult accomplishments?

"They have lovely homes, picture-perfect kids, loving, super-attentive husbands, and things seem very normal and calm,"

So it becomes a promotional add for pro Mormonism:

“Join us "we'll make you happy". They want to sell that Cinderella fantasy of the Church, the happy Mormon couple “the Prince and Cinderella” the castle (temple in the back ground), living happily ever after.

Now they’ve got these women thinking they missed out on their happily ever after stories, asking themselves why they’re working their asses off going to college and working when they could be happily married, instead of looking for Mr. Right and waiting to start a family.

They don't want the prospective enlistee to see the ugly underbelly of the Church, the denied education opportunities for women and girls, tied down with children, the husband who is always at work or Church, the shoe-string budgets, the constant Church calling to the exclusion of all other community projects, service and activities they could or might want to be involved in, but now won’t have time for because Mormonism has monopolized all their time.

They don’t tell about the constant brain washing and mental manipulation they will be subjected to until they believe they can’t function without the Church in their lives.

They don’t see that they will be paying 10% of their income for the privilege becoming a free labor source for this Church?, the restrictions/intrusions on their sex lives, who they can date and marry, the constant monitoring of their lives to make sure they are conforming and complying with all “Church/Company” policies by other member and all the other negatives of being a member of the Mormon Church.

Here's an example of a mormon mommy cracking under stress. It's also an example of questionable "therapy" provided to LDS mothers and families. An LDS mother in Utah killed her four-year-old child with water intoxication. She forced the child to drink a gallon of water.

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/home/51036982-76/killpack-girl-jennete-abuse.html.csp

Excerpt:
"The 35-year-old Springville woman tearfully told parole board chairman Curt Garner that she now understands the triggers that led her to physically abuse and ultimately cause the death of Cassandra Killpack in 2002 ...

"Meanwhile, their 8-year-old daughter has put her LDS Church baptism on hold until after the parole board decides her mother’s fate.

"At their 2005 trial, the Killpacks claimed the forced water treatment was therapy designed to get the girl, who purportedly suffered from reactive attachment disorder, to bond with her adoptive mother.

"To facilitate the bonding, Jennete Killpack was supposed to provide the girl with all her food and drink. When the girl drank liquids not given by her mother, a therapist had recommended forcing the girl to drink an excess amount.

"On June 9, 2002, the day Cassandra died, she had sneaked a sip of her baby sister’s juice....
The excessive water intake caused the girl’s sodium levels to plummet, which caused her brain to swell to fatal proportions....After Tuesday’s hearing, Richard Killpack told The Tribune that “hundreds” of people in his community have been “fasting and praying” for his wife’s release from prison."

That just makes me sick.

The article says that the little girl was black.

Who in their right mind places a child in a home where one of the core beliefs of the parents is that the child's skin color is a curse from god?

Seriously, WTF!?!

True strong feminist here, and trust me, all I feel towards these "mommies" is fear I would have become one myself. Not anymore!