I'm fine in a business setting, but when it comes to people I know personally, I just hate to duke it out with someone, I'd rather just depart.

I actually rarely don't get along with someone, but I need ideas for how to be assertive with my housemate, who, after my talking to the property manager yesterday, I've learned has been a problem for everyone who has lived with her. I'm her 4th housemate in less than 6 months

Maybe I should just go. I don't really think she's going to change. But I signed a lease for another 4 months...and I have dogs and it's really hard to find anything. I've been advertising for a replacement, but nobody's interested and I don't really want to do what the previous person did to me - lie about the situation.

I'm a nevermo, but the cult I was raised in (Pentecostal fundies) has the same message for women - be passive. I've managed to retrain myself in all but the close interpersonal arena. Help.

I FLIPPIN' HATE IT THAT I WASN'T TAUGHT SOME ASSERTIVENESS SKILLS. Any ideas?

I would give anything to be assertive. I never have a problem speaking my mind online (obviously) but in person, I shrink back and avoid confrontation at all costs.

Do you think it's possible to get over this as an adult?

I dunno. I'm better in some settings, but I think I care too much what people think of me. Which is ironic, cause deep inside I don't care at all. It's like a form of programming.

Like you, on the upper layers I care what people think, but down in my core, I couldn't care less.

I think we need to find a seminar or class or something LOL

Agreed. Let me know if you come up with anything.

Ironically, when someone criticizes me, even online, it will bum me out, or make me angry, even if it's justified.

I'm beginning to think it comes from having a critical father. Any of you have the same family dynamic? My brother's the same way as I am, and he hates it too.

yeah, with all the yelling at home and the 'be obedient and nice' at church, I and most of my siblings would pretty much rather dance in cactus than have a confrontation!

Not me. I'm cursed with diarrhea of the mouth. I say what I mean and I mean what I say. If you don't wanna know, then don't ask. Even if you don't ask, I might tell you.

I'm the co-dependent from hell. I hae to fix everyone's problems.

Ron

ExMormonRon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> I'm the co-dependent from hell. I have to fix
> everyone's problems.
>
> Ron


ROFL!

Yes you can learn to be assertive as an adult...I believe the key to it...you really have to like yourself..you need to know that there are many things you can do..maybe not taxes but you can take them to H and R block.

I was raised to believe in myself and what Ithought was important...and that I could do about anything short of some sports...not tall enough...we all know you can't do just anything...

The big thing is to learn to say NO...whenever you darn want to...no excuses...just no I would rather not go on the Field Trip or whatever..

If you know you are going to be in a confrontational situtation practice what you will say...that always helps.

None of us has to hide the fact that we're intelligent, fun..etc...Don't ever do that.

I am the same way, even online. I hate confrontation. It stresses me out before, after, and during. I am normally a very well spoken person, but I freeze up during confrontation and forget what I wanted to say. I wish I had a solution for all of us. :(

There is only so much you can do with a roommate that is incompatible.

Keep pictures, and document infractions. That will help if you end up going to court for any reason. Is she breaking the rules of the apt? Can the managers do anything?

You might be able to negotiate some agreement for the time you are there. Are there some house rules that would solve some of the problems?

Nope- - - - cannot change another person.

She left the basement windows open the other night and the pipes froze and broke, she's been nothing but trouble for the house owners, way before I came.

That was reassuring, but in the meantime...I need to find another place...

SusieQ#1 Wrote:
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> There is only so much you can do with a roommate that is incompatible.

Yup. You can fix/negotiate minor things, but if there is gross incompatibility, there's nothing you can do. Tough it out or get out.

No time like the present to learn new skills.:-)

Here is one of many books... others are listed with this one.

http://www.amazon.com/Did-You-Something-Susan-Communication/dp/080652216X

Something about growning up in the UT culture. I was taught to always please everyone and mostly older folks and those in authority. Thank gawd I never ran into a pedophile. I don't think I would have had the skills to be assertive with an adult.

One of the Agreements that applies to this discussion is
The Second Agreement:
Don't Take anything personally.


http://www.amazon.com/Four-Agreements-Practical-Personal-Freedom/dp/1878424319#_

I hear this...

Still don't have the guts to come out and say I don't believe anymore. Wish I did...it would ultimately make my life less complicated. Well, with everyone except the MIL.

I've become more assertive as I've healed. It isn't always a "good thing." I no longer speak to sisters because I refuse to just go along to get along. I've lost a few friends (and not over mormon issues). I just got weary of just putting up with things to get along or always being the peacemaker.

I really don't miss THEIR drama in my life.

There still are plenty of times I feel extremely vulnerable--my kids can bring me to my knees quicker than anyone, but I quit putting up with bullshit from most other people.

You have to get OK with loss if you truly wish to become more assertive. But at least you find out who truly has respect for you, and who only likes you because you're passive and "nice."

In life any change means losses. But it also means gains, although those usually come after you allow loss to occur. If you can't get comfortable with the idea of loss, get comfortable with the idea of "making more space."

Then practice assertion, see who falls away, see who comes in, and then compare the quality of the relationships.

Sock her in the arm and run away.

The Double Bind

an e-book on the exmormon.org site.

Understanding helps.

for too long.

I finally blew up at her and realized that it was OKAY, even PREFERABLE to make her mad, or scared, or whatever she was feeling about me, just as long as she STEERED CLEAR of me. It made my life a lot better.

Now I look at her as one of the great teachers in my life.

Don't get me wrong. . . . I don't have warm feelings or respect for her. But I really learned something from her that I could NOT have learned from a wise old teacher. I learned that it's okay to get mad when people take advantange or mistreat you. And it's better to have them mad at YOU because you said their behavior is unacceptable than it is for YOU to put up with said behavior and then be mad at THEM because they made your life miserable. THEY are the ones that need to adapt to normal social standards.

Does that make sense? If there is anything you can do to limit her behavior, without starting a war or endangering yourself, then do it. (Do not do this if she's a whack job, or if she high and dangerous).

i.e. if she's partying it up with her boyfriend and disturbing your sleep, interrupt and tell her to keep it down or go somewhere else. You'll get a feel pretty fast for how much you can insist. And it will be great assertiveness practice because who CARES how she feels about you (as long as she doesn't want to hurt you)?

Anyway, good luck. It sucks to have weird roommates.

Most of us come out of the cult with little to no social skills beyond talking to Mormons about absolutely nothing. So sad ..cult cult cult

HAHAHAHA Yup, I was for sure yelling. LOL

Well, here's an update. First, thanks for all the GREAT comments and I'm sorry you all understand so well, it means you've been through it.

Since my housemate had a big drunk a week ago and kept me up all night, things here have been quiet as a tomb. She basically hides in her room when she's here (with her boyfriend, of course, but I don't care as long as they're quiet).

I think maybe she reads this forum. LOL

But next time, I call the property manager and wake them up, that should set well. :)

lostinutah Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> I FLIPPIN' HATE IT THAT I WASN'T TAUGHT SOME
> ASSERTIVENESS SKILLS. Any ideas?


Start small and work your way up. I used to be afraid to ask for sauce for my Chicken McNuggets when they forgot it at McDonalds.

Assertiveness can be gained through trial and error. Being taught helps but you can self teach. I would start by pointing out lease violations your housemate may be breaching to her. If that doesn't fix the situaation just involve the landlord. Either things will be resolved or she will get boted and you can find a new roomie. Roleplaying with a friend might help to prepare you.

Warning rant ahead.

Assertiveness? What a laugh Mormons and anyone that think they arnt affected by thair experianes in the church seem to be uttely incapable of teaching it.

I had my parants on one side of an argument and my brotner and sister on the other half the time the other half the men and the women ganged up on each other and I was piggy in tye middle constantly. Imagine everything you do being watched by all four of them. Two TBMs one jack mo and one strong beleveing atheist. No prase for anything without being taken aside and told it was inapropriate and genraly was stupid. No consistancy. Never being good enough for anyone but if you try please one the others have very strong views its bad. No bounderies so every second theres nothing that isnt seen. Oh and do something that gets to all of them at once and one sees it they all know and all do the little chats away from the others and how that choice is the wrong choice and unacceptable. Then the laughing if trying to keep one happy failes they all laugh.

Add to that a huge ammount of mormon values like swimming costumes are bad the color red is to bright and cheery and slutty oh and all men exept those in your famly will rape you given half a chance. Then the whole haveing to get a proper job thats well paid and this means dong college corses and university corses that are totaly unsuted to me but being told I have to do them when I havent even gotten into secondary school yet(equivilant of highschool for you americans)

Then theres the emotional abuse mainly the truth always being twisted to the point of view of the one of them i'm with at the time and ofcorse which ever one it is is always right to them. Add to that the black and white attitude and the 'i'm always right because the spirit says so' attitude and a big dolop of lots of other emotiional abuse and a bit of phisical.

ah and my dissability thats a fun addition to the mix it means some of them ignroed I had one and ignred the limits I had and got very angry when ever I didnt do somethng right But then theres the others that made up more limits for me just for the attention.

Then the worsed bit the younges in the family has no real rights and gets told what to think what to beleve what to do always and no one can make their mind up. One of the four has desplayed some mental issues so the yongest the fith member of the family can have almost all desigions they dont like put down to mental illness that dosent exist. This woudnt be so bad but when its used to explain away something like a load of bruses from a bra strap being pinged rather hard on a child thats just started to wear bras and other adulsts spotted it and the child totaly truthfuly told those adults 'Mother did it to check I was wearing a bra' when thats explained by mother as a little lie and the older sisters acting a bit funny dont trust what she says and the adults beleve it thats when it gets bad.

Then the lyeing and denieing. If anyone tries to call them out on it they gang up and will say none of them did anything wrong.

Nothing good comes from that and I do know that the church isnt the only place such things happen but it has made it wose in this case and i've spoken with alot of abuse victims that were in similer situations to mine abusers love to pick on the weak and no ones more weak than a blind child. Theres always factors that make things worse and ecsuses they can use but the worsed one to deal with for the affected is those that hide such things behind relegion. Not just openly but useing some of the thinking for it to justify in thair own minds that they are right.

Instead of the church helping me be assertive they told me to basicly stick it out and suffer though. Oh and listen to my family and obay them. When I asked which one I then got ignroed as if I wasnt there exept a pat on the head. Great when your five but do that to an 18 year old and thats got to be the most patronicieng thing a bishop can do. So the church didnt help witht he situation they infact advised me to stay in it.

I am the fith member of that family. Now tell me how i'm meant to be assertive after that?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/05/2011 09:01AM by blindmag.

I was taught to be sweet and never say no to anyone. I have finally found a balance of being assertive.