Okay, I am ready to be shot down my some of you but know you are an honest bunch even if I might not always like what you say.
You may have gathered from previous posts that I am a bit one foot it one out - confused is a good word. Anyway I feel I need to take a break to have the space to think.
I have great respect for our Bishop and genuinly have good friendships, so felt the need to send the following email to Bishop.
Good idea/bad idea? Or just get a grip Lydia and move on?
Thanks


Bishop

I have started this a number of times and then stopped, but out of love and respect for you and the other members of the ward I felt I needed to finally get around to sending this email.

I intend to step back from church, maybe for a short period or maybe permanently. I can not tell until I do it. I need time to think about how I feel, I hope you can respect this. It could be the best or worse decision that I have ever made - time will tell.

It is actually quite upsetting to feel the need to do this, the church has been part of my life for such a long time and I feel a little lost without it. However, that does not make it right to continue ignoring some of the the things I now know.

I have a great love for some of the members and hope friendships will continue, but, obviously it is hypocritical to continue as church is not really the people but the doctrine, as we are always being told.

Seriously what business is it of his anyway? You don't have to explain yourself to anyone or owe anyone an explanation. If you do, you'll just be giving him power over you (that he already thinks he has anyways) & it will make it harder to just get out and leave. Just my .02

Sometimes that communication is necessary for people's own sanity. I communicated with my bish because we were friends since primary.

Lydia, just know that you're doing this for you, not for him. There's absolutely no chance that he'll support your decision, or lead you in the right direction, so don't count on that happening. I can see your letter is telling him what you're doing, which is good. Don't go asking for advice or answers from him, it'll do you no good.

Mormoney Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sometimes that communication is necessary for
> people's own sanity.

And sometimes non-communication is necessary for a person's psychological and spiritual growth. A person can become too concerned with not upsetting others and not sufficiently concerned with their own well being. Sometimes we should just do what's best for ourselves without seeking the blessing of others -- particularly when the chances of approval are rather small.

It's hard to get perspective when you're in the middle of things. The church keeps members as busy with church stuff as it can. It prevents members from getting a different perspective -- which is the real "sin" the church is trying to prevent.

I stepped away. I got a more complete view of the church. It was like "The Truman Show," but not as well done.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2012 11:27AM by Stray Mutt.

Both Theoutlander and Moremoney make good points. If you hit send, do it for you. But my advice would be to not send it. My feeling is that you are better off keeping as many options open as possible unless/until you decide to resign.

To clarify, I only contacted my bishop AFTER I resigned, and basically gave him a heads up e-mail that he would be receiving my resignation letter. I didn't provide any detail initially, just that my reasons were doctrinal. He did e-mail me back which then turned into a conversation. He was primarily counselling me to keep my faith in JC and all that. I went to tell him about my concerns with the church and my reasoning for leaving. He testified more about JC. He asked me if I was reading my scriptures, praying daily yadda yadda.

Anyway, in a way I was glad to have had the chance to vent to him (I posted my e-mails with him a few weeks back) http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,660490

But in the end, it didn't change anyone's way of thinking. It's kind of like going to your rapist for counselling on overcoming rape. Won't do any good in the end. But in a way, I'm kind of glad I got to vent about it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2012 12:28PM by Mormoney.

It could give them the idea that you are wavering and needs lots of extra support from them. You might get a bunch of people trying desperately to keep you in the church.

In the letter I sense you to be signaling distress or at the least asking for reassurance from the B whether as B or wise, good older friend. It's as if you were walking out onto a ledge (on your way to solid ground) and you reached out to some wall or object to steady yourself. In the physical world that would be sensible and automatic. In this case you are practically inviting him to intervene.

You would do better to deal with this without interested parties chiming in to get you back. Do your thinking, writing, research, in solitude, as it were. Over time (weeks, months) you will become more resolved and confident in whatever viewpoint you settle on.

An anecdote: I was in a bookstore. A woman was there with her little girl, about 5 years old. They briefly separated when the girl wended her way to a shelf where the two were out of each other's sight. The child looks up suddenly and calls, "Mommy, do you still know where I am?"

It's good you wrote this letter out but don't send it, instead put the letter in your journal. Reread it, rewrite it, in a week or two or next year (all for you, not for sending).

It's a great email. Very respectful and succinct
. The part about "doctrine not people" is particularly good.

Where you have "best or worse," you should change it to "best or worst."

I wouldn't push send quite yet...

keep writing though... often... and read it back to yourself.
read it the next day ... track your feelings

kick it around a bit is all. Writing helps me.

I like what you wrote, very clean and no pot shots, respectful, yes.
But as others have said ... they WILL take it wrong lol, sry .. that is the Mo

I understand,

its not easy to live bottled up inside.

DH and I wrote a similar email to our bishop 5 years ago. We ended up handing in our official resignation less then 2 months later... ;-)

One thing though: You probably won't get to keep your TBM friends if you resign. At least, we didn't. It wasn't even because our love and respect for them had changed and we never even tried to talk someone out of TSCC - but we found that their "friendship" was a lot more conditional than we had anticipated.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2012 02:02PM by justcallmestupid.

You completely nailed it...conditional friendships. Whenever someone says, "our friendship is more important than this" it isn't.The need to get out or at least get space has to be worth the anticipated losses. I have an incredible need to explain, justify, validate, get reassurance. Looking back, I often chide myself...Dorothy, what did you expect? Where they going to say, "we love and respect you on this path"? No way. They will react exactly as others have predicted. If this isn't what is wanted--don't do it.

and mine wasn't for the reasons your's is. I still believed--but my life situation was such that I wanted to make sure my life didn't explode in front of the whole ward.

I always planned on going back. I didn't have time to think about whether I believed or not. I was too busy doing things that really needed my attention.

I often tell people who are struggling with their beliefs to take a vacation from it all. For me, after a long vacation, it all fell apart.

We didn't tell anyone when we went inactive--and nobody knew for a long time that my ex had even left. Sometimes it is better to leave it left unsaid--but you have to decide for your own situation.

It really depends what YOU want to do. You mentioned you had one foot in each place. The bishop is 100% bound to pull you back into the morg.

But in overall perspective, I'd say it's good either way for you. My answer from God this time was that I could either choose to stay or leave.
Given this answer, I pondered and understood that all the people I taught or influenced during my mission and life, needed the morg at that time. The morg is one of the best "churches" out there. There are many good and sweet people in it, though we know that the leaders are stringing them along.

This is really your personal journey. If it gives you support and comfort, go ahead and step back. But, the real truth may or may not nag you.

The gulag has lots of sweet people in it, including Puss*riot.

The Nazis had the support and loyalty of lots of sweet people.

I am sorry, but no one "needs" a cult that deprives them of their time, talents and money to serve its own needs. "God" intended you to be an individual using your own conscience and your own compassion to give to the needy, not to turn over your heart and your decision-making --and even your LIFE choices to a group of 15 oldsters who don't even know you!

Now they want our children as young as possible so they can break them before they have a chance to see the options the world offers outside of the mission-marriage-reproduction template they impose on everyone.

The sweet people you see are victims behind a barbed wire fence that they can't see through. Don't excuse yourself by pretending they are happier being slaves. White people tried that argument with slavery arguing against the Emancipation Proclamation that freed Negr* slaves. The argument doesn't hold water for children forced into factory production due to economic pressure, or women forced to accept less money for the same work as men, or Mormons counting on God to bless their children with invisible parenting since they are gone all the time with their multiple callings.

Mormons are human and humans love freedom. The Mormons you meet have been brainwashed that they are low, dirty, sinful and the church is their only chance to get their filthy carcasses of sin and defilement into the presence of God. The joy they feel is the spiritual equivalent of being so grateful and happy that you are no longer being physically beaten. So happy the whip was put away...

Not the same happiness as being free to believe you are actually perfectly fine the way you are, a work in progress, warts and all, but a damn fine person, now is it?

Anagrammy



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2012 12:41PM by anagrammy.

I honestly think you will receive an onslaught of attention from various people trying to convince you to stay.

I was not BIC, but a convert...still I never understood the extent members feel they must reveal everything to their bishop. My protestant upbringing was that my relationship with God was no one else's business. In other words, if I am having doubts and need to take a hiatus, then I just do it, no explanation owed.

Be sure that you are sending it for yourself, not because you think is required of you in some way.

You are in no way obligated to tell the bishop of the plans you outlined. Be sure you understand that.

You mention friends in the church. It seems to me a personal note to each of the friends may be more important than telling the bishop.

Lydia, I'm a nevermo so I might be completely missing the mark here, but if I was you I would ask myself 'why do I even feel the need to inform the bishop of my private thoughts?' If it's from some sort of feeling that 'you should' then IMO, you shouldn't. You are not obligated to inform a pretend authority about your private thoughts.

It's healthy to have privacy and to maintain boundaries to protect it. Lydia, get a grip! ( You said we could say that! :D )



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2012 12:05PM by spaghetti oh.

In my case, I only communicated with the bishop to set boundaries. I told him I did not want any priesthood leader coming to my house other than the home teacher and that was because my wife does mind him coming the one or two times a year he shows up. Determine what you want/need and act accordingly. This type of letter will get you a request for an interview so he can fix you. If that is what you want, go for it. If you want to tell him how you feel and don't want to talk about it, tell him that or you will get pestered to death by him and others. My bishop did exactly as I asked him-.to his credit.

I agree with everything that everybody has posted in reply already. In a big picture way, they all agree with each other. Those that warn you not to send it have been burned by bishops before. They know the church cannot and does not allow for anything other than complete compliance and obedience.

Those that say send it have felt the freedom of making their own choices and doing what they really feel is right, even if it goes against the indoctrination of the Mormon church.

I think it's a nice note and reflects your honest, heartfelt agony. If your bishop responds in kind you'll know he's a good man after all. If he responds as the agent of the church he will only drive you out of the cult faster. Either way, you win.

Give yourself permission to go slow. If the church is true, it will still be true in six months. If it's all a con, it will still be a con in six months. People who really love you will still love you in six months.

lydia, apart from over thinking it, sending the e mail and then asking us for advice 'post action' as it were, I think you did exactly the right thing.

sorry, my bad use of English - not sent, just a draft, stumbling x

Once again you have proved to be kind, thoughtful people.
Thank you all so much. You probably don't know how much you are appreciated x

Damn, that means I'm less witty than I thought... :-(

IMHO, I wouldn't send the Bishop anything. Doing so will prompt numerous visits from several auxiliaries, Home/Visiting teachers etc. Invites to stuff, cookies on the door step etc etc. (You may want all this attention).

Send nothing. Once he notices you haven't been for a while he will ring or call or e mail (or someone will) to say "We notice you've been missing Church..."

To which you reply "I may have been absent, but I haven't been missing it..."

Ta Da!

However, as soon as your Bishop doesn't show you the same courtesy, you should be very firm.

I think we're entering an era of enhanced self-determination, mixed with a greater degree of examination of how much external influence we allow to make our decisions.

As I understand it, this isn't what the Mormon church wants; I'm 'sure' these modern trends are near the top of COB/GA concerns (assumes they've got an ear-to-the-ground). It seems... that most everything that supported TSCC's micro-management of ppls lives is fading if not disappearing from the cultural/social scene.

What do you want the result of your email to be?

The result of this email will most likely be:
- Becoming a ward fellow-shipping project
- An invitation to the bishop's office to discuss your concerns

This may or may not be a bad thing. However if you really want to step away and take a break I anticipate sending this will make people come after you not leave you alone. I honestly think you ought to give yourself a couple more weeks and try to figure out what your stance is before pressing the send button.

p.s. I'm not done with it yet, but I've been working on a website - mormonprobe.com with links that might be helpful to you in figuring things out. It's far enough along that it may be worth a look. (The main reason I decided to create the site is I found I was giving out the same links over and over again here on RFM - the homepage is the list of those links.)



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2012 12:55PM by bc.

If your Bishop has the gift of the Holy Ghost shouldn't he already know the contents of your e mail?

There is no obligation on your part to inform the bishop or anyone of your personal concerns about your religion.
Is it really anyone else's business? They are only going to pressure you to stay with the church.
My view? Keep the bishop out of your personal religious beliefs. I don't think it's any of his business anyhow.

My advise is to not send it. If you need to explain anything, do it verbally following your very specific outline. Avoid a paper or email trail. Written things can come back to haunt you. Only leave hearsay evidence.

If you feel the need to send something, send it. But I would issue this bit of advice. Emails like this without actionable content are useless and will result in an impact opposite from what you are going for. Since you included no actionable content, it reads like a cry for help, a cry for more fellowshipping, etc. My advice would be to include an actionable line, for instance: please do not call or contact me, and please do not send HT/VT or other members. I do not need help, advice or counsel. I will come back if/when I am ready and any attempts by you or the ward to speed up my process will yield an opposite result. Please understand that I am sending this only because I respect you too much to just simply disappear without a word, but I hope you will respect my wishes.

oh, I just realize you already sent it. Well, I guess you'll see what happens. I suspect you sent the equivalent of a request to be the new ward project. Hopefully I'm wrong and they'll leave you alone.

Sorry wittyname, as I explained to stumbling, my bad wording, not yet sent - I appreciate you comments - very helpful x

Oops, I missed your comments to stumbling. Since you still haven't sent it, do try to convey your reasons for sending it in a way that will be satisfactory to you, just keep it in an actionable perspective. It's a win-win! It also gives you something to fall back on if they do disregard your requests. You can show them exactly how/where you articulated your requests for next steps (or lack of, as it were).

Oh, another thing you might want to be prepared for, you might get threatened with requests to sign a resignation in an attempt to scare you into reactivation. You are not required to resign, they can't make you. Do it when you feel comfortable. Don't fall into their trap of reactivating out of fear.

My experience is never admit anything to a church leader. Never Never, no good comes of providing new information to church leaders - in my experiences. They go into "defend the church" mode - he will more than likely tell you that you are wrong and will regret it. If you do tell him, change your message. As your message reads now, it shows weakness that he will exploit. Just don't send it --- just go inactive, relax, enjoy life and sort things out on your terms. In the end, you need to decide. There are a few Bishops out there who would be compassionate and helpful, particularly if they are having struggles themselves. But I have never had one. You owe yourself peace. Good luck.