Posted by:
dot
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Date: September 10, 2012 07:17AM
D&C 68:4 And whatsoever they shall speak when moved upon by the Holy Ghost shall be scripture, shall be the will of the Lord, shall be the mind of the Lord, shall be the word of the Lord, shall be the voice of the Lord, and the power of God unto salvation.
See also D&C 1:38-39
This is Brigham Young’s justification for saying he never gave wrong council, and every sermon he gave was fit for scripture (once proof-read and edited [which his sermons were -first in church newspaper, then the newspaper versions were re-edited to be printed in Journal of Discourses]).
{edited to add: these scriptures also provide the loophole to say that the 'brethren' must vote on things to decide doctrine, to ward off loose cannons from becoming canon, lame joke, but true. The loophole is "my servants" and "they". The scriptures are in plural form, not singular. I actually don't think it matters. All of Joseph Smith's teachings originated from one man and those who disagreed or dissented were villified or left. What comes about from that state of affairs is a dictatorship of ideas, then later when more reasonable people take over the reigns, there comes a watering down of doctrine - only what they can agree upon - much like the nicene council? But apparently with the input of the spirit so the brethren know they got it right...}
A) the prophet’s and apostles’ teachings are from God when they are moved by the spirit.
B) They must decide when they are moved by the spirit (apparently BY was never off, since all of his sermons are to be considered scripture, similarly, JS was bringing out new ideas all the time, and his ‘doctrinal’ words are almost all considered scripture)
C) the followers must decide if they are moved by the spirit.
Cases where church doctrine has changed (a few among many)
Lectures on Faith # 5 in the school of the prophets: Heavenly Father is a personage of spirit, glory and power [compare D&C 130:22 where the exact same phrase is used - the Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit]... Jesus, the son, has a body of tabernacle, and is called the son because of the flesh .. in him dwells all the fullness of the godhead bodily (1834/5) vs. JSH both Jesus and God the Father have bodies of flesh and bone (1838)
Adam is God the Father (BY, over a span of decades in 1800’s, taught in temple right before his death) vs. Adam God ‘theory’ false doctrine (1980).
Law of adoption (JS) vs. false (or misunderstood) doctrine (Woodruff)
Blood atonement (BY and many others in 1800’s) vs. false doctrine (1900’s)
Peter, James and John came to restore the gospel (1834 ish) vs. Peter, Jacob and John (1843/4 King Follet Sermon JS) (interesting that tidbit wasn’t revealed in JST of bible in 1831)
God will not allow the church to be led astray by false teachings (taught by modern prophets so thought to be Christ’s words) vs. the people actually were taught false teachings (taught by modern prophets - also Christ's words?)
If the prophets and apostles taught untruths while being moved by the spirit (and they believed they were moved by the spirit) then either Christ changed his mind, or lied, or the spirit is unreliable in moving people to speak the Lord’s words.
If we assume that Christ (or an angel) does not change his mind or lie, then we must conclude that the spirit is unreliable.
If the spirit is an unreliable method of relaying truth (as shown by past doctrinal changes in the church) then everything taught by church leaders is suspect AND every follower’s testimony which is gained by the spirit is suspect.
My thoughts that kept me awake all night...
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2012 07:24AM by dot.