I know a lot of Mormons are moving back to Zion but a lot of non-Mormons are moving there as well. It's safe to say if the Salt Lake temple wasn't in Democrat controlled metropolitan Salt Lake City, the church would move it's headquarters down to BYU like it did the mission home. It cannot do this because of the temple and so they feel the need to spend billions of dollars buying up and developing everything around the temple to protect it. They are circling the wagons and spending a fortune to do so.

I think the move back to Missouri is long forgotten. If the Mormons moved back they wouldn't be any more welcome than they were in the 1840's. They would make the same mistake moving in, by bossing everyone around and only helping other Mormons while bragging they are taking over.

The reality and the ticking time bomb on Mormonism is there is no longer a wilderness to flee to and the world is moving in. How long can they hold out? Once the Mormons lose political control of Utah, the game is up for them.

++ good!

I think a lot of the Mormons who left Utah for California and other places twenty years ago and are now moving back in, have changed a lot since then. They left as indoctrinated morgbots who grew up in a bubble. Now they have spent ten or twenty years among non-mormons, have become used to other standards, have had access to information on the internet, have become JackMormons, have non-mormon in-laws, etc.

At least that's the case with one Idaho family I know: of their five kids, one moved to California, one to Pennsylvania, and one to Georgia. Those kids have now all come back home, sort of. Not to SE Idaho, which they think is a backwater, but to fashionable neighbourhoods in Salt Lake City.

The one from Georgia says he loves being asked, when he travels, where he lives. When he says "Utah" or "Salt Lake" people tend to ask if he is a Mormon. When he answers "No, but my parents are" people always indirectly praise him for doing the right thing.

So I'm not sure Mormons moving back to Utah means only TBMs moving back to Utah. Though of course you have a lot of those too.

good... I agree

My dad move to CA and raised a Mormon family outside the morridor. After 30 years parents retired to a small Utah town and became far more judgmental and narrow-minded. Too bad.

This has been a phenomenon that started in the mid-80's when Utah began repealing their unitary tax laws. This was a sign that $$$ to the state's coffers were more important than keeping the rif-raff out. Xenophobia has turned to profit making.

Soon thereafter, many companies (including high tech) began moving operations to Utah. Boom, Mormons will eventually become the overwhelming minority about the time California falls off into the ocean or turns completely communist (may already have).

Just sayin'...

Ron

There appear to be plenty more like me. I in a no-man's land between Murray and Holladay, and I am surprised when I run into somebody here who is TBM.

It's not terribly unusual to run into a Mormon, but it is not the norm.

When I moved to Utah in the early 80's,,it was loosing population. You could have bought Provo for taking over payments. It has gained much back in population,,and also lost a lot of the mormon control and influence. It is a much different Utah than in the past.

I have to say that the centroid of Mormondumb seems to be Provo. It's so nice and clean and suburban and the BYU students have the appearance of model citizens. I don't know if BYU is a standout as a institution for higher learning, but it's certainly no slouch. The facilities look great and there is a lot going on there centered on education and higher learning.

To the outsider I don't know that it looks overtly Mormony. There's a lot of t-shirts with Mormon subject matter, but beyond that it looks typically college-like except for a higher rate of young marrieds many of whom have toddlers already.

SLC looked like a real urban city. Not everything there is shiny and new. Not everyone there looked "white and delightsome" like they just got off the boat from Northern Europe. I did hit Temple Square and saw the great and spacious conference center (it has the same funky odor as Mall of America in the Twin Cities - I found that funny) and saw the multi-billion dollar development just to the south of Temple Square. Temple Square does seem like a bit of an oasis in an urban city. It's really the only overtly Mormon thing in SLC. The rest is a typical American city it seems to me.

If you're in the elite Mormon club there can be a lot of attraction for you. It will take care of you and pay you back. We visited with one TBM family in which the father works for a prestigious Mormon law firm. He's definitely in the club and he's doing great by all appearances. I get it, but at the same time I want no part of it. It's probably pretty easy to be a phony and a fake in the heart of Mormondumb and it's probably a lot harder to tell the phonies from the non-phonies.

Came back in 2006 exmo to the max.

How so? Really? Not good for y'all.

...the complaint was that students from California were bringing their un-Utah-like style of Mormonism with them -- more worldly, less uptight. Theologically moderate-to-liberal Mormons, if you will. Tsk tsk tsk.

Mormon diaspora that are returning now probably carry some of the effects of living outside Utah, but they could also be the ones who hated it among the gentiles, and rather than learning to blend, to keep their beliefs and judgments to themselves, they got all hardcore and reactionary. And they could be dismayed when they return to Zion and see everyday Utah Mormonism isn't as wonderful as the idealized version they imagined.

Stray Mutt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ...the complaint was that students from California
> were bringing their un-Utah-like style of
> Mormonism with them -- more worldly, less uptight.
> Theologically moderate-to-liberal Mormons, if you
> will. Tsk tsk tsk.
>
> Mormon diaspora that are returning now probably
> carry some of the effects of living outside Utah,
> but they could also be the ones who hated it among
> the gentiles, and rather than learning to blend,
> to keep their beliefs and judgments to themselves,
> they got all hardcore and reactionary. And they
> could be dismayed when they return to Zion and see
> everyday Utah Mormonism isn't as wonderful as the
> idealized version they imagined.


Hey that was me!!! I was the Cali boy who partied all four years a YBU.

Di you wear a tee shirt that said "University of California in Provo"? I saw a boat load of those when I was attending BYU. LOL

Booze and pot and speed. No problems. Hair touching my collar, sideburns below my ears and a mustache below the corners of my mouth, now that got me in trouble. Haha.

A number of non-native Utah mormons I've spoken with over the years that moved to Utah or Utah county specifically, came with the impression that Utah was going to be as close to the Celestial Kingdom on earth as it was going to get. And those same Mormons have also stated, they would prefer to leave Utah, as soon as possible.

I sure hope more non-mormons, or those who are tolerant and accepting stay. I'm tired of the riff-raff.

Back in the early 90s, I moved to Utah to get married. I was an RM and thought it would be easier to meet a righteous Mormon boy in Zion. I also thought it would be just wonderful living with "my people", which was ridiculous because I liked very few of the Utah Mormons I met at BYU. I couldn't wait to get out of Provo after I graduated. Then I went and moved back and after being on a mission and working in California for a couple of years, I found the Utah Mormons just as awful as ever ... worse than I remembered. I couldn't wait to move home. I had a roommmate once who said she'd never move back to Utah unless Mormons were the minority. Maybe she'll be able to move some day soon.

CA girl Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Back in the early 90s, I moved to Utah to get
> married. I was an RM and thought it would be
> easier to meet a righteous Mormon boy in Zion. I
> also thought it would be just wonderful living
> with "my people", which was ridiculous because I
> liked very few of the Utah Mormons I met at BYU.
> I couldn't wait to get out of Provo after I
> graduated. Then I went and moved back and after
> being on a mission and working in California for a
> couple of years, I found the Utah Mormons just as
> awful as ever ... worse than I remembered. I
> couldn't wait to move home. I had a roommmate
> once who said she'd never move back to Utah unless
> Mormons were the minority. Maybe she'll be able
> to move some day soon.


My wife has an Arizona mormon friend who said she hated the Utah mormons...

Apparently just being mormon isn't good enough for some Utah mormons...You have to be mormon AND live in Utah....

And cancer is the fastest growing cell in the human body.

The Provo-Orem area is certainly overrun with people now. It has grown exponentially since '81 when I moved there. Every conceivable minimum-wage paying chain-store has a franchise there and is full of white-bread clones. All the guys look like Mitt Romney (and me), says my boyfriend. Zero culture and zero diversity. Corporate America mor(m)on-style utopia. No surprise to anyone I guess.

I was offended when, a few years ago, they reopened the state capitol and has a big religious orgy to celebrate it. How in the hell does xtian prayers, a bunch of xtian church choirs and "Battle Hymn of the Republic" have anything to do with state government? It's Right wing and Extreme Right wing.

A couple of years ago I went to Utah for a week to visit my nonmember sibling who lives in an area that's 95% Mormon! I also went to YBU to the Women's Conference for one day just for the sheer hell of it. Yup, Julie Drek was the opening speaker! The area sure has grown but one day there was even too much for me (vomit).

...reached a critical mass of neverMos and exmos. NeverMos seem to be more open to the idea of moving there now.

At my place of employment, we recruit from all over the country. The majority of people who apply for our jobs are Mormons who are tired of living where they are the minority and want to come to Zion wtih their brothers and sisters.

Couples with teens who was their children to meet, date and marry other mormons. Pickins are slim in the missionary field.

Older couples who want to live in Zion and enjoy a lower cost of living (and "serve" the lard).

Maybe it's a last gasp, but mormonism lives strong in Utah County.

...have been popping out as many babies as they can for years, generously adding to their share of the population.

For polygamist groups, Utah is a good state to live in since the Mormon (COJCOLDS) lawmakers, looking forward to their own Celestial afterlife with a plentitude of polygamist wives, are sympathetic to offshoot polygamous groups, turning a blind eye as much as possible.

Utah is a very nice place. There are a ton of outdoor activities that are very close to SLC. SLC is clean for a big city and the cost of living is pretty low for a city of that size. I fully understand why people would want to move there.

The city might be "clean" but the air is some of the worst in the country, especially for the size.

with all the supposed influx of people.

Because I want to recover from the real estate bust.

to have all the country's gays move to Utah and throw the cult out of power completely?

Utah doesn't have enough room for all of America's gays. Better limit yourself to the pink power radicals.

Texas is the fastest growing and California second fastest. Those two states have added close to ten million people in the past ten years, Utah? Maybe a half million? They are growing at a higher percentage than the US population rate is growing though, so maybe in another generation or two they might have more people than the county I live in.

And how much of it is from illegal aliens who DO belong here in the USA??

Rubicon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The reality and the ticking time bomb on Mormonism
> is there is no longer a wilderness to flee to and
> the world is moving in. How long can they hold
> out? Once the Mormons lose political control of
> Utah, the game is up for them.

As a nonmo living in "Zion" with alot of other nonmo's the jig may soon be up on the mormon dominated legislature.

The Leg. in the past had no problems changing Utah's liquor laws. Now when they try and "change" them, they only piss off the non mormons...the ones actually drinking. It's comical to watch the Leg. fall over themselves as they debate releasing more liquor licenses for more resteraunts and bars because the state of Utah is "all out of liquor licenses" based on their antiquated per capita system.

Also hearing state legislators openly debate on the State capitol floor for ALL the see, hear, an/or read...."what does the LDS church think about this???"...has made them the laughing stock of the country..

1. nevada
2. arizona
3. nidaho
4. utah
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
uh oh!!! its twoo!!!
everyone is flocking to Zion for the end of days!!! (cue music)!!! :)