I've been out a long time, but I'm curious because I just got another garment feel up from a cousin at a wedding reception.

What's on the small of the back of garments that people are feeling for when they rub the small of the back?

I've gotten this feel up from numerous relatives for years, and I searched the web, but couldn't find any pictures or descriptions of the back of garments.

My wife thinks I'm paranoid. Both of us are resigned BIC BYU grads, but we were out before we got married.

They're trying to see if you have on an extra layer of cloth. Mormons are so naive that they don't realize most people wear undershirts.

Huh. Maybe I am paranoid about it. Seems like my dad's old style garms had some kind of seam across the small of the back. I was wondering if that was some kind of marker for where to put your hand when you do one of the rituals...

we're being paranoid to assume that's what's going on. Although admittedly SOMETIMES maybe there is such a thing and sometimes when there was no such intent in the first place a TBM might subsequently notice for whatever reason, even though that wasn't their reason.

I've spent my entire adult life outside of Utah after leaving two years after college. I've been to career training courses on team building and dealing with different personalities and note that lots of people are simply the "touchy feely" and emotional personality types. These are the people who will lean over and place a hand on your shoulder when talking just because (for them) it gives a feeling of connecting and improving the communication. Of course for those of us who are introverts this behavior is uncomfortable which is why businesses and such provide the training I went to ... for the "touchy feely" types to hopefully realize that their touching is not always received the way it's intended and for the non-touching types to realize that the touching is often automatic and not intentional but ingrained in the personality type.

I think, what is often perceived as the garment feel-up is often just this sort of automated personal interaction with no ulterior motive at all, except what we perceive. Especially given that a lot of TBMs are the personality types that thrive on emotion and personal contact and interaction in which this behavior could be common.

Along the same lines ... there are often threads here about wearing regular t-shirts to simulate garments (for men at least) and such and how 'normal' people just don't wear them. I also beg to differ on this too. In my 20+ years living outside the morridor I find men wearing t-shirts of varying types to be the norm in many, mostly work, situations. Bottom line, at least here, is that a t-shirt is often the norm for work attire and that's all. We live in a large east coast city where to my knowledge I've never even met a Mormon since we moved here and I've observed t-shirt wearing and hands on the back/shoulder amongst co-workers and since none of them are Mormon it's obvious there's no garment feel up going on or attempt to simulate garments in either case ... sometimes it's just the way people are.

So ... maybe there's a garment feel up going on, but I think a majority of the time it's unintentional and a perception.

There is the normally square back of the garment top camisole covered on the outside by a bra. Many a priesthood leader will pretend to be overtly friendly by placing his hand between the shoulder blades and rubbing the palm around like you're some old friend, whilst trying to figure out if you're wearing The Approved Temple Garment. It's harder to figure out for the men, because so many wear the garment top that has a standard American crew neck. But a lot of guys wear the scoop neck, a dead giveaway. You always see Romney in the scoop neck as if he's trying to signal all the good Mormons. (He probably is.)

You can only see the scoop neck beneath a cheep white shirt. You would think Romney could afford, and would prefer non-cheep shirts if he was trying not to send secret messages.

I honestly can never recall anyone giving me a garment feel up. I do remember working once as a greeter at an attraction at a theme park and seeing a woman going by me and I saw her garment outline and yelled, "Hey there, sister!" She turned around, laughed, smiled, came back and we chatted for a while.

Once I was in a drug store in Sugerhouse. I was smelling the bottles of hand lotion because I cannot stand vanilla smell and half of them, no matter what they say, have a vanilla-ish scent.

Suddenly a store detective grabbed my arm and accused me of... DRINKING the hand lotion! Of course I called her a nutcase, so in front of my stunned family, she forced me to buy the lotion ($13) saying I got germs on it and was going to--what--arrest me? She called the manager..

He looked at me (furious) and made her let me go and I know it was the garments because he said so.

Freaky on two counts!!!

Anagrammy

I think (remem?) the one-piecers had some extra stitches on the back that people could tell whether / not people were wearing.

Yes, it Did Happen.

And my mom's, too, now that I think about it.

I confirmed it by trying on my one piecers. The seam that you use to do your business goes up to the small of the back. But those one piecers were replaced in the 70's, I don't know many mormons that where them.

Yes the one piece garmmies have a a box like thing with seams in the small of the back.

Don't be so sure on who does and doesn't wear that type. a lot of older people still do and even younger ones on occasion. They still sell them.

I'm not paranoid (much) and I totally got the garment feel up last summer while visiting mom. It wasn't just touching, it was touching to determine if I was still wearing the magic. So yes, it does happen and you aren't necessarily imagining things.

Ha! Nice. I'm pretty sure it's a feel up when it happens.

The sp put his arm across my shoulders and was rubbing my arm at about where my garment sleeve would have ended.

I slapped his hand and told him to not ever touch me again. We were in a standing room only foyer. It got so quiet you could have heard a pin drop. I left. I'm sure that got the gossip mills going.

That is correct about the trap-door crotch of the one-piece garment ending at the small of the back.

When I was TBM, I got the sleeve feel-up a lot, and even the back-of-the-bra feel up (where the material bunches up under the tight strap). I wore opaque clothing, and my divorced status created speculation. Good for you, mia! I always back away, and say, "Don't touch me." If it is a woman, I physically take her hand off my arm without saying anything. I had to decide on these specific responses ahead of time. We're always having to SET BOUNDARIES with the Mormons.