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Posted by: pewsitter ( )
Date: May 10, 2013 11:02AM

I got back in town last night and watched the new TV show about a group of polygamist in Arizona called Polygamy USA. I was shocked at some of the things I saw and heard. The man in charge of their "missionary program" to me, looked and sounded like Thomas Monson. They have to be close relatives.

The women on TV do not dress like the FLDS women except they do their hair in a very similar fashion. The prayers that were said were word for word the same as you would hear in lds homes. The same thing for religious speaking and beliefs. Except for the extra wives, I could have been watching a show about lds members. These people would brag about how they are 5th and 6th generation polygamist mormons.

In this sect (cult) the women choose who they will marry based upon who god tells the woman to marry. The single men are not allowed to date or talk with the females. The single males have to wait until a women feels she has received inspiration of god that he is the one she is to marry. The females can choose any man (single or married) she wants between the ages of 18 to 70.

There were many pictures of js hanging on the walls. I think this sect is way more mormon than the lds version is.

If you saw this TV show, what are thoughts on it?

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Posted by: Tupperwhere ( )
Date: May 10, 2013 12:20PM

what channel or network is it on? With as much tv as I watch, I can't believe I haven't heard of it yet!!

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Posted by: jazzskeeter ( )
Date: May 10, 2013 01:04PM

It was on the National Geographic channel. Next episode is Tuesday at 9 PM (time zone?). I taped it and my visiting TBM son watched it with us. He saw a lot of parallels between the cultures.

I thought the same thing as you did about the head honcho guy who looks and sounds like Monson.

Then there was the Cawley guy who had this creepy soft voice like Warren Jeff's.

Isaiah's relationship with his two wives seems so phony and forced.

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Posted by: Tupperwhere ( )
Date: May 10, 2013 01:08PM

awesome. I needed something new to watch! I have it DVR'd

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Posted by: pewsitter ( )
Date: May 10, 2013 02:17PM

Did you see the part where Isaiah's (the hot wife) does not want any more kids? She wants him to do it with the younger one.

The 3 bedrooms for the adults and the women switching off every two nights to sleep in his room seemed weird. I thought they should all just sleep together. It must be rough on the young kids when they are sick and not knowing which bedroom mommie is in.

Of course, he gets to be a trucker for 5 or 6 weeks at a time and get some rest from making babies.

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Posted by: Mallow ( )
Date: May 15, 2013 12:54PM

I don't think she said that she didn't ever want more kids, just that she wasn't ready for one. Which made sense to me, I was just glad she had a choice and there seemed to be honest consideration for when she is ready or not ready to have a baby.

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Posted by: gentlestrength ( )
Date: May 10, 2013 03:29PM

Polygamists believe almost everything mainstreamed LDS believe. The main dispute is the revelation rescinding polygamy in order for Utah to become a state. Many Boomer and older Mormons still believe polygamy should be practiced on earth because it is an eternal principle, by but they are laying low to get along with Americans.

It could be easily argued that practicing polygamists are the truly devout LDS with courage of their convictions.

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Posted by: crom ( )
Date: May 16, 2013 03:10PM

Pew Survey of Mormons indicate that 86% of LDS think polygamy is immoral.

Ironically the "we have the truth and you don't" attitudes prevalent in all the schisms does not cause anyone to recognize the commonalities. Go figure.

Seriously, if polygamy is immoral how do you rationalize that Joseph Smith was a prophet of God? The fundies are in fact living JSJ's teachings, the way BY enforced them. How do you say mainstream is rational but fundie is crazy when mainstream was fundie?

Straighten that out in a rational manner. I came to the conclusion they're BOTH nuts.

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Posted by: Lasvegasrichard ( )
Date: May 10, 2013 04:01PM

It creeped me out . You just sit there and shake your head wondering how any intelligent being could swallow such a huge amount of brainwashing .

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Posted by: Tooomuch ( )
Date: May 15, 2013 12:57AM

Wow!! How utterly sad and completely SICK this cult is! Half the people on the show look like they have cognitive issues. There seems to be some inbreeding going around ole Centenial. I know plenty of LDS and sorry but marriage is hard enough as it is with one husband and wife. Oh boy and the creepy old man in charge of the missionary men. He looks like a psycho. Hopefully everyone is getting STD tested. It looks like a sad group of very lost people once again using the name of The Lord to practice some nasty and immoral things once again making religion look like crazy and mentally unstable people. Those poor children they have no choice in having to grow up with truly screwed up adults.

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Posted by: mia ( )
Date: May 15, 2013 01:37AM

There certainly seemed like there's something wrong in the gene pool there.

The first time I saw that guy I thought it was Tom. He looks just like him. They've got to be from the same family.

That one guy has been doing slave labor for almost 4 years waiting for a wife! That's some kind of cult teaching that can convince a young single guy to do that. Wow. They call him a missionary. Holy hell, he's just a prisoner doing slave labor.

That entire group of people seemed just weird. Like mormons on steroids. I feel so sorry for the kids. They don't stand a chance.

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Posted by: Cheryl ( )
Date: May 15, 2013 06:32AM

serving missions. Polygamists use the same tactics but moreso as you've pointed out.

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Posted by: fiona64 ( )
Date: May 22, 2013 04:15PM

You have to love it, with Patriarch Arthur insisting it isn't slavery ... but the "mission" is unpaid manual labor for an indeterminate amount of time. And his own son wants nothing to do with it. In fact, Ezra always looks to me like he wants to be anywhere *but* Centennial Park.

My overall impression is this: I have *never* seen such a colorless, joyless group of people in my life.

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Posted by: fiona64 ( )
Date: May 22, 2013 04:14PM

You should read the article on Religion Dispatches ... yikes.

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Posted by: Diggermill ( )
Date: May 15, 2013 10:04PM

This show is totally staged and scripted! Having a decent knowledge of the flds machine, it seems clear that this group is trying to do damage control for the Jeff's mess. It is only obvious the Cawley guy is Colorado city raised as are his wives. As anyone in the southern Utah/northern Arizona area knows, centennial polygs are simply trying to "fit in" better to preserve their businesses and employment opportunities. It is a known fact that women are lesser in status than men in the polygamy communities. The fact that this show says it is the women's choice to choose a mate is proof the show is 100% fake.

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Posted by: fidget ( )
Date: May 16, 2013 06:55AM

Not true actually. Centennial park side is actually a bit better environment for the women. They have more freedom of choice.

We worked on a big house there and did a bunch of copper work. We were paid in different payments. Each check was from a different wife. One was a doctor, another a lawyer, etc.

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Posted by: weepingwillow ( )
Date: May 15, 2013 10:28PM

Just watched it for the first time today and said the same thing about that guy who resembles monson soooo much. Freaky.

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Posted by: Arnold ( )
Date: May 16, 2013 02:58PM

Just stumbled here after doing a google search. Nice forum...

I was born into the Southern Baptist faith and regularly attended Pentecostal services in my teens. My sister (I'm black, btw) also briefly attended Mormon services in her teens. I'm neither for nor against Mormonism. Being agnostic now, I'm neither for nor against any religion. That said, I'd like to think I have a dispassionate, 'outside the box' viewpoint.

As someone not that familiar with 'fundamentalist' LDS (sorry, I don't know all the proper terms), except for what I've seen on TV, I think this is a really good program. Thanks to Warren Jeffs and his group, I was under the impression that all 'fundamentalists' married-off underage girls and forced women into subservience. That's not at all what I see in this program. By welcoming cameras in this group is taking a huge step toward cleaning up the 'image' mess made by Jeffs' group and others.

About the OP's reference to Monson, I don't know who that is. But the guy in the series (though initially a little creepy looking lol), seems like a really frank, likeable and genuine guy who cares deeply about his faith and community. He even openly discusses his family's own strengths and weakness - his sister (community leader who dies in first episode) and son (who challenges community beliefs by having a girlfriend) - which I find both brave and endearing.

Good show. Well done, NatGeo!

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Posted by: WinksWinks ( )
Date: May 22, 2013 09:27AM

I don't believe for one second you'd remain "outside the box" if you actually knew about the racist doctrines currently in the book of mormon. Your skin color is not a curse.

How many times in the book of mormon are people cursed with a skin of blackness?
You could have been sealed up as a slave for all eternity in the early days of the church. And up until 1978 you wouldn't have been allowed to participate fully due to your "curse", and even longer than that after the official change in policy as the hardline racist members gradually got shamed into behaving properly or died.

The book of mormon used to have many references to peoples that were "white and delightsome", while their enemies were "dark and loathsome". This has been changed to "pure and delightsome", but no changes have been made to "dark and loathsome" nor to all the cursings with a "skin of darkness".

You may be able to somehow feel objective, but you shouldn't. Feeling thinking people are outraged at the discrimination and bigotry of this church.

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Posted by: anybody ( )
Date: May 22, 2013 08:56PM

Hi Arnold...just to let you know (in case you don't) -- Mormonism is racist. Individual Mormons may not be but their religion is very much so. Mormons believe that in the pre-mortal existence one third of the spirits were for Jesus, one third were for Lucifer and the remaining third couldn't decide which side to support and were "cursed" with African features and black skin when they became human on Earth. Brigham Young, the second Mormon Prophet, taught that interracial sex was punishable by death. The LDS Mormons abandoned the black ancestry ban in 1978 but FLDS polygamist Mormons still believe in it. I suggest you watch this video:

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Posted by: adoylelb ( )
Date: May 16, 2013 03:59PM

The difference between this cult and the mainstream Mormon church is that missionaries for the mainstream church serve only 2 years, and females can go, but they only do so for 18 months. Missionaries in this cult are unmarried men who do slave labor for the community while they wait for a wife to "chose" them for marriage.

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Posted by: Belle ( )
Date: May 22, 2013 09:57AM

The one guy who was married to all the fundy-sort plain-jane women, many wearing glasses, had a blondish 30 year old wife amongst them -- at least that is the age they gave - and she looked 20 years older as if she was one of the grandmotherly wives! I was shocked she was that young. The lifestyle sucks the youth right out of some of them, doesn't it?

And the father asking his 18 year old marriageable daughter if she got that as they walked out of the meeting where they talked about the woman's purpose in life is to bear children for God. Gave me the creeps.

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Posted by: Etexgal ( )
Date: May 22, 2013 10:25AM

That Hyrum guy who has been a missionary for 3 years is incredibly cute. If I was one of those homely single girls I'd pick him for sure! (Not a very thouhtful comment, I know, but couldn't resist)

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Posted by: APJH ( )
Date: May 22, 2013 03:57PM

I'm curious how the men profiled on this show are able to provide for multiple wives and children? One man featured has 3 wives and 18 kids! Another young man has a beautiful, large, modern home with 2 wives and 5 kids. None of these women work outside the home. Can someone please explain how the men are able to support such huge broods?

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Posted by: fidget ( )
Date: May 22, 2013 05:14PM

Actually in centennial park some of the women work outside the home. We did copper work on a large house out there. The man had seven wives and five worked outside the home. One was a doctor, another a lawyer, etc.

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Posted by: freckles ( )
Date: May 22, 2013 10:04PM

The one with two wives and five kids actually does have a wife working outside the home. It's the brunette wife. She comes home for lunch.

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Posted by: BeGreen ( )
Date: May 22, 2013 11:42PM

So, they said the ladies choose their husbands, and you believed it? I've got a bridge for you to consider buying, my friend.
You have witnessed that famous "Lying fer the Lard" in action.

When they say their women choose their husbands what they MEAN is the woman is given a choice. The choice given every young fundamental woman (girl) is the choice between marrying the man choosen by the(ir) profit, or the choice of disobeying the profit and suffering eternal damnation.

So, with that in mind, these guys will look someone straight in the eye and say without flinching that their daughters were given a choice and willingly chose the ugly old codger with pee-smelling pants she now calls, "husband."

How do you know when a fundy is NOT lying? Answer: Never. Even when they are dead, the bastards are STILL LYING!

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Posted by: Stacy ( )
Date: May 28, 2013 06:17PM

I actually really liked the belief system, sense of family, etc. im a converted catholic aka episcopalian, so this is not something we are taught to believe however it seems sincere, to think all these families living this way and im oblivious none the less. interesting, engaging. Will be watching again.

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Posted by: Catherine ( )
Date: May 28, 2013 08:21PM

The leader of this cult couldn't have any relation to our prophet Thomas S Monson since BOTH of the prophets parents are from Sweden. Actually president Monson's great uncle(?) was the missionary that baptized sister Monson's family! Although they have separated themselves from that psycho Warren Jeff's cult they still ARE FLDS, not LDS.. I see they believe in some of the principles & tenets of the LDS church they did not follow the direction of the prophet when it was told to us that The Lord no longer needed families to be polygamist! If they want to practice this fine BUT they need to make it VERY CLEAR they ARE NOT part of our church! It's difficult as it is trying to get people to understand the truth about our church vs theirs...

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Posted by: pewsitter ( )
Date: May 28, 2013 08:35PM

Catherine - The people on this TV show and even the FLDS are way more Mormon than the LDS branch Mormonism is. These people live like Mormons did before the 1900's. They are the real Mormons. You most likely could have been raised like these people were. Sick huh?

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Posted by: anybody ( )
Date: May 28, 2013 11:31PM

Catherine, these Mormons are closer to Brigham Young's church than the modern day Mormons of LDS, Inc:

"Now if any of you will deny the plurality of wives, and continue to do so, I promise that you will be damned," (Journal of Discourses, vol. 3, p. 266).

"The only men who become Gods, even the Sons of God, are those who enter into polygamy," (Journal of Discourses, vol. 11, p. 269).

"Some of you may ask, 'Is there a single ordinance to be dispensed with? Is there one of the commandments that God has enjoined upon the people, that he will excuse them from obeying?' Not one, no matter how trifling or small in our own estimation. No matter if we esteem them non-essential, or least or last of all the commandments of the house of God, we are under obligation to observe them." (Journal of Discourses, vol. 8, p. 339).

"What man or woman on earth, what spirit in the spirit-world can say truthfully that I ever gave a wrong word of counsel, or a word of advice that could not be sanctioned by the heavens? The success which has attended me in my presidency is owing to the blessings and mercy of the Almighty..." (Journal of Discourses, vol. 12, p. 127).

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Posted by: spanner ( )
Date: May 28, 2013 08:53PM

Hmmm, a few newcomers posting oddly complimentary comments about the FLDS. And at least one TBM defender. This post must be googling up on some popular keywords.

And I thought Episcopalians were Anglican, and definitely not AKA Catholic.

The FLDS have not rejected Brigham Young's vile teachings on blacks, either, based on statements by exiles. It is one of the things they would not discuss openly though. You won't see any mixed race FLDS families!

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Posted by: adoylelb ( )
Date: May 28, 2013 09:14PM

One thing I noticed is that the polygamist baptism ceremony is very much like the baptism ceremony for the SLC based church which did ban polygamy. The reason these groups exist is because they wanted to continue the practice, so they split off from the group that Monson leads.

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