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Posted by: subeam ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 10:02AM


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Posted by: Lasvegasrichard ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 01:36PM

Do they have his Jupiter Talisman ? Or his rock ... er ... I mean seer stone ? Or his magic parchments ?

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Posted by: joeshmit ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 01:55PM

When I first started noticing all the glaring problems with church history, I read a church book called Opening the Heavens. It gives every contemporary account of the first vision, priesthood restoration, BoM translation, BY transiguration, etc... Reading it only made my doubts grow and start to look deeper. In the translation section, there are multiple quotes about the seer stone used for translation. Martin Harris said that Joseph told him he could see anything he wanted through it, and that Martin Harris would die if he looked in it and couldn't control his desire to want to see God. Then there's a quote, maybe from David Whitmer, that said that Joseph gave the stone to someone when he was done with the translation. This shocked me. His magical stone would allow him to see anything he wanted...past, present, future, to see God himself, etc... and he just gave it away?! Joseph had this stone for several years before he actually started "translating" and during the translation he was quoted as saying something like, "Everyone on the earth would/could have a similar seer stone (find their own in the ground) if they were worthy, etc..." So, why did he give it away? Why did Moroni take back the Urim and Thummim when it had previously been passed down from one prophet to another? The book of Mormon actually shows that there was more than one Urim and Thummim...one was sealed up with the Jaredite record, but it wasn't recovered and taken to Alma with the record. Alma said that Mosiah already had the Urim and Thummim. Dum Dum Dum Dum Dum...

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Posted by: joeshmit ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 02:02PM

This is the book:

http://www.amazon.com/Opening-Heavens-Accounts-Manifestations-1820-1844/dp/0842526072

I don't know how anyone could read it and consider it faith promoting. I thought that the authors must be secretly anti and are trying to spread seeds of doubt. It includes every contemporary account of the first vision. It doesn't point out the differences, but they're pretty obvious to those that don't read it with blind faith and awe. It's clear from the accounts that nobody had heard of the first vision until well after the first draft was written in Joseph's journal. There is no evidence that he told his family or anyone else, and there is no evidence that he was persecuted in any sense of the word.

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Posted by: Devoted Exmo ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 05:04PM

They have both the seer stone and the Jupiter Talisman.

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Posted by: popeyes ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 01:42PM

They have all his bullshit.

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Posted by: subeam ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 01:54PM

Oh I would pay them $1 if I could put my face in that head and see the magic for myself.

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Posted by: saintdorothymantooth ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 02:30PM

I would consider giving them 10% of a paycheck for that!

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Posted by: subeamnotlogedin ( )
Date: December 01, 2021 07:48AM

I know this threat is old but I just wanted to show some craziness in Mormonism. Who translates by putting their head in a hat?

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Posted by: s4711 logged out ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 02:06PM

Or his golden plates?

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Posted by: george ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 02:14PM

They have his seer stone. The black hat was probably worn till it fell apart, sort of like certain religions.

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Posted by: popeyes ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 02:37PM

I wonder if any GA has tried out the peep stone in a hat - I would, why not of you believe JS. The only thing in JS's head when he used that peep stone were peep shows of naked 14 year olds.

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Posted by: vh65 ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 02:41PM

I wonder, though, if some of those things went with his family members, not all of who stayed with BY and the main group of Mormons.

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Posted by: sanitationengineer ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 02:49PM

Does the church have JS hat?

Not sure where but I vaguely remember reading something about it ending up in the hands(Paws) of Theodore Geisel's cat. :-)

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Posted by: crom ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 05:00PM

Maybe all the magic was in the hat. Without it, no more revelations.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/25/2013 05:01PM by crom.

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Posted by: utahstateagnostics ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 06:15PM

Rumor has it that if you put it on a snowman, it'll come alive and say, "Happy Birthday!"

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Posted by: dwindler ( )
Date: December 02, 2021 07:14AM

Also, rumor has it that the hat was used to SORT the brethren into the various houses of the priesthood...deacon...elder apostle...etc

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Posted by: The other Sofia ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 06:39PM

There was more than one seer stone that Joseph owned. At least one was said to be a paper weight on the President's desk at the COB. Can't remember when, but it was reportedly, eventually moved to a safe... or so I heard. I would think, if they truly had nothing to hide, it would be on display in the Visitor's Center right next to his Jupiter Talisman and a replica of the Golden Plates. When hell freezes over.

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Posted by: Raptor Jesus ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 06:41PM

Never give up an opportunity to make money off holy relics.

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Posted by: BeenThereDunnThatExMo ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 07:00PM

They probably don't have "the" exact hat that JS used but that wasn't the "magic" anyway...it was the rocks.

But i can guaran-dang-tee you that every night before Tommy Monson goes to bed he fondles that "seer-stone" over and over in an attempt to get it to "light" up somehow!!!

Or so it seems to me...

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Posted by: saintdorothymantooth ( )
Date: July 25, 2013 08:50PM

Oh, I'm certain he's fondling some stones...

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Posted by: Roy G Biv ( )
Date: December 02, 2021 11:20AM

One day while praying in the woods, he took off his hat so he could shove his head up his A$$ and it hasn't been seen since.

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Posted by: messygoop ( )
Date: December 02, 2021 11:40AM

I'm sure it was taken up to heaven just like the phony plates.

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Posted by: Moriancumer the Adulter ( )
Date: December 03, 2021 09:56PM

The community of christ claim to have the hat spoken of by David Whitmer. No pics, display, or many references other than verbal claims from the previous leadership.

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Posted by: Joseph's Myth ( )
Date: December 03, 2021 10:20PM

They have a very nice (scattered) campus around the original Kirtland temple.

Recently The Community Of Christ allowed some original JS papers possibly once held by Emma Hale to possibly go on loan to the LDS church.

Snowman riddles (with big tall top-hat)

What does a snowman eat for breakfast? -- Snowflakes!

What does a snowman eat for lunch? -- Icebergers!

What does a snowman eat for maybe supper? -- Sliders!

and lastly, what is Frosty's official birthday song?

Freeze A Jolly Good Fellow!

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Posted by: cludgie ( )
Date: December 04, 2021 12:13PM

I think they have it all. Back in the 1950's and 1960's, there was a small church museum on Temple Square. I could swear that they had the Jupiter talisman there, but can't confirm it. Anyway, he's Holy Joe, and it's not like they're going to toss anything that was his, no matter how embarrassing. Remember that it wasn't that long ago when they featured is peep stones. Anyway, that's one of the reasons they have the 1st Presidency vault--to hide it all away so that people don't know this stuff.

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