I would probably still be an active Mormon today if I could have figured out how to be a member of the church and establish appropriate boundaries. I resigned quite awhile ago, but I still see Mormon relatives in the cult who don't seem to have any control over their own lives. They are essentially owned by the local Mormon Bishop and other authorities. It doesn't seem possible to live a free life in Mormon circles.

Christopher Nemelka could help you with that. That's his whole angle.

Of course he's a fraud just like joseph smith. But if your goal is to be "mormon" and have control over your own life, that's a pretty safe way to go. No temple access, though.

Sheesus, why even bother so much with something one doesn't hold in high regard?

MORmONS give up control of their own lives, in support of a lie. What is the appeal for you at this point?

No appeal now. I'm just asking if it is even possible to have some kind of freedom within the Mormon Church as an active member. It seems to me you have to do what you're told or be ostracized, but maybe others have seen something I haven't.

Only one way. Tommy can do and believe anything that he wants because he IS the church.

Is that Christopher person a New Order Mormon? Their site is here: http://www.newordermormon.org/ I don't think we should judge; some people *need* a cultlike existence. That's the reason cults exist. Some people need to baby-step out. Heck, I looked into Unitarian Universalism, Buddihsm, Quaker, you name it, to find a replacement for the cultural chasm escaping a cult leaves behind. Eventually, (5 years now) I came to the happy place I am now, a balance of atheism and humanism that I prefer to simply call real life. Works for me. No judgement given to others (except mormoms, I retain some of my hypocrite ways) and none accepted from others especially mormons. People come here for support (and to argue! LOL) but those that need support can count on us.

Yeah, you can be mormon and do whatever you want. This, my friend, is a thing of beauty. All the other ducklings are in line and expect you to be, too. They never see it coming. Go freaking nuts, go crazy, go to bars, go to strip clubs, drink coffee, curse, whatever your thing is --- do it. Beauty of is no one will know. Should a mormon see you in a Starbucks, what's s/he doing there? See you in a strip club? He's there doing the same thing. I ran amok the last year or so, wearing what I wanted, doing what I wanted, who I wanted, with no one the wiser. First, they are stupid and second, they don't have any special, imaginary friend in the sky tattling on you. Best feeling of all? Gettin' that temple recommend when you know you're a damn heathen. Have a good time! Don't hurt yourself or others. :)

Way to go Boilermaker! Get that temple recommend--tell them the faithful history! A taste of their own medicine.

yeah that's the ticket

He's the guy that published "The Sealed Portion" of the book of mormon a few years ago.

It's a really good read and just goes to show that anybody, and I mean anybody can write scripture if they set their minds to it.

He supposedly used to be in church security and "received revelations in the temple" and even claims to have met joseph smith, moroni, etc etc... just the kinds of things you'd expect someone who is creating their own mormon movement to say.

he's got a pretty big following which is hilarious to me.

BoilerM: Is a bit of sympathy in order here?

IF sister BoilerMaker is economically dependant on tscc... I can understand it a bit.

BTW... they're Not at the point of allowing 'the Evil Bean' at her desk, are they?

As far as sex goes... Sign Me Up!

guynoirprivateeye Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> BoilerM: Is a bit of sympathy in order here?
>
> IF sister BoilerMaker is economically dependant on
> tscc... I can understand it a bit.
>
> BTW... they're Not at the point of allowing 'the
> Evil Bean' at her desk, are they?
>
> As far as sex goes... Sign Me Up!

I don't think I need any sympathy and have no clue what the Evil Bean is! I'm just curious to know if anyone else has seen anyone with any real freedom in the LDS Church. It sounds like some of you have.

The evil bean in another way of saying coffee.

Personally I think you can be an active Mormon on your own terms, to an extent. You still have to put up with other mormons trying to tell you how to live, which for me was a huge negative.

And you have to put up with other mormons tattling to the bishop. Someone just posted a day or 2 ago they were turned in for something they didn't even do and got called to a court of love.

To be fully accepted as one of the tribe you have to attend church at least a couple of times a month. You don't have to sit through SS and PH/RS, but you must be seen in Suckrament meeting.

You must also submit to a calling. You don't have to do it, or at least you don't have to do a good job at it, but you have to accept it. To refuse a calling would put you in the Bishop's cross hairs.

HT/VT. Again, you don't have to do it, in fact few do. You must at least to pretend to care. You're also going to have to make a donation of some money. If you don't pay any tithing at all there's no temple and thus no attending weddings etc.

As others have said, there is no room in the Mormon church for someone who just wants to sit in a pew every week.

Once they get caught it's the naughty corner for them! ;o))

I go to church once a month, eat the kids' snacks during fast and testimony. Never get asked to do visiting teaching. I say no to callings. I say no when asked to give a prayer in Relief Society. I don't care what anyone thinks.
You don't HAVE to obey.
I only keep up my lackluster charade because I am a single unemployed mother that has to live with my parents until I can be financially stable on my own. If I were to come out with my disbelief my children and I would be homeless. It will all end soon though and we will be free of the cult forever.

Ask Marie Osmond and Steve Young.....they might be able to shed light on your question...

I agree with prayershilton, you don't have to do everything that's expected of you.

I can count on one hand the number of times I went visiting teaching within a 10 year period. I've been offered callings which I have turned down because I had no desire to do them. I've said "no" when asked to say a prayer on numerous occasions. And I've turned down talks once or twice.

Maybe once upon a time I might've been guilt tripped into doing things I didn't want to do, but over the years I came to realise that no-one can MAKE me do anything I don't want to do.

So yes, I think one can be a Mormon on their own terms. Know your boundaries and stick to them. Who cares what everyone else thinks!

Just as an aside:

Having played the piano since I was 10, guess what calling I always got offered. I didn't mind so much, but I always made it clear when I accepted the calling what my terms were. If anyone ever expected me to play something in church without warning, I refused. Not that I couldn't do it, I just thought it was rude for people to expect me to play for them without giving me appropriate warning first. I know some pianists wouldn't be bothered by it, but I think it's rude how people think they can snap their fingers and make you jump. Sorry, not me.

The fact the question even has to be asked proves that it would be either extremely difficult or impossible. :)

Some folks try to... I thought about the whole New Order Mormonism before "coming out". There were (and still are) some things about mormonism that I liked (both social and doctrinal). I saw NOM as a solution to my marital problems, but as the re-write of Ron Poelman's talk makes appearant, there is no room in mormonism for anything but absolute devotion and obedience to "the church".

they always appear to me to be people who are skillful in dealing with people, who are self-confident and charming. I don't know of any, however, that stayed thier lives in Mormonism. But when these kind do leave, they leave deftly and don't appear to make enemies.

I was wondering the same thing myself. Maybe slime my way into a reccomend if I, say, offered up 12%.....15%?

My understanding was that every good Mormon ought to be attending the temple regularly.
To attend the temple, and update one's reccommend, one needs to answer a bunch of lame and yet invasive questions asked by several people in different offices (I don't remember which anymore).
So at least once a year a member is called on to honestly state whether they are living up to all the "standards".
Of course, you could always either avoid the temple or lie like a dog in the interviews.
(My edh always chose the latter.)
In my opinion, one can only be a member on one's own terms if one's own terms march directly alongside those of the cult's.

to actually take full charge of your life and faculties.

Boilermaker..... I'm not a Mor, but I found this talk by John Dehlin very informative:

http://www.mormonstories.org/whytheyleave/

What was most enlighting to me was the position of accepting the parts of LDS that you are comfortable with.

This same position in the Catholic world has been classified as being a cafeteria catholic.

Being a cafeteria mormon or catholic isn't acceptable the powers of the church, but it the way many people live with their religions.

in my observation the : "Jack Mormons" and others who are believers, but not actively practicing the religion as far as the Word of Wisdom, for instance. They usually don't pay tithing and don't go to the temple, but they may have at some point.

There is another group that are inactive. My observation that the inactive members have been the bulk of the membership, and as such many have many reasons for not attending and often don't have that emotional attachment/bond to the beliefs.
I think, (this is a guess) that this is the bulk of those that have resigned in the last 10 years. They wanted out for a number of reasons, but didn't know how easy it could be.
(Now it can be done by email!--Finally!)

Some folks are more entrenched. Their emotional attachment and belief to the requirements of the tribe are so ingrained they wouldn't or couldn't conceive of doing things differently.

There are probably as many different kinds of Mormons as there are Mormons! :-)

living Mormonism is a fantasy, so to say whether or not that fantasy is on 'your own terms' is somewhat illusive / imprecise, isn't it?