Nooooo you have it all wrong! See, men are actually inferior to women which is why they have to be in charge of everything. Women can already do the job so in this life men had to be given these responsibilities to learn how and to prove they are capable of doing it. Good women will stand back and allow the men to learn.
One of the things that never ceases to amaze me is how when notes are compared, no matter where we grew up (I assume we were not in the same ward ;-) ) the stories are all the same.
"Women are so spiritual by their very nature they don't need something like the priesthood." Blech!
It totally throws a wrench on the argument that "this is not what the church believes and condones" because it's rampant through the whole thing.
Isn't it oh so interesting that Section 121 of the D&C outs all those geezer bastards? I love the irony of it:
"..but when we undertake to cover our sins, or to gratify our pride, our vain ambition, or to exercise control or dominion or compulsion upon the souls of the children of men, in any degree of unrighteousness, behold, the heavens withdraw themselves; the Spirit of the Lord is grieved; and when it is withdrawn, Amen to the priesthood or the authority of that man.
We have learned by sad experience that it is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority, as they suppose, they will immediately begin to exercise unrighteous dominion.."
atheist&happy:-) Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Since LD$ men have been taught this for > generations, and the culture encourages it, are > they capable of change?
Not as long as LD$ women continue to support the organization, also. It isn't *just* the men--the women are participating in the system, too, or at the least they are consenting to it.
I've always hoped the women would protest and go on strike en masse.
The decisions made by the "leadership" in TSCC, decisions made overwhelmingly by men to cover up abuse, protect abusers, extract tithing from poor widows, etc. disproportionately affect women, and children.
It would be wonderful if the women would stand up, but part of their problem resembles the mistreatment of the poor, the disabled, and gay rights.
Why do we see so much advocacy for gay rights? Because they can advocate for themselves.
The poor struggle every day for a basic existence, and don’t have the luxury to take to the streets in protest, cannot afford lawyers to change laws, and lawmakers pander to the lobbyists of the wealthy. It is the same with the disabled. Their health, and finances keep them from advocating for themselves.
Gay men and women with jobs can afford to take on discrimination, because they have resources (health, money, and independence) that the poor, and disabled do not. When the poor and disabled want rights or even simple obedience to the law they are kicked to the curb, and have far more at stake to lose.
It is the same with women. Women, and children make up much of the poor in the U.S. Women are not going to protest in the streets against a system that keeps them at home dependent on their husbands. The system already has many of them nearly powerless, and if they complain, they will be in an even worse situation.
Maybe the men could man up, and admit they love the power of their exclusive boys' club. They could give it up in support of true equality.
Just from reading this board, I've taken note how much damage mormonism does to men, too, unless you are a narcissist or you are willing to sell your soul for the organization. I know some really wonderful mormon men--but they aren't the ones in the leadership positions and they aren't vying for the leadership positions--they just BELIEVE.
I also see many women in mormonism (like the ones who divorce their husbands for losing their beliefs)--where the organization is THE ONLY THING THAT MATTERS. They'd sell their kids for the organization.
I think mormonism is as damaging to men as it is to women--and you think those wives of the leaders aren't getting some benefit from it? Now Monson's wife looks like she has suffered for her spot. She certainly doesn't look happy.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/19/2011 12:42PM by cl2.
Men DO have the power. Some have more, some have less. Most men in TSCC for any period of time will hold the priesthood, and a calling, no matter how lowly. I am talking about the institution.
My point is not about men never being damaged or hurt, or whether some women may appear to benefit, but that TSCC institutionalizes privilege by its nature - privilege exclusively for men.
Really, would you be saying the same thing if women were forbidden to vote or hold office? Would the men in lowly offices or true believers in democracy be hurting as much as or be as unequal in their standing as the women? No. They would still have one thing the women never had: opportunity, and privilege, for the sole reason of their gender, and that is an extraordinary privilege not given to women. They would have a voice for change, because they could cast a vote. Where are women allowed input in TSCC?
Male privilege hurts a lot of people, and men debase themselves by clinging to their club.
If there are so many great, long suffering men, why do they not challenge TSCC? If they are victims of sincere belief, why not stand up for the abused? They certainly should be able to identify with the abused, and come to their defense, but instead they support the system, because that system does give them a place, and no matter how lowly they are, they are still higher up the food chain than the women.
So women may be brainwashed into divorcing their husbands; the LD$ system of male privilege oversaw their brainwashing.
I said men abuse their privilege, and certainly many suffer, but I am not going to be an apologist for abusers or for patriarchy. They are responsible for their choices, and there is no equality of suffering there.
When it comes to some about being superior and powerful, there is no doubt in my mind which gender has the most power and is superior. All a girl has to do is look between her legs, that settles this issue.
I don't believe that the women have more to lose as it seems as though they have already lost everything. And yes the church does protect cover up and protect the abusers. I am writing the true life story of a friend who was in the Mormon religion. Her 2nd husband was in the Seventies and a very sick man. She left him and took her children to a women's shelter in a different city. When she went to the bishop at the local ward he agreed to assist her financially. She was told to return the next day and when she did she was turned away. The Bishop had called her hometown ward and when he discovered her husband's status there was no more help. She was told to return to her abusive husband.
The 'Good Ole Boys Club' was once again protecting its' image.
The book is discussed in-karasjourneytohealth.wordpress.com
No....and when I told my pastor my dughter was being led by a bunch of lovebombers into Mormonism he said...."I hope she realizes what a male dominated society it is." I thought....NO WAY could she really know. But now I hope she is learning. And I hope she gets the courage to stand up for herself at some point and leave that cult.
Minority men do not benefit so much from male privilege on a global scale, and any look at LD$ leadership reveals a glaring sea of white. They still have male, priesthood privilege in local congregations, and in their own homes.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/20/2011 01:39PM by atheist&happy:-).
This droid has removed his restraining bolt. There are many of us priesthood holders that were nothing more than slaves to the dominors and preditors. I will never again be free labor to someone elses pet project. I will never again be belittled and berated in a priesthood meeting. I will never again be an outomatic drone for someones MLM sceme. I will never again listen to the profit and his pornography speeches. I will never again subject myself to the suposed authority and superiority of a pompus ass. I will take care of my family first and pay tithes from my excess later but not to the TSCC. Family is first church is second. I will never again sit through 3 hours of mind numbing meetings. I will never have to feel guilty about sitting and relaxing.